Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

brymac · 27th Jul 2021, 1:01 pm

Help! I've done the usual thing of getting the easy bits of this deck apart to lubricate and clean, but in the course of removing the idler wheel arm assembly, one end this spring popped off and I cannot for the life of me find wher teh other end goes from the excellent exploded diagram I have tracked down - see attached!

Grateful if somebody who has had one of these apart could put me out of my misery please!!!!

Many thanks,

Bryan

ms660 · 27th Jul 2021, 2:02 pm

Wrong end of the mech.? Spring number 64 ?

Lawrence.

brymac · 27th Jul 2021, 2:12 pm

Nope - I thought that too, but spring 64 is sitting happily in its correct place.

And I can't see anything similar on the schematic......

brymac · 27th Jul 2021, 2:25 pm

Hi Mike - I think your Rule B8 edit was a bit unfair; this is not a schematic which is on Paul's collection (all of which I have bought, together with all his other publications!). I wouldn't have put it on if it was....!!!

Reinstate the link please? It's only there to help folks help me sort this out....

Ta,

Bryan

ms660 · 27th Jul 2021, 2:42 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by brymac

Nope - I thought that too, but spring 64 is sitting happily in its correct place.

And I can't see anything similar on the schematic......

Parts diagram for the Philips 22CG036/72 shows one:

https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/philips_22gc03672.html

Lawrence.

Cobaltblue · 27th Jul 2021, 2:47 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by brymac

Hi Mike - I think your Rule B8 edit was a bit unfair; this is not a schematic which is on Paul's collection (all of which I have bought, together with all his other publications!). I wouldn't have put it on if it was....!!!

Reinstate the link please? It's only there to help folks help me sort this out....

Ta,

Bryan

Hi Bryan
Is this not the same then ?
https://www.service-data.com/product...47/6003/m14647
Cheers

Mike T

G6ONEDave · 27th Jul 2021, 3:15 pm

Looking at the Philips AG1025 service manual, it appears that the wrong area is being shown in the attachment. There is a similar spring wire (item 104) going between items 102 and 106. It's in the bottom right of the exploded parts drawing on page 12 of the manual. You want the drawing area that contains the 2 push buttons and the toggle lever.

Dave

brymac · 27th Jul 2021, 4:23 pm

First things first - I have got the humble pie out of the fridge, Mike, and must apologise. It is indeed in the latest amalgamated version I have of all Paul's service sheets and is in fact much more helpful (and clearer) than that which I had downloaded from Vinyl Engine. Sorry and thanks...

Dave - I think you're correct about it being 104, although I am still not sure what it is doing pushed though the hole on the baseplate lug as shown in my photo above.

Armed with the clearer diagram, I'll go back to it and have another look....

Bryan

ms660 · 27th Jul 2021, 4:34 pm

You can see spring "104" under the chassis and your spring on top of the chassis in these photos, different deck number but similar layout, Post#1 and Post#18 respectively:

https://radio-bastler.de/forum/showthread.php?tid=8034

Lawrence.

brymac · 27th Jul 2021, 4:56 pm

Brilliant! Thanks Lawrence - post 18 indeed shows that I have got one end of the spring in the correct place - all I need to do now is find out where the other end goes....!! Not evident from the photo, sadly.

And this spring is nowhere to be seen in any of the service manual diagrams......??

But think I'm getting there!!!

Bryan

ms660 · 27th Jul 2021, 6:35 pm

So far as I can make out that spring should be doing the same job as the un-numbered coil spring shown in the manual that connects between the bottom hole of the upright chassis tag and the hole that's in the upright part of pivoted arm numbered 25 (the end nearest to the platter bearing) In other words pushing that arm towards the upright pivot that's to the right of the arm in your photo.

Lawrence.

brymac · 27th Jul 2021, 7:02 pm

You mean spring 24 on the attached diagram?? So at some point a small coiled spring was replaced by the one which has been puzzling me??

ms660 · 27th Jul 2021, 7:04 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by brymac

You mean spring 24 on the attached diagram?? So at some point a small coiled spring was replaced by the one which has been puzzling me??

Yes, so far as I can make out, apologies for the lack of number mix up.

Lawrence.

brymac · 27th Jul 2021, 11:19 pm

Nope - that small coiled spring (24) is there on mine...!

Bryan

brymac · 27th Jul 2021, 11:23 pm

Ah - I understand the confusion now! I had removed spring 24 in order to photograph the "U" shaped spring underneath it! That's why it looks like it's missing in the photo - but now I've reinstated the idler wheel assembly, spring 24 is back in place back in place but I'm still left with not knowing where the other end of the "U" shaped spring should go. I tried to join the German site I was linked to, but failed the "are you human?" questions as I don't speak German!

G6ONEDave · 28th Jul 2021, 10:10 am

I don't have time just now but when I return I'll post the correct part of the diagram that shows exactly where the problem spring 104 fits, which is 4" away on the drawing from the area shown.

Dave

brymac · 28th Jul 2021, 10:17 am

Thanks Dave...

Here are some more precise photos with the dangling end of the spring clearly visible - but I am still not convinced that it is 104.....that section of the diagram is also attached....

Bryan

ms660 · 28th Jul 2021, 10:37 am

One end of spring 104 connects to the sliding bracket that selects the idler height, you can see that end of the spring in the photo in the link I posted earlier, the other end connects to the pivoted arm underneath, here's the photo again, the end of the spring is left of center on the sliding bracket:

https://radio-bastler.de/forum/attac...humbnail=65424

https://radio-bastler.de/forum/attac...humbnail=35402

Lawrence.

brymac · 28th Jul 2021, 5:36 pm

Sorry that this is becoming such a saga and I am so grateful for your patience, but I'm afraid that "my" spring isn't part 104. If you look at the photo attached, you'll clearly see part 104 with a red arrow on it and my "rogue"spring with a pink arrow on it. "My" spring doesn't appear on the diagram, but does appear on the photos Lawrence kindly sent me from the German site. Anybody speak German

ms660 · 28th Jul 2021, 5:45 pm

So in your photo which spring is your spring 24 that you said yours had?

Lawrence.

27th Jul 2021, 2:02 pm	#2
ms660 Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 13,454	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Wrong end of the mech.? Spring number 64 ? Lawrence.

27th Jul 2021, 2:12 pm	#3
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Nope - I thought that too, but spring 64 is sitting happily in its correct place. And I can't see anything similar on the schematic...... Last edited by Cobaltblue; 27th Jul 2021 at 2:15 pm. Reason: Compliance with rule B8

27th Jul 2021, 2:25 pm	#4
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Hi Mike - I think your Rule B8 edit was a bit unfair; this is not a schematic which is on Paul's collection (all of which I have bought, together with all his other publications!). I wouldn't have put it on if it was....!!! Reinstate the link please? It's only there to help folks help me sort this out.... Ta, Bryan

27th Jul 2021, 3:15 pm	#7
G6ONEDave Octode Join Date: Dec 2019 Location: Owston Ferry, North Lincolnshire, UK. Posts: 1,701	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Looking at the Philips AG1025 service manual, it appears that the wrong area is being shown in the attachment. There is a similar spring wire (item 104) going between items 102 and 106. It's in the bottom right of the exploded parts drawing on page 12 of the manual. You want the drawing area that contains the 2 push buttons and the toggle lever. Dave __________________ Quote "All is hyperthetical, until it isn't!" (President Laura Roslin, Battlestar Galactica) Last edited by Cobaltblue; 27th Jul 2021 at 3:29 pm. Reason: Compliance with rule B8

27th Jul 2021, 4:23 pm	#8
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery First things first - I have got the humble pie out of the fridge, Mike, and must apologise. It is indeed in the latest amalgamated version I have of all Paul's service sheets and is in fact much more helpful (and clearer) than that which I had downloaded from Vinyl Engine. Sorry and thanks... Dave - I think you're correct about it being 104, although I am still not sure what it is doing pushed though the hole on the baseplate lug as shown in my photo above. Armed with the clearer diagram, I'll go back to it and have another look.... Bryan

27th Jul 2021, 1:01 pm	#1
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Help! I've done the usual thing of getting the easy bits of this deck apart to lubricate and clean, but in the course of removing the idler wheel arm assembly, one end this spring popped off and I cannot for the life of me find wher teh other end goes from the excellent exploded diagram I have tracked down - see attached! Grateful if somebody who has had one of these apart could put me out of my misery please!!!! Many thanks, Bryan Attached Thumbnails

27th Jul 2021, 4:34 pm	#9
ms660 Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 13,454	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery You can see spring "104" under the chassis and your spring on top of the chassis in these photos, different deck number but similar layout, Post#1 and Post#18 respectively: https://radio-bastler.de/forum/showthread.php?tid=8034 Lawrence.

27th Jul 2021, 4:56 pm	#10
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Brilliant! Thanks Lawrence - post 18 indeed shows that I have got one end of the spring in the correct place - all I need to do now is find out where the other end goes....!! Not evident from the photo, sadly. And this spring is nowhere to be seen in any of the service manual diagrams......?? But think I'm getting there!!! Bryan

27th Jul 2021, 6:35 pm	#11
ms660 Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 13,454	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery So far as I can make out that spring should be doing the same job as the un-numbered coil spring shown in the manual that connects between the bottom hole of the upright chassis tag and the hole that's in the upright part of pivoted arm numbered 25 (the end nearest to the platter bearing) In other words pushing that arm towards the upright pivot that's to the right of the arm in your photo. Lawrence. Last edited by ms660; 27th Jul 2021 at 6:40 pm. Reason: extra info

27th Jul 2021, 7:02 pm	#12
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery You mean spring 24 on the attached diagram?? So at some point a small coiled spring was replaced by the one which has been puzzling me?? Attached Thumbnails

27th Jul 2021, 11:19 pm	#14
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Nope - that small coiled spring (24) is there on mine...! Bryan

27th Jul 2021, 11:23 pm	#15
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Ah - I understand the confusion now! I had removed spring 24 in order to photograph the "U" shaped spring underneath it! That's why it looks like it's missing in the photo - but now I've reinstated the idler wheel assembly, spring 24 is back in place back in place but I'm still left with not knowing where the other end of the "U" shaped spring should go. I tried to join the German site I was linked to, but failed the "are you human?" questions as I don't speak German!

28th Jul 2021, 10:10 am	#16
G6ONEDave Octode Join Date: Dec 2019 Location: Owston Ferry, North Lincolnshire, UK. Posts: 1,701	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery I don't have time just now but when I return I'll post the correct part of the diagram that shows exactly where the problem spring 104 fits, which is 4" away on the drawing from the area shown. Dave __________________ Quote "All is hyperthetical, until it isn't!" (President Laura Roslin, Battlestar Galactica)

28th Jul 2021, 10:17 am	#17
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Thanks Dave... Here are some more precise photos with the dangling end of the spring clearly visible - but I am still not convinced that it is 104.....that section of the diagram is also attached.... Bryan Attached Thumbnails

28th Jul 2021, 10:37 am	#18
ms660 Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 13,454	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery One end of spring 104 connects to the sliding bracket that selects the idler height, you can see that end of the spring in the photo in the link I posted earlier, the other end connects to the pivoted arm underneath, here's the photo again, the end of the spring is left of center on the sliding bracket: https://radio-bastler.de/forum/attac...humbnail=65424 https://radio-bastler.de/forum/attac...humbnail=35402 Lawrence. Last edited by ms660; 28th Jul 2021 at 10:57 am. Reason: link added

28th Jul 2021, 5:36 pm	#19
brymac Hexode Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 389	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery Sorry that this is becoming such a saga and I am so grateful for your patience, but I'm afraid that "my" spring isn't part 104. If you look at the photo attached, you'll clearly see part 104 with a red arrow on it and my "rogue"spring with a pink arrow on it. "My" spring doesn't appear on the diagram, but does appear on the photos Lawrence kindly sent me from the German site. Anybody speak German Attached Thumbnails

28th Jul 2021, 5:45 pm	#20
ms660 Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 13,454	Re: Grundig/Philips AG1025 spring mystery So in your photo which spring is your spring 24 that you said yours had? Lawrence.