Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! - Page 2 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Heatercathodeshort · 18th Aug 2019, 9:42 pm

It was actually quite a reliable chassis utterly spoiled by manufacturing faults such as the nasty dry joints in the I.F. unit and the ELC1043 tuner. I successfully re soldered quite a few but some were very stubborn, often intermittent and were replaced. OK the picture bloomed at high levels of contrast but if set up correctly and the symptoms of incorrect adjustment were explained to the customer, it was not that bad.
The low focus volts tube was really nasty. Just to save a bit of money you ended up with a soft looking picture.The later 6 button PYE Chelsea was a great improvement. The glow switch was a crude over voltage protection device but I can only remember replacing one line output transistor so it must have worked.
The Philips 'cuckoo' G8 was a bit naughty as it resembled the G8 series and was probably purchased by recommendation from G8 friends and neighbours.
It's just the old British story. Build as cheaply as possible cutting every corner imaginable.
Most of this series was sold through the new discount warehouses such as Comet and Tempo who demanded lower and lower buying in prices all ending up going to a disaster in a hand cart. At this time the high quality mainly Japanese imports were not sold through these outlets but despite being a good bit dearer sold in large numbers to very satisfied customers. The writing was on the wall to UK manufacturing plants. A sad tale really. Regards, John.

Nuvistor · 18th Aug 2019, 11:47 pm

The IF strip or similar was used in a few Pye sets, I never had a problem fixing them but never had success with the ELC1043 tuners.

I only saw the low focus voltage type of these sets and we sent them back as not good enough as noted in an earlier post. The Small screen Japanese sets were an easy sell with good pictures and very reliable.
John, I think you have the problem well described in the last paragraph.

Hybrid tellies · 19th Aug 2019, 9:57 am

That picture looks good. Far better than the Pye CT200's that I have seen and the many BRC 8000's that we had out on rental.

Tazman1966 · 19th Aug 2019, 3:53 pm

Thanks for the replies everyone. Given some careful setting up as John says and not overdoing the contrast setting, fairly reasonable results can be obtained. To be honest, my Pye version has an even nicer picture but then again the CRT is brand new in that one!

This Philips though still has an extremely tatty cabinet and one remaining fault, There is some zig zagging of the verticals on various different scenes. It's not random tearing as such but is neatly illustrated in the pictures below. I also wanted to check D618 as commented on by Restoration 73 earlier but in my set and in my manual for the Philips 570, it's a Zener and not a OA47. Anyone have any ideas on this? I'll see if I can find the manual for the earlier 713 chassis and see if it differs in this way.

All the best for now

Maarten · 19th Aug 2019, 10:32 pm

Zig zagging could be a ripple on the power rail.

Tazman1966 · 20th Aug 2019, 2:26 pm

It's certainly a possibility. Maybe time to get the scope out and see how clean (or not!) the HT line is!

Welsh Anorak · 21st Aug 2019, 11:51 am

I've mentioned this before, but I'm sure I remember an article about using high focus volts on a low-focus tube. Apparently, as you increased the voltage it lost focus (such as it was) then it came back much sharper. Naturally the tube base would need modification to do that.
I had a couple of IF strips that just wouldn't listen to reason. LEDCo supplied a SWAF based one for less than the Pye original. It worked, but never produced that good a picture. Mind you, neither did the original!
And yes, a posh frock meant at first glance you had a nice easy G8 repair, not a 'balance the chassis on your knee and hope for the best' job.

Tazman1966 · 22nd Aug 2019, 10:15 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Welsh Anorak

...I'm sure I remember an article about using high focus volts on a low-focus tube. Apparently, as you increased the voltage it lost focus (such as it was) then it came back much sharper...

I'm not sure what voltages would be involved in this as I tried it when fitting a "low focus" ex Hitachi tube to my Ultra Thorn 8500 chassis and in the end had to derive the focus supply from the A1 supply as per the earlier 8000 chassis.

With this Philips though, it has a conventional high focus tube - an A47 343X as opposed to the earlier A47 342X with the low focus potential as fitted to the 713 chassis in the original Pye CT200.

The teleman · 23rd Aug 2019, 12:59 pm

I quite like these little sets , I have 2 of them both pye
1is the low focus voltage crt the other is the high voltage version
Sadly the lopt has failed in the high voltage one so I’ve never seen it work
Chris

slidertogrid · 23rd Aug 2019, 6:42 pm

I found the capacitors on the IF strip could cause the intermittent signal or low gain problem. The coating on the capacitors extended down the legs.
when I re soldered the panel I would ease the capacitors backwards a little this would usually cure the problem.
The picture ballooning problem was not too bad on a correctly set up chassis but was always present to some degree.
In their defence though they were fairly cheap compared to other makes at the time...

Rich

Vectamart · 24th Aug 2019, 4:42 pm

The IF modules that were used on these and the large screen Pye CTVs (725/731/741, etc) were nororiously troublesome. Sometimes we fixed them successfully by resoldering all the joints on both sides but it often worked out more cost effective to fit one of the replacement modules with a SAW filter. Either way, it earned us some pennies.

18th Aug 2019, 9:42 pm	#21
Heatercathodeshort Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Warnham, West Sussex. 10 miles south of DORKING. Posts: 9,147	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! It was actually quite a reliable chassis utterly spoiled by manufacturing faults such as the nasty dry joints in the I.F. unit and the ELC1043 tuner. I successfully re soldered quite a few but some were very stubborn, often intermittent and were replaced. OK the picture bloomed at high levels of contrast but if set up correctly and the symptoms of incorrect adjustment were explained to the customer, it was not that bad. The low focus volts tube was really nasty. Just to save a bit of money you ended up with a soft looking picture.The later 6 button PYE Chelsea was a great improvement. The glow switch was a crude over voltage protection device but I can only remember replacing one line output transistor so it must have worked. The Philips 'cuckoo' G8 was a bit naughty as it resembled the G8 series and was probably purchased by recommendation from G8 friends and neighbours. It's just the old British story. Build as cheaply as possible cutting every corner imaginable. Most of this series was sold through the new discount warehouses such as Comet and Tempo who demanded lower and lower buying in prices all ending up going to a disaster in a hand cart. At this time the high quality mainly Japanese imports were not sold through these outlets but despite being a good bit dearer sold in large numbers to very satisfied customers. The writing was on the wall to UK manufacturing plants. A sad tale really. Regards, John.

18th Aug 2019, 11:47 pm	#22
Nuvistor Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Wigan, Greater Manchester, UK. Posts: 9,431	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! The IF strip or similar was used in a few Pye sets, I never had a problem fixing them but never had success with the ELC1043 tuners. I only saw the low focus voltage type of these sets and we sent them back as not good enough as noted in an earlier post. The Small screen Japanese sets were an easy sell with good pictures and very reliable. John, I think you have the problem well described in the last paragraph. __________________ Frank

19th Aug 2019, 9:57 am	#23
Hybrid tellies Nonode Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: 1966-1976 Coverack in Cornwall and Helston Cornwall. 1976-present Bristol/Bath area. Posts: 2,965	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! That picture looks good. Far better than the Pye CT200's that I have seen and the many BRC 8000's that we had out on rental. __________________ Simon BVWS member

19th Aug 2019, 3:53 pm	#24
Tazman1966 Nonode Join Date: May 2006 Location: St Albans, Herts, UK. Posts: 2,193	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! Thanks for the replies everyone. Given some careful setting up as John says and not overdoing the contrast setting, fairly reasonable results can be obtained. To be honest, my Pye version has an even nicer picture but then again the CRT is brand new in that one! This Philips though still has an extremely tatty cabinet and one remaining fault, There is some zig zagging of the verticals on various different scenes. It's not random tearing as such but is neatly illustrated in the pictures below. I also wanted to check D618 as commented on by Restoration 73 earlier but in my set and in my manual for the Philips 570, it's a Zener and not a OA47. Anyone have any ideas on this? I'll see if I can find the manual for the earlier 713 chassis and see if it differs in this way. All the best for now Attached Thumbnails

19th Aug 2019, 10:32 pm	#25
Maarten Dekatron Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Haarlem, Netherlands Posts: 4,199	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! Zig zagging could be a ripple on the power rail.

20th Aug 2019, 2:26 pm	#26
Tazman1966 Nonode Join Date: May 2006 Location: St Albans, Herts, UK. Posts: 2,193	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! It's certainly a possibility. Maybe time to get the scope out and see how clean (or not!) the HT line is! __________________ All the very best, Tas

21st Aug 2019, 11:51 am	#27
Welsh Anorak Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: North Wales, UK. Posts: 6,916	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! I've mentioned this before, but I'm sure I remember an article about using high focus volts on a low-focus tube. Apparently, as you increased the voltage it lost focus (such as it was) then it came back much sharper. Naturally the tube base would need modification to do that. I had a couple of IF strips that just wouldn't listen to reason. LEDCo supplied a SWAF based one for less than the Pye original. It worked, but never produced that good a picture. Mind you, neither did the original! And yes, a posh frock meant at first glance you had a nice easy G8 repair, not a 'balance the chassis on your knee and hope for the best' job. __________________ Glyn www.gdelectronics.wales Last edited by Welsh Anorak; 21st Aug 2019 at 12:02 pm.

23rd Aug 2019, 12:59 pm	#29
The teleman Pentode Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: County Durham, UK. Posts: 243	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! I quite like these little sets , I have 2 of them both pye 1is the low focus voltage crt the other is the high voltage version Sadly the lopt has failed in the high voltage one so I’ve never seen it work Chris

23rd Aug 2019, 6:42 pm	#30
slidertogrid Octode Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Peterborough, Cambridgeshire, UK. Posts: 1,898	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! I found the capacitors on the IF strip could cause the intermittent signal or low gain problem. The coating on the capacitors extended down the legs. when I re soldered the panel I would ease the capacitors backwards a little this would usually cure the problem. The picture ballooning problem was not too bad on a correctly set up chassis but was always present to some degree. In their defence though they were fairly cheap compared to other makes at the time... Rich

24th Aug 2019, 4:42 pm	#31
Vectamart Pentode Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Ventnor, Isle of Wight, UK. Posts: 141	Re: Philips 570, a cheapo Pye in disguise! The IF modules that were used on these and the large screen Pye CTVs (725/731/741, etc) were nororiously troublesome. Sometimes we fixed them successfully by resoldering all the joints on both sides but it often worked out more cost effective to fit one of the replacement modules with a SAW filter. Either way, it earned us some pennies.