Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it - Page 2 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

ricard · 19th Sep 2016, 3:19 pm

I think it was the first generation of Philips kits that used hardboard. I had an EE2003 from the late 70s, and the board was definitely (blue) plastic, but using the same spring clip system. The nice thing I thought with the Philips was that you for the most part used unmodified components (i.e. not mounted on any special inserts or plugs) - only the transistors were mounted on small PCB's as their leads were too short - actually, while this was true for the kit I had with silicon transistors, I believe the earlier kits with germanium transistors took advantage of the long leads of those components.

As for prototyping I favor copperless veroboard, I can basically mount the components as I would on a PCB, and use leads (or stiff wire) to interconnect them. If needed, I run (insulated) wires on the top of tbe board as well. Very practical for one-off projects. Have never done any HF work and it probably wouldn't be ideal there as there is no ground plane whatsoever, although I used to build 8-bit microprocessor systems in this way, which worked fine.

Junk Box Nick · 19th Sep 2016, 3:20 pm

I still have my Philips EE kit. I originally thought that the cards that you mounted on the board were 'printed circuits'. (Well they did show the circuit and were printed - probably by offset lithography or perhaps letterpress!)

Peter88gate · 19th Sep 2016, 5:44 pm

Cir-kit has been discussed before in 2012, see my post here https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...9&postcount=11 with an image of a sample supplied with Practical Electronics.

Peter

Cobaltblue · 19th Sep 2016, 5:59 pm

Did build a couple of small projects with it in the early 70's ISTR but it was far more trouble than it was worth Vero-board was a much easier option.

Did use it to replace missing tracks on early PCB's with reasonable success but no more so than using wire

Cheers

Mike T

dseymo1 · 19th Sep 2016, 7:31 pm

I suppose its main advantage is that very quick lash-up prototypes can be made by literally following the circuit diagram with the tape and soldering components in position. No PCB design of any sort required.

MrBungle · 19th Sep 2016, 8:06 pm

Or go deadbug and don't even have to tape it out

Sideband · 19th Sep 2016, 11:00 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cathy_vintage

From Ash: Anyone remember 'Cir-Kit'

Yes...I remember it. Sorry to say it was rubbish. Both myself and my brother attempted to build a couple of featured circuits with it. We sort of succeeded but the end result was not very satisfactory and it didn't stick very well....!

Much preferred Veroboard and I still use it.

cathy_vintage · 20th Sep 2016, 3:57 pm

Anyone used this 'press-n-peel' stuff for prototype PCB's. Seems to get good feedback on the Rapid Electronics site. They also sell the copper strip -self adheasive like 'Cir-kit' but 5mm wide foil.

https://www.rapidonline.com/press-n-...k-of-5-34-4450

https://www.rapidonline.com/rapid-ct...-x-50m-34-0636

Radio Wrangler · 20th Sep 2016, 4:10 pm

Wainwright minimount.... now that was the good stuff!

David

TonyDuell · 20th Sep 2016, 4:22 pm

Yes, I used Wainwright board for prototyping some high-frequency stuff (ADCs running at 50MHz, with the appropriate input amplifiers, etc) in my work about 25 years ago.

It was very nice, but expensive, and I found I could do just as well using normal PCB (unetched) for the ground plane and little 'mounts' made from postage-stamp sized bits of verroboard, stuck down (copper side up) with double sided tape. The Wainwright striplines looked nice on paper but didn't seem to work for me.

GeoffK · 20th Sep 2016, 5:34 pm

Still got a couple of reels left over from the PW 12+12 Amplifier I built that still works though hasn't been switched on for a while. Cir-kit still sticky still useable.

jimmc101 · 20th Sep 2016, 6:57 pm

There was also a Cir-Kit that made PCB repair kits, I've just dug this one out of the back of a cupboard.
the copper pads were not self-adhesive, they used a liquid adhesive plus activator.
The small containers on the left contain tubular rivets (Griplets).

Jim

Craig Sawyers · 20th Sep 2016, 7:06 pm

That brings back (horrid) memories!

The thinnest you can easily get now is 5mm.

But now for prototypes, and even in a box for finished stuff I'm a dead bug man.

The king of the dead bug was the late great Jim Williams of AD. Have a look at the photos at the end of this http://cds.linear.com/docs/en/applic...note/an74f.pdf

And then read the note to see what he was measuring, how it was done - and then look at the dead bug layout again with deep respect!

ms660 · 20th Sep 2016, 8:34 pm

Yes, street cred for that one.

Lawrence.

suebutcher · 21st Sep 2016, 2:15 am

Ouch! That hurts my eyes to look at.

ionburn · 21st Sep 2016, 7:27 pm

I remember the Cir-Kit stuff. I cannot remember if I ever had any, but was not impressed.

I had a Philips EE kit, and still have some of the bits (transistor boots and the LDR although it's escaping me at the moment as to where it is). I also have the manual somewhere.

Although I have used printed circuits, both etched and hand cut, I prefer to use Veroboard (or good equivalent). I have usedit for years. I tend to work directly from the schematic, juggling layout in my head as I solder my way across the board. I like to use one of the large strips, and cut it off (scribe and snap then file edges) when I have completed the circuit. These large strips usually suffice for several circuits as I modulise my designs. The main exception here is when designing with logic circuits (especially things like microprocessor or other typically high pin number chips). It is like art in that results improve with experience.

TonyDuell · 21st Sep 2016, 7:58 pm

Maplin used (a couple of years ago) to sell an FR4 (fibreglass) substrate stripboard with tinned copper tracks. It was lovely to work with (provded you didn't need a ground plane for high frequency work). Alas they have discontinued it, and I have never seen it anywhere else. Does anyone know of a supplier. I am running out...

I agree with ionburn. For 1-off circuits I can have it soldered up on stripboard in less time than it takes to design a PCB. I never really plan the layout, just start soldering, and somehow it all fits and works...

Herald1360 · 22nd Sep 2016, 12:50 pm

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/stripboards/0434627/

If you're feeling flush?

I like single side copper clad matrix board, if I can get it. Copper side up, Vero spot cutter where legs go through and hardwire on bottom side. Ground connections leave hole as is and solder to copper.

MrBungle · 22nd Sep 2016, 1:24 pm

They do cheaper ones: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/stripboards/5230666/

I always solder myself into a corner on these or spend way too much time planning the things so I gave up on them. Usually i'll build something point to point/deadbug and make a PCB if I feel it deserves it. I haven't made a PCB for about 10 years now

TonyDuell · 22nd Sep 2016, 1:27 pm

Thanks for that. I think that this one :

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/stripboards/5185932/

is the same as the one Maplin used to stock. I will try to remember to add some to my next order...

19th Sep 2016, 3:19 pm	#21
ricard Octode Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Lund, Sweden Posts: 1,632	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it I think it was the first generation of Philips kits that used hardboard. I had an EE2003 from the late 70s, and the board was definitely (blue) plastic, but using the same spring clip system. The nice thing I thought with the Philips was that you for the most part used unmodified components (i.e. not mounted on any special inserts or plugs) - only the transistors were mounted on small PCB's as their leads were too short - actually, while this was true for the kit I had with silicon transistors, I believe the earlier kits with germanium transistors took advantage of the long leads of those components. As for prototyping I favor copperless veroboard, I can basically mount the components as I would on a PCB, and use leads (or stiff wire) to interconnect them. If needed, I run (insulated) wires on the top of tbe board as well. Very practical for one-off projects. Have never done any HF work and it probably wouldn't be ideal there as there is no ground plane whatsoever, although I used to build 8-bit microprocessor systems in this way, which worked fine.

19th Sep 2016, 3:20 pm	#22
Junk Box Nick Octode Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: West Midlands, UK. Posts: 1,571	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it I still have my Philips EE kit. I originally thought that the cards that you mounted on the board were 'printed circuits'. (Well they did show the circuit and were printed - probably by offset lithography or perhaps letterpress!)

19th Sep 2016, 5:44 pm	#23
Peter88gate Tetrode Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: London, UK. Posts: 85	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Cir-kit has been discussed before in 2012, see my post here https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...9&postcount=11 with an image of a sample supplied with Practical Electronics. Peter

19th Sep 2016, 5:59 pm	#24
Cobaltblue Moderator Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Exeter, Devon and Poole, Dorset UK. Posts: 6,859	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Did build a couple of small projects with it in the early 70's ISTR but it was far more trouble than it was worth Vero-board was a much easier option. Did use it to replace missing tracks on early PCB's with reasonable success but no more so than using wire Cheers Mike T __________________ Invisible airwaves crackle with life or at least they used to Mike T BVWS member. www.cossor.co.uk

19th Sep 2016, 7:31 pm	#25
dseymo1 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Shropshire, UK. Posts: 3,051	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it I suppose its main advantage is that very quick lash-up prototypes can be made by literally following the circuit diagram with the tape and soldering components in position. No PCB design of any sort required.

19th Sep 2016, 8:06 pm	#26
MrBungle Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: London, UK. Posts: 3,687	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Or go deadbug and don't even have to tape it out

20th Sep 2016, 3:57 pm	#28
cathy_vintage Pentode Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Willerby, East Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 191	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Anyone used this 'press-n-peel' stuff for prototype PCB's. Seems to get good feedback on the Rapid Electronics site. They also sell the copper strip -self adheasive like 'Cir-kit' but 5mm wide foil. https://www.rapidonline.com/press-n-...k-of-5-34-4450 https://www.rapidonline.com/rapid-ct...-x-50m-34-0636

20th Sep 2016, 4:10 pm	#29
Radio Wrangler Moderator Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Fife, Scotland, UK. Posts: 22,858	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Wainwright minimount.... now that was the good stuff! David __________________ Can't afford the volcanic island yet, but the plans for my monorail and the goons' uniforms are done

20th Sep 2016, 4:22 pm	#30
TonyDuell Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Biggin Hill, London, UK. Posts: 5,208	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Yes, I used Wainwright board for prototyping some high-frequency stuff (ADCs running at 50MHz, with the appropriate input amplifiers, etc) in my work about 25 years ago. It was very nice, but expensive, and I found I could do just as well using normal PCB (unetched) for the ground plane and little 'mounts' made from postage-stamp sized bits of verroboard, stuck down (copper side up) with double sided tape. The Wainwright striplines looked nice on paper but didn't seem to work for me.

20th Sep 2016, 5:34 pm	#31
GeoffK Heptode Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Essex, UK. Posts: 602	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Still got a couple of reels left over from the PW 12+12 Amplifier I built that still works though hasn't been switched on for a while. Cir-kit still sticky still useable. Attached Thumbnails

20th Sep 2016, 6:57 pm	#32
jimmc101 Heptode Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Portsmouth, Hampshire, UK. Posts: 674	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it There was also a Cir-Kit that made PCB repair kits, I've just dug this one out of the back of a cupboard. the copper pads were not self-adhesive, they used a liquid adhesive plus activator. The small containers on the left contain tubular rivets (Griplets). Jim Attached Thumbnails Last edited by jimmc101; 20th Sep 2016 at 6:58 pm. Reason: English

20th Sep 2016, 7:06 pm	#33
Craig Sawyers Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Oxford, UK. Posts: 4,978	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it That brings back (horrid) memories! The thinnest you can easily get now is 5mm. But now for prototypes, and even in a box for finished stuff I'm a dead bug man. The king of the dead bug was the late great Jim Williams of AD. Have a look at the photos at the end of this http://cds.linear.com/docs/en/applic...note/an74f.pdf And then read the note to see what he was measuring, how it was done - and then look at the dead bug layout again with deep respect!

20th Sep 2016, 8:34 pm	#34
ms660 Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 13,454	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Yes, street cred for that one. Lawrence.

21st Sep 2016, 2:15 am	#35
suebutcher Heptode Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Daylesford, Victoria, Australia Posts: 675	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Ouch! That hurts my eyes to look at. __________________ The Waves That Rule Britannia

21st Sep 2016, 7:27 pm	#36
ionburn Heptode Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Lincoln, Lincolnshire, UK. Posts: 583	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it I remember the Cir-Kit stuff. I cannot remember if I ever had any, but was not impressed. I had a Philips EE kit, and still have some of the bits (transistor boots and the LDR although it's escaping me at the moment as to where it is). I also have the manual somewhere. Although I have used printed circuits, both etched and hand cut, I prefer to use Veroboard (or good equivalent). I have usedit for years. I tend to work directly from the schematic, juggling layout in my head as I solder my way across the board. I like to use one of the large strips, and cut it off (scribe and snap then file edges) when I have completed the circuit. These large strips usually suffice for several circuits as I modulise my designs. The main exception here is when designing with logic circuits (especially things like microprocessor or other typically high pin number chips). It is like art in that results improve with experience.

21st Sep 2016, 7:58 pm	#37
TonyDuell Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Biggin Hill, London, UK. Posts: 5,208	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Maplin used (a couple of years ago) to sell an FR4 (fibreglass) substrate stripboard with tinned copper tracks. It was lovely to work with (provded you didn't need a ground plane for high frequency work). Alas they have discontinued it, and I have never seen it anywhere else. Does anyone know of a supplier. I am running out... I agree with ionburn. For 1-off circuits I can have it soldered up on stripboard in less time than it takes to design a PCB. I never really plan the layout, just start soldering, and somehow it all fits and works...

22nd Sep 2016, 12:50 pm	#38
Herald1360 Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 16,535	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/stripboards/0434627/ If you're feeling flush? I like single side copper clad matrix board, if I can get it. Copper side up, Vero spot cutter where legs go through and hardwire on bottom side. Ground connections leave hole as is and solder to copper. __________________ ....__________ ....\|____\|\|__\|__\_____ .=.\| _---\__\|__\|_---_\|. .........O..Chris....O

22nd Sep 2016, 1:24 pm	#39
MrBungle Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: London, UK. Posts: 3,687	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it They do cheaper ones: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/stripboards/5230666/ I always solder myself into a corner on these or spend way too much time planning the things so I gave up on them. Usually i'll build something point to point/deadbug and make a PCB if I feel it deserves it. I haven't made a PCB for about 10 years now

22nd Sep 2016, 1:27 pm	#40
TonyDuell Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Biggin Hill, London, UK. Posts: 5,208	Re: Cir-Kit ? Anyone remember it Thanks for that. I think that this one : http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/stripboards/5185932/ is the same as the one Maplin used to stock. I will try to remember to add some to my next order...