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Old 18th Apr 2018, 1:01 am   #21
jamesperrett
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

Does anyone else remember a Readers Digest flexidisc promoting a box set of re-recorded big band songs? The whole disc consisted of comparisons between the originals and the better sounding re-recordings.
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Old 18th Apr 2018, 3:05 am   #22
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

I had one of those flexidisc and I thought the sound of this throw-away was rather good for what it was. It still didn't entice me to buy the set, as it wasn't original.
I guess, I'm one of the wealthy persons that bought the CEDAR processed big band CD sets. Benny Goodman, Glen Miller, Harry James and Tommy Dorsey and they do sound excellent.
They're sourced from the Czech republic.
I do listen to them a lot.
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Old 18th Apr 2018, 8:02 am   #23
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

Quote:
Originally Posted by wd40addict View Post
Just to add some science attached picture shows the response of the three files under discussion.
Yes, Hylton Lazybones has a weird frequency response. I suspect that doing a new transfer with a decent system would produce much better results.

Here's another Jay Wilbur:
Jay Wilbur, I cover the waterfront
The record is very lacking in bass but the result doesn't sound too bad. I still prefer the Artie Shaw version though.
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 1:15 pm   #24
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

Have added 'I cover' to the attached responses graph. Actually pretty similar to 'Miss Otis' and presumably cut on the same equipment. Considering Rex were one of the second division companies their equipment seems to have been pretty good.

Of the tracks we've analysed the Hylton has the most 'plummy' response, and that's been been deliberately added in the re-mastering.

If Ted Kendall's reading this thread it would be interesting to know his thoughts.
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Old 21st Apr 2018, 10:45 pm   #25
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

Unlike many other members, perhaps, I first heard the Dance Band Records of the 30s on a wind-up gramophone when a Child in the late 1940s/early 1950s, and in fact continued to listen to records on a gramophone, including the then new ones, until the late 1950s, and even into the early 1960s. Records included some by Jack Payne, Jack Hylton, and other bands, including Primo Scala, Troise and his Mandoliers, Sidney Torch, etc. For some years now, I have been trying, without success, to find on CD or LP, Jack Hylton's recording of 'When it's Springtime in the Rockies,b/w 'Around the Corner', Jack Payne's 'You're gonna be Young', and others first heard almost 70 years ago on 78s.
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Old 22nd Apr 2018, 8:58 am   #26
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

Quote:
Originally Posted by wd40addict View Post
Have added 'I cover' to the attached responses graph. Actually pretty similar to 'Miss Otis' and presumably cut on the same equipment. Considering Rex were one of the second division companies their equipment seems to have been pretty good.
When I first processed Rex8001 I assumed that the lack of bass was because it was early days and they hadn't worked out how to get a decent bass response. Rex8002 already sounded better. I don't have Miss Otis but maybe it was just a Jay Wilbur problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 'LIVEWIRE?' View Post
For some years now, I have been trying, without success, to find on CD or LP, Jack Hylton's recording of 'When it's Springtime in the Rockies,b/w 'Around the Corner', Jack Payne's 'You're gonna be Young', and others first heard almost 70 years ago on 78s.
The original 78s are still available if you search for those titles on Ebay. If you have no way of playing them I'm sure you'll be able to find someone to transfer them to CD for you. If all else fails I could do it for you.
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Old 22nd Apr 2018, 10:49 am   #27
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

Thanks, Stuart, but you have slightly misunderstood my post. I actually still have a number of the 78s in question -they're out on loan at the moment - and I have a Revelation Silvertone auto-changer on which to play them. What I've been trying to find for several years now, is re-issues of those and other similar records on CDs or LPs. Somewhere in this thread there is a link to a site from where 78s can be downloaded, so maybe some of the titles in question are available there, and I can download them to my MP3 Player. As an aside, I no longer have a wind-up gramophone, nor do I particularly want one, but sometimes like to play 78s on the auto-changer, even those I have either on CD or Cassette, simply to hear the music the way most of us did in the 50s & 60s.
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Old 22nd Apr 2018, 11:36 am   #28
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

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you have slightly misunderstood my post. I actually still have a number of the 78s in question.
I didn't realise that you already have the records. In that case you just need to digitize them, which is all that they do when they release them on CD. Something like a Behringer UFO202 would do a reasonable job without it costing the earth or a UMC202HD if you want to spend a bit more.
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Old 23rd Apr 2018, 12:02 am   #29
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

I'd probably do a little more than just a straight transfer if I was preparing these for release on a newer format. I would certainly remove any clicks and pops and reduce the surface noise as much as possible. A typical track would take at least an hour or two to process and possibly more.
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Old 23rd Apr 2018, 7:24 pm   #30
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

A lot of pre war 78 dance band material was issued, in generally good, transfers to LP in the 1963 - 1980 period .

For example World Records SH210 Jack Jackson; SH167/8 Carroll Gibbons,SH140&172 Henry Hall; SH177&178 Lew Stone; SH127&190 Jack Hylton;SH141 Billy Cotton; SH215 Geraldo; SHB21 Ambrose; SH1078221 Ray Noble/Al Bowlly.

Ace of Clubs "Treasury" series ACL1147 Lew Stone.

Over the past few years I have found a number of these LPs in charity shops and dingy second hand bookshops. Usually at low prices 99p ea at Oxfam recently and the surfaces have been in virtually mint condition. ( Always examine carefully first though )
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Old 29th Apr 2018, 5:52 pm   #31
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

Bit of a weird question but does anyone hail from the era of these bands and can they tell me if the bands did go for the bass emphasised sound in real life - in other words sounded like the records or radio. I can recall hearing a pair of radio singers (my Brother and I) who did strive for that sort of smooth plummy sound and George Melly for example, but I'm too young to have heard the 40's and 50's bands live.
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Old 29th Apr 2018, 6:03 pm   #32
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

I take "in real life" to mean live performances? Well, most performances of that era were pretty much purely acoustic, no amplification, so when you ask "did they go for that sound", in truth they didn't have much, if any control over it. The overall sound balance being a function of the room acoustics + people. But in general, yes, it was a 'mellow era' as us vintage wireless enthusiasts know only too well when you listen to AM on a vintage wireless. Saying that, in a live situation the cymbals at least would have surely had more impact than they do on many records where they're often virtually inaudible - hence my thread.
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Old 29th Apr 2018, 6:13 pm   #33
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

Thanks for that stevehertz - that was exactly what I was curious about as I never heard a big band live in that era - I heard a couple over here in NZ in the very early 70's but they used amplification and did not sound like the 50's ones.
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Old 3rd May 2018, 9:39 am   #34
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

The bands deliberately played louder for broadcasting, and, I suspect, for recording.
The best material to start from, if you are looking to make transfers to more modern formats, is vinyl pressings from 78rpm masters.
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Old 3rd May 2018, 8:48 pm   #35
jamesperrett
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Default Re: Big Band records - plummy sound

If you want to hear something close to how they would have sounded it would be worth going to see The Squadronaires. As far as I know they stick fairly closely to the old arrangements and the only amplification is for the vocals (or at least it was when I saw them a few years ago).
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