Ferguson 3032 record player hum/cartridge. (Hum issues).

[Lance G]

Greetings all,

I don't know if anyone can kindly help with the following ?!;

I have been asked (dangerous, with my limited knowledge !) to investigate hum and low output issues on a Ferguson 3032 record player.
I have managed to obtain a circuit and have replaced the three in circuit electrolytic capacitors, but to no avail.

I am now considering the cartridge potentially being at fault, but need to know if I can get a replacement ? I have trawled the internet with no sucess to date.

I am not sure if the cartridge is even replaceable ? I have attempted removal but have experienced some difficulty in doing so, and am loathe to damage it if there is no potential chance of a replacement.

Any polite suggestions will be gratefully received !

[Techman]

You need to do the 'buzz test' before doing anything else!

Full volume and touch each of the connections that go to the rear of the cartridge with an insulated small screwdriver blade. You can use your finger to do this so long as you know that the player has an isolation transformer, as if it's a live chassis model and the mains plug is connected incorrectly you may get a bad shock!

At full, or nearly full volume, you should get a loud hum or buzz from the speaker/s if the amplifier/s are working when you touch one or two of the connectors, which then proves that the cartridge is probably faulty.

[Lance G]

Hi Techman, thanks for the quick reply !

Cartridge totally disconnected produces some hum at mid/high volume level/s, but I am guessing it's not a particularly hi spec PSU or amplifier !

Contact with input lead increases hum, re-connection of cartridge more so to unacceptable level.

With your guidance I am dangerously assuming it's largely caused by the cartridge ?

I know the player is probably not particularly desirable or valuable, but it holds considerable sentimental value being a well used item from a (now slightly less !) young ladies childhood/teenage years.

I would like to change the (mono) cartridge, but as previously expressed am not sure if it can be replaced (at all) ?

[Techman]

I've just realised what this record player is, it's one of those very small mono players with a transparent lid that looks like a portable, but is mains only. If I'm right, it's fitted with the very small BSR autochanger capable of stacking around 5 or 6 records.

It's best NOT to just dive in and start replacing capacitors if you don't know what you're doing, as this is likely to only end in disaster!

If there's a fault, then proper assessment of the fault and then proper fault finding is the ONLY way to go. Amplifier faults are usually the first stage transistor which can be replaced with a BC107 or 108, or possibly the output transistors. All original parts are obsolete on these, so you have to use and adapt what you can find. Fault finding usually begins with using a DVM and measuring voltages, the first one being the DC output of the power supply. If you still have hum regardless of the volume control setting, but with good audio after the cartridge has been replaced, then this could be a smoothing capacitor or rectifier problem. If the audio is poor, then it's likely to be transistor problems, then capacitors or resistors.

There's no replacement for the cartridge to buy off the shelf, as if it's the one I'm thinking it is, then it's part of the actual head. I remember repairing one of these and the only solution was to dissect the head of its old cartridge and cut down one of the cheap Chinese cartridges and adapt its butchered remains to fit the head. Be warned - you'll need good practical skills to do this job. You'll need a miniature hack saw and a set of needle files and probably a drill. The replacement cartridge will fall to bits once you start cutting its case down to size, so you'll need the super glue to hand. You'll need to strap the left and right channels together by wrapping fine wire round the output tags of the replacement cartridge - do NOT solder directly onto the cartridge tags, as heat can destroy the element of the cartridge. I actually took some pictures when I last did one of these, so you can see what I mean. Don't ask me for a step by step description as it was too long ago and I can't actually remember the exact procedure, so you'll just have to just 'suck it and see' and hope for the best - those Chinese black and red cartridges are excellent and are very cheap at around £1.50 each, so buy a couple in case you wreck one.

Take on this job at your peril - hours of messing about...have fun!

[BRASSBITS]

I would be very surprised if a bsr sc11
would not fit that headshell

[Techman]

It won't, it's way too tall.

[ben]

I dismantled and cleaned tarnished contacts in one of these SC7 heads last year, with care it can be done! The trick is to lift out the rubber block and element as one unit and gently clean the foils.

[Techman]

Actually, looking at a SC11 without its clip it may just be able to be used, but would it be worth risking a near on £40 cartridge?

It may be worth trying to clean the tarnished connections of the original, but in the case described it was well beyond that.

The player worked exceedingly well with the grafted in Chinese replacement, although no flip-over for playing 78s.

[ben]

I should also have pointed out that such open heart surgery on a cartridge is tricky at the best of times, and probably not something for the inexperienced!

[dave walsh]

Hi Lance and welcome-especially if you are young. Can we help with the following? Well tell us where you are coming from knowledge wise-even if it doesn't amount to much . There's every opportunity to learn without criticism on here. I'm not that technically experienced myself but as Techman said, you are at the wrong end of the telescope really. Why have you accepted this repair challenge and what is your knowledge base? We've no idea! Replacing components wholesale is the province of the really experienced repairer who's seen it all before not the beginner [whatever you may have seen elsewhere]. The usual approach is step by step [so you know where you are at any given moment and don't get totally confused ] with some prior understanding. No one can fix a car by guess work for example.

Dave W

[Techman]

Quite a bit of reading, advice and information for Lance to be going on with when he returns to the thread.

Ben - I think you're waiting to test run a Chinese flip-under cartridge from what you said in another recent thread. There seems to be another option in the shape of a (apparently) high output magnetic cartridge with a flip-under at half the price of that one. There's also another option at around £7.50 (prices vary by around 50p) of a high output magnetic ordinary single stylus type with two hole mounting, nuts and bolts supplied. Moving magnet with high output the same as a medium output ceramic type - no 'booster' needed (presumably pre-amp) so it says in the adverts!

[Silicon]

The BRC service manual states that the cartridge is an X8M4 mono cartridge.

It is connected across a 2 MegOhm volume potentiometer.

There are 3 electrolytic capacitors and a bridge rectifier which may be a Selenium type.

If the rectifier is Selenium it would be best to replace it with a silicon bridge rectifier.

The service manual is available on this web site.

[Silicon]

It is fitted with a BSR C124T/A/1 turntable.

The service manual actually referred to a 'Pickup head and cartridge assembly, type X8M4'.
It also listed a 'Screw securing Pickup head assembly' and a 'Turnover styli assembly ST16'.

Does this mean that a screw secures the cartridge onto the headshell OR is the headshell and cartridge one unit that screws on to the pickup arm?

Could there be a screw hiding under a decorative metal foil on the top of the headshell?

[Techman]

Originally Posted by Silicon

The BRC service manual states that the cartridge is an X8M4 mono cartridge.

You may well be right about that.

I was going to go on what Ben said about it being an SC7, although I don't actually know what cartridge it is - we'll have to wait and see what Ben says when he logs on. I had a quick look at an an SC7 and it would seem that these are stereo as standard and they are separate from the headshell, whereas the cartridge in these players are a fixed part of the headshell and are also mono. I don't remember any screws being originally used, it being all stuck together as one complete unit, the only screw being the one that I added with the hole I drilled to hold the modified cartridge body in place. I had to cut the top and both sides of the replacement down so that it would fit inside the headshell. I can't remember exactly now, but I possibly had to cut some plastic away from the inside of the old headshell too.

If you know this particular deck, you'll know that there's a very good reason for getting the cartridge as far up inside the headshell as possible.

[BRASSBITS]

as far as I can remember back in the day the x8m4 came as a one part cartridge and headshell with a male fitting.
the sc7 cartridge came as a sepperate cartridge with a riveted on metal back plate that had 4 tangs 2 on each side making it near impossible to remove once fitted to a female fitting headshell.

[Lance G]

I am speechless (hence having to write this!). I am somewhat overwhelmed by the response from you people, so much interest and support, and so uplifting in these modern times. All of you, give yourselves a pat on the back (let's face it, no-one else is going to bother!). Thank you to you all.

Back to the matter in hand. I will take some time to absorb all of the information offered, however I add the following:

I changed the three electrolytic cap's as a cheap initial option, bearing in mind them likely being past their prime and out of spec'/leaky being 40+ years old ? The main item of concern being the power supply smoothing cap'.

I have further discovered a previous thread where a member colleague appears to have experienced exactly the same issue/s. I don't know how to "link" the thread so I have copied and pasted the following;

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ad.php?t=78563

Again any feedback will be greatly appreciated, many thanks. Lance.

[Techman]

There's lots of good information for you in that thread you linked to.

There's an awful lot of nonsense talked about capacitor replacement on the internet.

In some situations replacement is necessary and in others situations, not.

Replacing capacitors because someone with little knowledge on a 'you tube' video said it was a necessity and a good idea is a bad mistake. If you have a fault, take a step back and assess the fault and try to diagnose the reason for the fault and replace the actual faulty part. Replacing capacitors and other components at random often leads to mistakes (man made faults), which make further diagnosis sometimes impossible. Are you sure you fitted the replacement capacitors the correct way round? There's actually another thread running on here at the moment where the chap fitted one of the electrolytic capacitors the wrong way round after a random cap change exercise and it exploded and has caused him all sorts of grief.

It's true that bad capacitors are responsible for a lot of faults and there are certain situations where replacing capacitors in one go is the best policy, such as in modern gear like SMPSUs or computer boards. Circuit information is often not available and the boards are often marked with component polarities etc., so mistakes are unlikely, so long as you're careful, but this doesn't apply to vintage kit such as your record player. As it happens, capacitor problems are not a known problem in your particular player, although anything's possible.

At this stage, the best thing you can do is to order one of those cheap cartridges mentioned to test out the player- they're only £1.21! I shouldn't really tell you this, but you can as a temporary measure, just stick the cartridge to the bottom of the old one with Blu-tac. However, the things you need to appreciate are first, that adding a second cartridge like this will way more than double the tracking weight, which you'll need to re-adjust with a proper gauge - you'll need to do this anyway even if you properly graft the cartridge into the existing shell - gauges are relatively cheap. Too much tracking weight can damage records, the stylus and the cartridge. Use an old record that doesn't matter if you're experimenting. You can connect the connectors to just one of the stereo channels while you're testing, but you'll only be hearing half of the recording. Here's a link to an example of one of the very cheap cartridges below:-
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Turntable...53.m1438.l2649

The other problem you'll have is that with the cartridge hanging much lower than the original, the stylus and cartridge may well start crashing into the stack of records on the turntable platter as they build up. there's an adjustment for this, but as this is a 'mini' autochanger, it has a very short stacking spindle, so there's not a lot of tolerance and the arm is likely to then crash into the stack of records waiting to be dropped, so ultimately for a permanent fix the cartridge element needs to be right up as high as possible in the headshell so as the changer can play ALL the records that are likely to be stacked on the upper part of the spindle.