Thorens TD125 and SME 3009 help

[Chief Brody]

Good afternoon.
I've got hold of a Thorens TD125.
It appears to be in pretty good condition but is clearly quite old.
The cartridge is in bits and it has a Swiss plug on it.
My question may seem a bit obvious but I have not been able to find the answer on the internet!
Is anyone familiar with these machines? Where do the phono leads connect? I have had a look underneath and cannot find anything obvious.
Do they require specialist leads?
Can anyone help? Are there any other things I should be aware of with these units?
Thanks

[Radio Wrangler]

The phono leads connect to the arm... and that depends on which arm is fitted to your TD125.

Many came with Thorens' own arm fitted but a lot were bought without arm so that (usually) an SME 3009 arm could be fitted.

Since then, the audio world went crazy over moving coil cartridges and high mass arms, so almost anything could have been fitted subsequently.

Post a photo so the arm can be identified.

I can't remember what mains transformer tappings the TD125 has, but it needs checking. It might be set to 220v

The TD125 is one of the first turntables with an electronically driven motor, so the power supplies should take care of things, but getting the voltage setting right avoids things getting hotter than necessary.

David

[Goldie99]

Hi - I'm not familiar with the Thorens, but you'll probably be able to find a lot of the info you'll need at the following link - you'll need to register, but it's free.

https://www.vinylengine.com/library/thorens/td125.shtml

Alan

[Chief Brody]

Thanks for the replies.
It's a SME 3009 tone arm. I've added some pics.

I can see the plug at the bottom where the Cable would fit. I've had a quick look on eBay for a phono lead to fit this and I've found some RCA converters, but they don't look like they would fit into the socket I've shown in the 3rd pic. Can anyone suggest where I can get my hands on one of these.

I've also got the headshell in bits. I need to try and put it back together.
It comes with a cartridge but I've no idea what condition it is in.
Can't seem to find much info in regards to replacements

I really want to try and get this up and running again!

[vidjoman]

That is a standard fitting used by SME years ago. The player should have come with the lead attached but it looks like it's been recently removed, as it's clean, and sold separately.
I've seen them with RCA type (phono) sockets as a conversion.

[Goldie99]

You can see a good (clear) example of what the (SME) plug looks like if you search eBay for "Early SME 3009 Arm Cable (short lead)"... but be seated before checking the price.

I understand they're very hard to even find now, which presumably explains the price, so you may need to either make something up, or find a conversion / rewire option.

Maybe also worth checking with wherever you bought the deck ? maybe it was just forgotten / misplaced ?

[Chief Brody]

I got the deck from my uncle who bought it from Switzerland in the 70's and has barely used it since.

I'm checking with him about the cable, he's pretty old and lives miles away which is not great but fingers crossed.

Yeah, those leads do seem a bit pricey!

I've seen RCA adapters, but these look like re wiring / soldering will be involved and that kind of thing scares me as I'm rubbish at it!

It's annoying as I want to check that everything works ok first before I throw any money at it, but I don't think I'm going to be able to do that without throwing money at it

Still, it's cost me nothing so it's got to be worth pursuing!

I'm going to have a stab at piecing together the headstock and cartridge that are in bits in a bag tonight. Wish me luck!

[Edward Huggins]

This is definitely worth throwing money at, especially with that SME arm!

[Craig Sawyers]

The nearest equivalent SME arm (the M2-9R, which has vertical races rather than knife edge) is currently well over £2k. Has an identical removable perforated headshell to the 3009.

Now you can't get that sort of money for an old 3009, but that is not the point. With the right cartridge they take an awful lot of beating.

Your uncle must have the lead stashed somewhere.

Craig

[Chief Brody]

Hello.
I am guessing the headshell is missing a nut and bolt to make a pair for the one that is present.
The second picture I am guessing is the cartridge. Is that right? Cannot make out the model, it looks a bit past it! Can anyone tell me what this is and if it can be replaced?
The third picture is the stylus right? I can't see how this would have ever fit. It's probably been bought in error and is not compatible. Anyone recognise what it is?

I am pretty out of my depth here. From what you see, what is needed to make a complete unit? Any advice would be most welcome!

Thanks

[Radio Wrangler]

You have one mounting screw, one spacer and one nut. You do indeed need two of each of these. Whether the spacers are needed depends on the height of the cartridge and the height of the record on the platter in relation to the height of the arm mounting. You want things set up so the arm tube is level with respect to the record surface, when in use.

SME sold kits of glass-loaded nylon low mass screws. Pundits said they couldn't possibly exert enough pressure or be stiff enough. If you listened to records, not pundits, they were fine

David

[Mark_RR]

Your SME tonearm also seem to be missing the bias (anti-skating) weight. This is a small weight that hangs on a piece of thread over the hoop sticking out from the side. Look at pictures in this link to see what i mean

http://www.analogue-classics.com/htm...09___3012.html

Without this, the arm should not be used as it will mistrack and damage records.

You correctly identified the cartridge and stylus. I would not use a old stylus of unknown condition even if it did fit the cartridge. A worn stylus will damage records quickly. You can buy a basic Audio Technica cartridge for very little, but the arm and turntable deserve something much better and much more expensive. However, the first priority is getting the missing bits sorted out.

[Goldie99]

I don't know them, but you do have 'Analogue Seduction' just outside Peterborough, who stock SME parts, as well as various cartridges incl. Audio Technica, and who seem to have a good reputation online at least.

https://www.analogueseduction.net/

Just a thought - might it be worth giving them a call & discussing it ? - there's a good chance they'd be able to just take a quick look and tell you immediately what's missing / needed, and if you've never set up a turntable before, possibly even help get it set up & running.

It would obviously depend upon budget, but as others have said, it's a quality turntable & arm, so it deserves a little tlc...

Alan

[Chief Brody]

Thanks all.
I have the weight. Didn't have a clue what it was at first!
I'll check out Analogue Seduction.
Great!

[Bufo Bill]

Analogue Seduction are good guys, definitely see if they can help.
Regards from Bill.

[dtvmcdonald]

I have that turntable and arm, bought and working perfectly since 1977.

The connector tends to be flaky in these. Its usually easier just to remove it and
attach more (very thin) wire, connected to a terminal strip itself connected
to permanent leads to the amplifier.

You really do have to get that little counterweight (anti-skating) properly
attached, not dragging on its string, and set correctly.

My turntable had its suspension slowly sag so that the turntable dragged.
There are adjustment screws for the springs to fix that.

That was a very high-end combo in its day and still excellent. I have the original
Shure V15-IV cartridge and its original needle, plus modern a replacement
V15-III needle, and both sound equally excellent. Back it its day there were
rousing debates about whether the III or IV type needles sounded better.
Either work with the V-15 type IV body.

Complete instruction (including setup) manuals for the arm do exist on the Web.
I had to pay a small amount for one. You probably should get one.

One problem is that the belt that runs the turntable sometimes starts to
flop off at startup. New belts are sold, or you can cobble up something
to prevent that, as at least on mine, after startup it runs in the right place
correctly.

[Craig Sawyers]

A lot of old bits are still available from SME. Talk to Elaine Wrattan there - she is very helpful. The screws and nuts certainly are - but don't try to use them with cartridges with tapped threads! Cartridge tapped threads are M2.5, but the SME screw/nut pairs are a weird American gauge coarse thread.

They can also provide you with a manufacturing date for your arm by sending them the serial number (on the underside of the bedplate).

I agree that Analogue Seduction are a great place though. Very helpful.

Craig

Craig

[joebog1]

I agree with the above comments about 3009 arms. I have been using them since the 1970's and would not change for anything. They track superbly and at a very small weight with the Shure V15. Sound is excellent. Setting the arm up takes time and patience, but with time and careful adjustment you have one of the best. Its complete rebuild instructions are available on thevinylengine.com.
That site also has lots of information for using different carts. BUT the ultimate match is a V15.

You have scored beautifully!!
congratulations

Joe

[Chief Brody]

Hello again.
After waiting for a new phone cable for the tonearm, cartridge and needle to arrive, today I was in a position to plug everything in and try the equipment out.
The good news it everything worked!
The bad news is there is a hum when the power is on and the volume seems low compared to my Beogram 1203.
Can anyone help me out with suggestions of what might be the issue?
Thanks

[vidjoman]

Have you earthed the arm? There is a 5th connection for that which is the clip held in with one of the screws beside the arm connector.