Braun RC61 Radiogram MW problems - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

sobell1980 · 9th Sep 2014, 9:55 pm

Hi all,

Have acquired this Braun Radiogram. It was bought in Germany and then imported over here when the family moved. Wondering if anyone can help with some service data for the radio and record player/ wiring diagram. Also if anyone can identify it for me or an equivalent model. The year etc. Any Info gratefully received. I have uploaded some photos.
Dave

sobell1980 · 9th Sep 2014, 9:59 pm

Some more photos.

Nickthedentist · 9th Sep 2014, 10:06 pm

Looks nice, Dave!

You could have a look at the early 1950s models here; http://www.radiomuseum.org/m/braun_d_en_4~year.html

N.

Herald1360 · 9th Sep 2014, 10:14 pm

Looks rather like this one:

http://www.radiomuseum.org/r/braun_m...ukw_mt_55.html

sobell1980 · 9th Sep 2014, 11:03 pm

Great stuff chaps, Nick and Chris. Now where do you think i might get a diagram or data? Is that available from the radio museum too?

The record player is a BSR UA8 (monarch) downloadable from this site. Just the radio diagram needed now. I think mine has a different deck fitted to the one in the link Chris sent.
Dave.

stevehertz · 10th Sep 2014, 8:21 am

Complete with VHF, that gram looks like it will be capable of amazing sound quality - a firm bottom end with volume and clarity for sure. Congratulations!

Herald1360 · 10th Sep 2014, 3:00 pm

RM will provide circuits, but only to paid up members (either money or contributions to their database). It may be possible to find another source online- perhaps try searching on google.de? The valve lineup is pretty common, so other Braun sets with the same line up are likely to have similar circuits, if not layouts.

sobell1980 · 10th Sep 2014, 3:21 pm

How or who do i get in touch with at RM? I dont mind making a donation to help keep these sites running rather than traul the net hoping to get it for free.
Dave.

roffe · 10th Sep 2014, 6:17 pm

This?
http://www.radiomuseum.org/r/braun_mt99rwmt_99_r.html

Since Braun often used a chassis system,your's might use this chassis:
http://www.radiomuseum.org/r/braun_r...ssis_rc61.html

circuit diagram:
http://elektrotanya.com/braun_rc61.pdf/download.html

sobell1980 · 10th Sep 2014, 7:30 pm

Thankyou for your help everyone. I have some more information to help us.
It is definately a Braun MT99R model fitted with a BSR UA5 monarch deck for which i have the service data. It is just the service, repair data i need for the wireless part of the radiogram. I have now found the valve line up.

ECC85 ECH81 EF89 EF89 EABC80 EL84 EM80 . It then goes on to say plus AEG B 250 C 100 or SSF B 250 C 100. Not sure what this means. So im afraid the valve line up is not similar to the rc61. Any further help would be greatly appreciated finding a diagram.
Many thanks,
Dave.

Nickthedentist · 10th Sep 2014, 7:42 pm

Those long codes are the part numbers of the selenium contact-cooled bridge rectifiers employed. They're a flat, silver thing with 4 terminals about 2" x 1" bolted to the chassis. Note that there's no EZ-type rectifier valve in the line-up.

N.

PS You mean UA8, as per your earlier post.

sobell1980 · 10th Sep 2014, 8:07 pm

Thankyou for clearing that up Nick. If anyone else knows where i can locate this data, which i do not mind paying for that would be great. Hoping to sort this one before Christmas to put in the lounge for my wife.
Dave.

AC/HL · 10th Sep 2014, 8:16 pm

B is voltage, C is current, so a B250 C100 translates as 250v 100mA. AEG is just the make.
http://www.radiomuseum.org/tubes/tube_b250c100~2.html

roffe · 10th Sep 2014, 10:00 pm

Dave,the 7 valves in your radio are the same as in the RC61 chassis.

stevehertz · 10th Sep 2014, 10:12 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by sobell1980

How or who do i get in touch with at RM?

If you're a member of RM, downloads of circuit diagrams and data are free. The join up procedure is a bit long winded and idiosyncratic, but stick with it, it works and you're a member after just a few days, and that includes them sending your password by letter post from Germany (or somewhere). Here's the relevant page:

http://www.radiomuseum.org/dsp_anleitung_hilfe.cfm

sobell1980 · 13th Sep 2014, 11:48 am

Thankyou Stevehertz. I shall get signed up this weekend then with RM. I will be able to get my download then. Many thanks all,
Dave.

roffe · 13th Sep 2014, 6:03 pm

My last contribution to this thread,since I don't seem to get through.

Take a look at the table version of this Braun-a 99UKW.
The diagram is said to be RC61.

http://www.tubesound.it/Braun_99UKW_Phono.htm

(note that on a couple of other sites the circuit diagram is said to be RC60.Doesn't really matter much,since RC60,RC61 and RC62 are very similar and all three can easily be found for free on the net).

RM.org is a fantastic source of information-I'm a member since many years-but in this case I don't see what good it would do to become a member if the intention is to get a single circuit diagram,since there is not much to find on the 99-series.

sobell1980 · 13th Sep 2014, 8:06 pm

Roffe, you have a pm.
Dave.

sobell1980 · 15th Feb 2015, 6:08 pm

Hi all.
Work is still continuing and it all went back together this morning thinking it was complete.
The deck has been overhauled and all freed off, the auto changer works very well and this Braun produces amazing sound.

However, on test it appears I have no medium wave. other than that everything is working splendidly. Lots of stations on FM, good strong radio 4 without the use of an extension aerial and even some stations on short wave.

Selecting MW i can hear plenty of hiss that sounds like the same on LW but no stations. I have tried a piece of wire hooked up to the broadcast aerial socket then attached to my window frame and still nothing. The only thing I have not tried is an earth to the aerial earth socket. I would of thought I would have picked at least Absolute radio up with the extra aerial. I then got my signal generator out and around 460 khz i can hear the generated tone through the speaker, so the local oscillator is working on MW. Am I missing something obvious. The radio part of this radiogram is identical to the Braun RC61 of which I have the circuit diagram for. I could do with testing the signal at various positions on MW with the sig gen but I have the diagram but no service data on alignment . I could work back then and see where MW is being lost. If anyone could help? I also find the circuit diagram a little hard to understand without the descriptions.
It all looks very unmolested and original so I don't think it has been got at. I was hoping not to hear the LO not working on MW as i could of sorted it but I am a little baffled as the rest of the circuit all works other than MW. Many thanks,
Dave.

TrevorG3VLF · 15th Feb 2015, 6:45 pm

No, your test does not show that the oscillator is working, just that some part of the IF stages is working but you know that from LW.

To check the oscillator, listen for it on another radio, 470kHz above the station the radio is tuned to or measure the oscillator grid voltage, it should be a volt or two negative.

9th Sep 2014, 9:55 pm	#1
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Braun RC61 Radiogram MW problems Hi all, Have acquired this Braun Radiogram. It was bought in Germany and then imported over here when the family moved. Wondering if anyone can help with some service data for the radio and record player/ wiring diagram. Also if anyone can identify it for me or an equivalent model. The year etc. Any Info gratefully received. I have uploaded some photos. Dave Attached Thumbnails Last edited by sobell1980; 9th Sep 2014 at 10:01 pm.

9th Sep 2014, 9:59 pm	#2
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Some more photos. Attached Thumbnails

9th Sep 2014, 10:06 pm	#3
Nickthedentist Dekatron Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Oxford, UK. Posts: 17,864	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Looks nice, Dave! You could have a look at the early 1950s models here; http://www.radiomuseum.org/m/braun_d_en_4~year.html N.

9th Sep 2014, 10:14 pm	#4
Herald1360 Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 16,536	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Looks rather like this one: http://www.radiomuseum.org/r/braun_m...ukw_mt_55.html __________________ ....__________ ....\|____\|\|__\|__\_____ .=.\| _---\__\|__\|_---_\|. .........O..Chris....O

9th Sep 2014, 11:03 pm	#5
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Great stuff chaps, Nick and Chris. Now where do you think i might get a diagram or data? Is that available from the radio museum too? The record player is a BSR UA8 (monarch) downloadable from this site. Just the radio diagram needed now. I think mine has a different deck fitted to the one in the link Chris sent. Dave.

10th Sep 2014, 8:21 am	#6
stevehertz Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Rugeley, Staffordshire, UK. Posts: 8,834	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Complete with VHF, that gram looks like it will be capable of amazing sound quality - a firm bottom end with volume and clarity for sure. Congratulations! __________________ A digital radio is the latest thing, but a vintage wireless is forever..

10th Sep 2014, 3:00 pm	#7
Herald1360 Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 16,536	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. RM will provide circuits, but only to paid up members (either money or contributions to their database). It may be possible to find another source online- perhaps try searching on google.de? The valve lineup is pretty common, so other Braun sets with the same line up are likely to have similar circuits, if not layouts. __________________ ....__________ ....\|____\|\|__\|__\_____ .=.\| _---\__\|__\|_---_\|. .........O..Chris....O Last edited by Herald1360; 10th Sep 2014 at 3:17 pm.

10th Sep 2014, 3:21 pm	#8
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. How or who do i get in touch with at RM? I dont mind making a donation to help keep these sites running rather than traul the net hoping to get it for free. Dave.

10th Sep 2014, 6:17 pm	#9
roffe Hexode Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Linkoping, Sweden Posts: 493	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. This? http://www.radiomuseum.org/r/braun_mt99rwmt_99_r.html Since Braun often used a chassis system,your's might use this chassis: http://www.radiomuseum.org/r/braun_r...ssis_rc61.html circuit diagram: http://elektrotanya.com/braun_rc61.pdf/download.html

10th Sep 2014, 7:30 pm	#10
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Thankyou for your help everyone. I have some more information to help us. It is definately a Braun MT99R model fitted with a BSR UA5 monarch deck for which i have the service data. It is just the service, repair data i need for the wireless part of the radiogram. I have now found the valve line up. ECC85 ECH81 EF89 EF89 EABC80 EL84 EM80 . It then goes on to say plus AEG B 250 C 100 or SSF B 250 C 100. Not sure what this means. So im afraid the valve line up is not similar to the rc61. Any further help would be greatly appreciated finding a diagram. Many thanks, Dave.

10th Sep 2014, 7:42 pm	#11
Nickthedentist Dekatron Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Oxford, UK. Posts: 17,864	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Those long codes are the part numbers of the selenium contact-cooled bridge rectifiers employed. They're a flat, silver thing with 4 terminals about 2" x 1" bolted to the chassis. Note that there's no EZ-type rectifier valve in the line-up. N. PS You mean UA8, as per your earlier post.

10th Sep 2014, 8:07 pm	#12
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Thankyou for clearing that up Nick. If anyone else knows where i can locate this data, which i do not mind paying for that would be great. Hoping to sort this one before Christmas to put in the lounge for my wife. Dave.

10th Sep 2014, 8:16 pm	#13
AC/HL Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Heckmondwike, West Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 9,642	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. B is voltage, C is current, so a B250 C100 translates as 250v 100mA. AEG is just the make. http://www.radiomuseum.org/tubes/tube_b250c100~2.html

10th Sep 2014, 10:00 pm	#14
roffe Hexode Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Linkoping, Sweden Posts: 493	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Dave,the 7 valves in your radio are the same as in the RC61 chassis.

13th Sep 2014, 11:48 am	#16
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Thankyou Stevehertz. I shall get signed up this weekend then with RM. I will be able to get my download then. Many thanks all, Dave.

13th Sep 2014, 6:03 pm	#17
roffe Hexode Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Linkoping, Sweden Posts: 493	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. My last contribution to this thread,since I don't seem to get through. Take a look at the table version of this Braun-a 99UKW. The diagram is said to be RC61. http://www.tubesound.it/Braun_99UKW_Phono.htm (note that on a couple of other sites the circuit diagram is said to be RC60.Doesn't really matter much,since RC60,RC61 and RC62 are very similar and all three can easily be found for free on the net). RM.org is a fantastic source of information-I'm a member since many years-but in this case I don't see what good it would do to become a member if the intention is to get a single circuit diagram,since there is not much to find on the 99-series.

13th Sep 2014, 8:06 pm	#18
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Roffe, you have a pm. Dave.

15th Feb 2015, 6:08 pm	#19
sobell1980 Octode Join Date: May 2011 Location: Bromyard, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 1,241	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. Hi all. Work is still continuing and it all went back together this morning thinking it was complete. The deck has been overhauled and all freed off, the auto changer works very well and this Braun produces amazing sound. However, on test it appears I have no medium wave. other than that everything is working splendidly. Lots of stations on FM, good strong radio 4 without the use of an extension aerial and even some stations on short wave. Selecting MW i can hear plenty of hiss that sounds like the same on LW but no stations. I have tried a piece of wire hooked up to the broadcast aerial socket then attached to my window frame and still nothing. The only thing I have not tried is an earth to the aerial earth socket. I would of thought I would have picked at least Absolute radio up with the extra aerial. I then got my signal generator out and around 460 khz i can hear the generated tone through the speaker, so the local oscillator is working on MW. Am I missing something obvious. The radio part of this radiogram is identical to the Braun RC61 of which I have the circuit diagram for. I could do with testing the signal at various positions on MW with the sig gen but I have the diagram but no service data on alignment . I could work back then and see where MW is being lost. If anyone could help? I also find the circuit diagram a little hard to understand without the descriptions. It all looks very unmolested and original so I don't think it has been got at. I was hoping not to hear the LO not working on MW as i could of sorted it but I am a little baffled as the rest of the circuit all works other than MW. Many thanks, Dave.

15th Feb 2015, 6:45 pm	#20
TrevorG3VLF Rest in Peace Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Matlock, Derbyshire, UK. Posts: 1,378	Re: Identification of Braun Radiogram. No, your test does not show that the oscillator is working, just that some part of the IF stages is working but you know that from LW. To check the oscillator, listen for it on another radio, 470kHz above the station the radio is tuned to or measure the oscillator grid voltage, it should be a volt or two negative.