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Components and Circuits For discussions about component types, alternatives and availability, circuit configurations and modifications etc. Discussions here should be of a general nature and not about specific sets.

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Old 25th Aug 2019, 6:49 pm   #1
Diabolical Artificer
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Default That old "wot speaker is a good un" question.

My main speakers are Mission 720's, these being one of the best speakers Mission ever made, AFAIK, having top whack drivers like Peerless mids and woofers and Seas tweeters, nowt wrong with them, have a bit of dosh for a change and before it drains away I've looked at a few possible speakers to buy.

Have my eye on some Kef Model 103/3 and Series 104 AB, some unknown JBL's, some Mordant Short Pageant S2's and various B&W's - model 601, 602 S2. Various Castle speakers.

If I buy a "new" pair of speakers, A) I haven't much money, 200 ish, so looking at vintage/used, B) They'd have to be not too obscure so as to have things like drivers and foam surrounds available for repair. Looking for something more sensitive than my Mission's to have a look at all this SE hoo hah, but at same time capable of handling around 100w, which I realise is mutually exclusive in some respects.

Anyroad, what thinks you? Andy.

PS one thing I've noticed is that prices n Gumtree are more reasonable: comments?
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Old 25th Aug 2019, 10:21 pm   #2
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Default Re: That old "wot speaker is a good un" question.

I'm afraid asking for advice on speakers is a bit like asking for advice on wallpaper - insofar as they all sound different from one another the answer is going to determined only by what sound you like. We all like different sounds, which is why all those manufacturers are still in business and is also why there really is no substitute for trying speakers with your music in your listening room.

If you like the sound of your Missions though and really just want to replicate that but with more sensitivity then other people who know those speakers might be able to help. Otherwise you might imagine that the speakers most likely to sound like yours would be other Missions, on the basis that at least some of the same people will have designed them.

As it happens I have a pair of Mission 752 Freedoms here doing nothing (to be honest I'm not sure I've ever played them - it's a long story). If you could think of a way of getting them from South Oxon to you (via Audiojumble perhaps ?) then you'd be welcome to borrow them for a try out. There's a review here https://www.gramophone.co.uk/editori...om-loudspeaker and they claim a sensitivity of 90dB, which is a bit better than the 720s' 86dB (a factor of 2.5 reduction in power needed for the same sound level).

Cheers,

GJ
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Old 25th Aug 2019, 10:49 pm   #3
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Default Re: That old "wot speaker is a good un" question.

Why not build a pair?

There have been a few transmission line designs well worth the effort. Two that spring to mind are the Atkinson design and the Chris Rogers PRO9TL. The latter uses the peerless K040 midrange and the tweeter can be a SEAS. B139s can still be found or Falcon have put them back into production.

Once you've had a good transmission line speaker, there is no going back.

Build the cabinets in MDF, don't bother doing the outside veneer/cosmetics until you've tried them and decided if you like them.

If you don't like them you still have the drivers etc and you're just out a couple of sheets of MDF. You can flog the cabinets or recycle the woodscrews and save 'em for bonfire night.

David
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Old 26th Aug 2019, 2:58 am   #4
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Default Re: That old "wot speaker is a good un" question.

Wot David said!!!

Boxes are pretty easy to build. No air leaks at corners/glue joints and bob's yer uncle.
Some horns can be very scary to build though. Check origional Tannoy's !!!
I have some very nice designs, that are "the right size" ( meaning not 600 litre cabinets)
Yell if you want them.

Joe
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Old 26th Aug 2019, 7:36 am   #5
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Default Re: That old "wot speaker is a good un" question.

Realsied I put this in the wrong section....

"I'm afraid asking for advice on speakers is a bit like asking for advice on wallpaper" I know, I was thinking more in terms of quality of drivers and wanted to know if the ho hah about B&W's is warranted. Thanks for the offer G,I'll bear it in mind, transport is tricky though.

Thought about that David, and did have the plans and drivers for the PRO9TL's, but flogged em, also getting hold of KO40's is problematic, though they do come up on ebay now and again. I'll have another look at speakers design's, I know there are a few design's that use the Fostex full range drivers.

Andy.
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Old 26th Aug 2019, 8:55 am   #6
GrimJosef
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Default Re: That old "wot speaker is a good un" question.

Since value for money matters it can be worth looking out for kit speakers on eBay. A lot of customers mistrust the build quality of other people's work. Sometimes this is justified, but often it's not, and even when it is as long as they haven't damaged the drivers this can be a very cost-effective way of picking up relatively expensive items. You might need just to tidy up the cabinets. Or you might not even need to do that. As well as the DIY designs that David's mentioned there are also kits available from the likes of Wilmslow Audio and IPL Acoustics (transmission line specialists of long standing).

EDIT: I'm sure you know, but I'll mention it anyway, that when it comes to sensitivity some speaker manufacturers are naughtier than others. The default is to specify the SPL delivered at 1m from the speaker for 1W audio power input. With an 8ohm speaker that corresponds to 2.83V RMS across the terminals. But some manufacturers specify it for 2.83V without telling you the impedance. If they're running into 4ohms, which they quite often are, then they'll be taking 2W from the amp and you need to slice 3dB off their quoted sensitivity if you want a fair comparison with the standard.

Cheers,

GJ
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Old 26th Aug 2019, 10:30 am   #7
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Default Re: That old "wot speaker is a good un" question.

Speakers are a major limitation, amplifiers are easy.

So,

Build a good pair of speakers, then build whatever amplifier it takes to drive them properly.

I did that nearly 40 years ago and it stopped my interest in hifi dead. I had something significantly beyond what you could buy in the shops. It just vanished, leaving only the music. So I got on with enjoying music. Had to find a new constructional hobby, so started building rally cars!

It is really rather nice to have a setup which is clearly excellent as judged by experienced ears, but which has no recognisable brand to tell audio aficinados what they are supposed to say they hear ;-)

Who? Me? Evil?

See the one liner below.

David
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Old 26th Aug 2019, 2:34 pm   #8
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Default Re: That old "wot speaker is a good un" question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler View Post

Who? Me? Evil?

See the one liner below.

David
Nah... just an engineer
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