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Old 1st Jan 2021, 7:59 pm   #761
AndiiT
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Hi, I knew there was something I had to post on this thread eventually This was spotted in the historical market town of Guisborough, North Yorkshire.

Looking at it, my guess would be that it originally pointed at the Pontop Pike (BBC Channel 5) and Burnhope (Tyne Tees Channel 8) transmitters in Newcastle and Durham respectively, although looking at the dimensions of both aerials Holme Moss and Emley Moor are also possible candidates.

Andrew
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Old 2nd Jan 2021, 11:37 am   #762
Peter.N.
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Looks as though its pointing to some underground transmitter now.

Peter
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Old 2nd Jan 2021, 10:50 pm   #763
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Looking at it those aerials they look to be horizontal polarisation which means they would be for Pontop Pike and Burnhope.
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Old 3rd Jan 2021, 9:30 am   #764
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Re post no. 761:

I agree with Hybrid tellies, a CH B5 and B8 Horiz polarised pair. To my eyes it looks as if the dipole is missing on the CH 5 aerial; also no evidence of downleads.
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Old 13th Jan 2021, 1:16 pm   #765
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Hello to all,

if anyone is interested in foreign vintage TV antennas, you can upload here the French Portenseigne 1970 catalogue. The company was a major player of the era.

There are useful charts listing signal level conversions, transmitter locations & channels, etc.
Lots of VHF Band I and III models are shown.
The document is a 16.7Mb pdf.

https://sd-6.archive-host.com/membre...-_oct_1970.pdf

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Old 13th Jan 2021, 2:20 pm   #766
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Lots of interesting, and indeed useful stuff here - the laws of physics were not repealed when we ‘went digital’

Merci beaucoup Jerome

Rgds to all
John
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Old 13th Jan 2021, 2:48 pm   #767
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Thought you might like this one. I don't know the location.
The aerial rigger must have taken one look at that chimney and decided it was safer to wall mount it. John.
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Old 13th Jan 2021, 4:44 pm   #768
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Also that roof looks very steep and dangerous to go climbing about on .
I think the rigger made the right decision !
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Old 14th Jan 2021, 9:43 am   #769
Peter.N.
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Not easy attaching fittings to flint walls - I know, I live in a flint house. Easier now we have SDS drills but you had to get a fixing to the mortar in the olden days.

Peter
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Old 14th Jan 2021, 3:20 pm   #770
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Re post no. 765.

jhalpen - thank you very much for the catalogue .pdf. I see it gives dimensions as well as performance info - fascinating stuff for me! Especially the F2 aerials - how did they get the bandwidth??...
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Old 14th Jan 2021, 3:22 pm   #771
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Re post no. 767:

Looks like an earlyish Belling and Lee, Channel B1.
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Old 14th Jan 2021, 5:40 pm   #772
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

That French catalog is a wonderful insight into different-thinking when compared to UK TV antenna-design.

In particular - quite a few of the designs have provision for a ferrite sleeve-balun to be fitted in the junction-box at the feedpoint. I've never seen that on any UK antenna.

Also the combined BIII/UHF antennas are something I can't ever remember seeing here.

[Probably because our BIII and UHF transmitters weren't always co-located]
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Old 14th Jan 2021, 8:41 pm   #773
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Hi to all,

I'm glad that some readers liked the Portenseigne 1970 TV antenna catalogue.

More television antenna data in this archive repository.
12 pages of scanned documents interspersed with text.

See some pretty crazy antenna rigging, a 1963 transistorized field strength meter (weighing a ton) & lots more.

http://www.tvnt.net/forum/archives-d...es-t38057.html

Big Thanks ! to friend kiki37 who initiated the archive.

Best Regards
jhalphen
Paris/France
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Old 14th Jan 2021, 11:18 pm   #774
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by G6Tanuki View Post

Also the combined BIII/UHF antennas are something I can't ever remember seeing here.

[Probably because our BIII and UHF transmitters weren't always co-located]
Not common, but they do exist.
I knew where to look for this one as I was brought up in the house next door

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.5251...7i13312!8i6656
Winter Hill
Horizontal Group C* UHF and vertical Ch 9 (or more likely wideband covering 9 (ITV) and 12 (BBC1)

*I am guessing this was erected before groups C & D became combined.
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Old 15th Jan 2021, 11:54 am   #775
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Re post no. 774:

Yes indeed. Antiference and J-Beam certainly sold them - and possibly others. They were most appropriate for two transmitters: Winter Hill, as already mentioned by rambo1152, and Belmont where Group A and CHs B7 (ITA) and B13 (BBC) were the channels. Antiference sold them in two sizes: a 3 EL(Band III) and a 5 EL. Indeed there were two versions: an earlier one with a UHF folded dipole (Winter Hill ) and a later Trumatch dipole for both areas.

These were areas where the BBC had duplicated their BBC1 service onto Band III because of SpE interference problems which affected reception of CH B2 from Holme Moss.
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Old 15th Jan 2021, 11:42 pm   #776
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveCG View Post

These were areas where the BBC had duplicated their BBC1 service onto Band III because of SpE interference problems which affected reception of CH B2 from Holme Moss.
Not to mention getting the correct "Look North" from Manchester, rather than the other "Look North" from Leeds carried by Holme Moss.

It took the BBC some time to see sense, and rename the Manchester programme "Look Northwest"
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Old 16th Jan 2021, 1:12 pm   #777
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

I heard of someone's gran who kept watching Look North from Holme Moss for years after the BBC's North West service moved to Winter Hill. I presume she missed the announcements of the change, or reception on channel 12 wasn't good where she lived.
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Old 16th Jan 2021, 7:19 pm   #778
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard_FM View Post
I heard of someone's gran who kept watching Look North from Holme Moss for years after the BBC's North West service moved to Winter Hill. I presume she missed the announcements of the change, or reception on channel 12 wasn't good where she lived.
That was normal in the Manchester area when I lived, and worked in the trade.

If you already had a combined Band I/III aerial for channels 2&9, the Manchester local news & weather opt-outs provided insufficient incentive to upgrade to one that covered channel 12, consequently many viewers never got a decent ITV picture from WH until they upgraded to UHF.

Also, this may sound bizarre, many VHF tuners placed 2 & 9 next to each other which the viewer found convenient and might not be ****ed to clunk round to 12 even if reception was good.

I had quite forgotten that some Thorn 1400's had the "U" position in-between 2&9, that would have placed a lot of unnecessary strain on the system switch and solenoid circuit.
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Old 16th Jan 2021, 10:35 pm   #779
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

That's an interesting tuning dial with the channels laid out like that!
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Old 16th Jan 2021, 11:20 pm   #780
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Default Re: 405-Line VHF Aerials 2013 to the present day.

Quite a few manufacturers tried to pair the Band I and III channel numbers for the main transmitters.
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