UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Powered By Google Custom Search Vintage Radio Service Data

Go Back   UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum > Specific Vintage Equipment > Vintage Test Gear and Workshop Equipment

Notices

Vintage Test Gear and Workshop Equipment For discussions about vintage test gear and workshop equipment such as coil winders.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 14th Nov 2017, 8:29 pm   #21
n_r_muir
Hexode
 
n_r_muir's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Edinburgh, UK.
Posts: 289
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

That is a very early Tektronix scope, late 1950's. The diamond shaped badge shows it was supplied by Livingston Laboratories who were the UK agents before Tektronix UK Ltd was set up in 1963 or 1964.
n_r_muir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th Nov 2017, 12:38 pm   #22
ljdavek
Tetrode
 
ljdavek's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Downham Market, Norfolk, UK.
Posts: 61
Smile Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Ok guys and ladies don't want to be sexist lol.. I think it works after much fiddling I got something that look a bit like a trace!!!! So now I'm just a bit worried about the intensity because it right on minimum and is still very bright or is the normal? And do I need to worry about any of the other setting or do you just leave it wants it's set up? There's loads of stuff on the right side I don't know what's for!?

Thanks

Dave..
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_9331.jpg
Views:	56
Size:	30.8 KB
ID:	152286   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_9332.jpg
Views:	62
Size:	30.4 KB
ID:	152287   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_9333.jpg
Views:	62
Size:	62.7 KB
ID:	152288   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_9334.jpg
Views:	68
Size:	58.7 KB
ID:	152289   Click image for larger version

Name:	image.jpg
Views:	59
Size:	30.7 KB
ID:	152290  

__________________
ljdavek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th Nov 2017, 4:20 pm   #23
cmjones01
Octode
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Warsaw, Poland and Cambridge, UK
Posts: 1,711
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

That looks very promising, well done. The trace shouldn't be so bright when the intensity control is at minimum, so there's a fault there somewhere. However, it seems like it doesn't matter too much for now.

As for the other controls, yes, there are a lot of them! When the 545 was new in the 1950s it was quite probably the best and most sophisticated oscilloscope in the world, and had features that had never been seen before. It has, for example, a delayed timebase which can be used to zoom-in on parts of a signal, which I think was a world first at the time. If it was a car, it would be a Rolls-Royce.

Learning to drive it properly will take some time if you are new to oscilloscopes. Reading the manual (see link I sent yesterday) will help a lot, as will the classic Tek document 'The XYZs of Oscilloscopes'. Recent versions have a load of stuff about digital scopes in that you don't need, but the basic principles are sound. This one's a bit older and therefore shorter, but still has lots of digital stuff:

http://w140.com/tekwiki/images/f/f1/070-8690-01.pdf

There may be older versions available from somewhere like the Tek museum, but I haven't looked there.

Chris
__________________
What's going on in the workshop? http://martin-jones.com/
cmjones01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th Nov 2017, 5:49 pm   #24
kalee20
Dekatron
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Lynton, N. Devon, UK.
Posts: 4,254
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Good show!

The controls you have in the photo actually look a bit fewer than the 545a, so that's good news.

These 'scopes had various OUTPUT signals as well as inputs. There's a nice linear sawtooth, and also a pulse, available on output sockets, all buffered from the internal sweep generators. I have only ever used these twice, but it's a nice-to-have on the odd occasions (you can make a crude component curve tracer using the sweep output to progressively drive the component, for instance, while monitoring something else via the normal Y input).

Chris is dead right that at the time, these were the Rolls-Royce of 'scopes. As such, not an ideal first 'scope, particularly as if you don't get what you are expecting, you don't know if it's because you're not driving it properly or if it's because it has a fault. But it is a fantastic scope to possess!
kalee20 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th Nov 2017, 1:59 pm   #25
dave cox
Octode
 
dave cox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Bristol, UK.
Posts: 1,110
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

A very nice scope, a piece of history and still very usable.

You have the differential vertical amplifier in this example. This has 2 inputs, but its displayed as a single trace showing the difference (A-B). This will work as a normal amplifier as well, but it is only single trace and will be somewhat slower that the non-differential amplifiers. It would be nice to find a multi-trace plugin amplifier to go with the scope, these can occasionally be found on the well known auction sites ...

There is a calibration signal generator on the lower right. It will be a good test to connect that to the 'A' input with dc coupling and the timebase set to 1mS / div. Make sure all the RED knobs are turned to their 'cal' position (detent).


dc

Last edited by dave cox; 16th Nov 2017 at 2:09 pm.
dave cox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th Nov 2017, 6:32 am   #26
Diabolical Artificer
Dekatron
 
Diabolical Artificer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sleaford, Lincs. UK.
Posts: 3,088
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

A CA plugin was sold on ebay the other day, would have been just the job.

As stated previously they are tricky to drive, the trigger/stability control can be finicky sometimes to get a trace. The manual is essential reading if you havn't used one much before. Well done for getting it going, these are brilliant scopes and still have a place on the workbench ( a big one) and can do stuff other scopes can't do.

Andy
__________________
Curiosity hasn't killed this cat...so far.
Diabolical Artificer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th Nov 2017, 2:08 pm   #27
ljdavek
Tetrode
 
ljdavek's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Downham Market, Norfolk, UK.
Posts: 61
Smile Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Oh if only yes some plug ins would be lice to have if there any about?? I'm very happy with it now I got it working the manual is a lot of work in itself as I'm not the best reader!!! Would be good to fix the brightness problem though.... hope I can use this to fix a valve radio that has a very odd fault...
__________________
ljdavek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th Nov 2017, 2:47 pm   #28
cmjones01
Octode
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Warsaw, Poland and Cambridge, UK
Posts: 1,711
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

The plugins do come up from time to time though they're not especially common in the UK and are expensive to import because they're heavy.

For single-channel plugins, the types A, B, K and L are probably the most useful basic ones, but I don't see them very often. More common, and useful, are the two channel plugins, types CA, 1A1 and 1A2. To work well in the 545 mainframe they need an external cable from their 'trigger out' connector to the 'ext trigger' socket on the mainframe.

Chris
__________________
What's going on in the workshop? http://martin-jones.com/
cmjones01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th Nov 2017, 10:50 am   #29
ljdavek
Tetrode
 
ljdavek's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Downham Market, Norfolk, UK.
Posts: 61
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Hi all i forgot to tell everyone what the fault was there were 3 wires of the plug in !! There's an anti vibration part in there with valves on and 3 of the wires to it had come away!! So that's was it really.. is there a specific way of cleaning all the switch contacts?

Thanks

Dave..
__________________
ljdavek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th Nov 2017, 6:19 am   #30
Diabolical Artificer
Dekatron
 
Diabolical Artificer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sleaford, Lincs. UK.
Posts: 3,088
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Use Servisol or some other electrical cleaner. You have to be careful with it and not use too much so it drips on PCB's, which the 545 doesn't have, but you get the idea. Pop a rag under said switch when cleaning.

Andy.
__________________
Curiosity hasn't killed this cat...so far.
Diabolical Artificer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd Nov 2017, 3:53 pm   #31
TheAuger
Diode
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Newmarket, Suffolk, UK.
Posts: 2
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

I have 4 500 series scopes and never had probs with capacitors but if you do any soldering on the Ceramic strips/combs please be aware you should use Silver solder other wise you loose adhesion with the ceramic. The fault could be the E.H.T transformer some of these were prone to failure
TheAuger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd Nov 2017, 4:58 pm   #32
Station X
Moderator
 
Station X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Ipswich, Suffolk, IP4, UK.
Posts: 12,779
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

You mean silver loaded soft solder. The melting point of silver solder is way too high for it to be used for soldering connections in 'scopes. I mention this in case someone buys some silver solder and finds it won't melt.

I believe some scopes were supplied along with a coil of the correct solder when new.
__________________
Graham. Forum Moderator

Keep the soldering iron hot.
Station X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd Nov 2017, 8:20 pm   #33
cmjones01
Octode
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Warsaw, Poland and Cambridge, UK
Posts: 1,711
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAuger View Post
The fault could be the E.H.T transformer some of these were prone to failure
A 545 as early as this won't have that problem. It's only the instruments of the late 1960s (especially the 545B, 547 and 549) that suffer failed EHT transformers due to their epoxy potting. Earlier scopes don't use the epoxy potting and don't have this problem. Even my mid-60s 535A is OK.

Chris
__________________
What's going on in the workshop? http://martin-jones.com/
cmjones01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th Nov 2017, 6:30 am   #34
Diabolical Artificer
Dekatron
 
Diabolical Artificer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sleaford, Lincs. UK.
Posts: 3,088
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

I've found a few leaking caps (gunge), the big dual cans, on several 545B's and other 500 type scopes. Also found some of the Sprague coupling caps to be leaky, electrically.

Having had experience soldering these ceramic wafers you can solder with normal 60/40 solder, havn't had any of the tags come loose. This is just touch up work though, I did use some 3% silver solder added into the joint occasionally to be on the safe side. You have to use a very hot iron also. See here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpB5JqGo1co for guidance, it also gives info in the 545 manual.

Andy.
__________________
Curiosity hasn't killed this cat...so far.
Diabolical Artificer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th Nov 2017, 8:05 am   #35
Craig Sawyers
Octode
 
Craig Sawyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Oxford, UK.
Posts: 1,041
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAuger View Post
I have 4 500 series scopes and never had probs with capacitors but if you do any soldering on the Ceramic strips/combs please be aware you should use Silver solder other wise you loose adhesion with the ceramic. The fault could be the E.H.T transformer some of these were prone to failure
On the first point, you need to use tin-lead solder with 2% silver. Definitely NOT lead free solder under any circumstances. The solder that Tek used was tin-lead with 3% silver, but 2% is easily available from Farnell/RS etc and is absolutely fine to use. Do not use just tin-lead, because the silver plating in the ceramic strip notches will dissolve in the solder and that will spoil your day.

Here's a Tek instructional video showing the technique for soldering onto the strips. The oscilloscope at the start is a 545 (not sure if it that or a 545a) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpB5JqGo1co (crossed post - Andy also posted this link)

And secondly the EHT transformers only fail in the much later 545B when Tek moved to epoxy potting. The original 545 and later 545A have EHT transformers which I have never heard to fail, and are wax potted.

Craig
Craig Sawyers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th Nov 2017, 2:53 pm   #36
6AL5W-Martin
Hexode
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Biedenkopf, [Hessen], Germany.
Posts: 293
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

a classic problem part is the little 1000pF what is parallel to the primary coil of the EHT transformer. Also the disc C at secondary side (5nF or 10nF at 2kV or more) have oftenly isolation problems and must be replaced by fresh.
The rectifier tubes 5642 are mostly allready, they have a very long life time.

greetings
Martin
__________________
www.wellenkino.de Vintage Scope restorations
6AL5W-Martin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th Nov 2017, 10:13 am   #37
ljdavek
Tetrode
 
ljdavek's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Downham Market, Norfolk, UK.
Posts: 61
Smile Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Hi guys thanks for all the help so far much appreciated!! So it's probably a leaky capacitor that's the fault with the very bright trace? Any idea what area of the scope that would be? I don't use led free soldier so that's good I guess I will get some of this 2% silver soldier I think..... still looking out for a CA plug in if anyone has one for sale!!

Thanks
Dave...
__________________
ljdavek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st Dec 2017, 4:41 pm   #38
6AL5W-Martin
Hexode
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Biedenkopf, [Hessen], Germany.
Posts: 293
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

when the oldie is complete, there must be a little roll of that silver solder inside !
All tube Tek have this white little roll mounted inside anywhere, different places by Type.

About CA.

Tek 545 is a early model. Later models are 545A.
There was also some differents in the plugins, and scope mobiles also.
The old classic scope mobile what is the "original" for a 545 without A, is the Type 500/53.
The old classic scope mobile what is the "original" for a 545A, is the Type 202 (with tool box and plugins housing for 2 pcs.)

The very old style 2 channels plugin what was typical used in the Tek545 is not the CA, it is the Type "53/54C"
This plugin is very closed to CA, and of coarse the CA will work also perfect in the 545. Bot plugins, the CA and 53/54C run 15 tubes.
There was also some other plugins where the Type name starts with 53/54 , they are all useful for the 545.

greetings
Martin
__________________
www.wellenkino.de Vintage Scope restorations

Last edited by 6AL5W-Martin; 1st Dec 2017 at 5:05 pm.
6AL5W-Martin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th Dec 2017, 7:09 pm   #39
ljdavek
Tetrode
 
ljdavek's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Downham Market, Norfolk, UK.
Posts: 61
Smile Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

Hi does anyone have a circuit diagram for any part of the scope?

Still no luck with plug ins

Dave
__________________
ljdavek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th Dec 2017, 6:16 pm   #40
factory
Pentode
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Cheshire, UK.
Posts: 205
Default Re: Tektronix 545 Oscilloscope fault

A pdf download of the 545 manual (with circuit diagrams) is available from here:
http://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/545
Also the manual for the type D plug-in is here:
http://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/D

David

Last edited by factory; 14th Dec 2017 at 6:19 pm. Reason: extra info
factory is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools



All times are GMT. The time now is 3:38 am.


All information and advice on this forum is subject to the WARNING AND DISCLAIMER located at https://www.vintage-radio.net/rules.html.
Failure to heed this warning may result in death or serious injury to yourself and/or others.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2002 - 2018, Paul Stenning.