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Old 28th Oct 2016, 5:28 pm   #1
ukcol
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Default WWI phonetic alphabet

This is probably not new to most of you who frequent this section but it is to me.

On the BBC program "Flog it" there was a piece on WWI communications equipment and I spotted this on the side of a piece of telegraph equipment.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 5:41 pm   #2
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Here's some more including the more familiar one:

http://www.americanradiohistory.com/...%20alphabet%22

Able, baker, charlie etc was used for the field service vans R/T at one firm I worked for.

EDIT: Progress control to progress baker (me) come in please over.....go away!

Lawrence.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 5:42 pm   #3
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Fascinating, I wonder if there was any research for the phonetic alphabets e.g. trying various words over a noisy link. Or was it just some bod having a guess?
 
Old 28th Oct 2016, 6:17 pm   #4
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

I imagine one of the considerations for the WWI one was to use words the average British "Tommy" would be familiar with.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 6:42 pm   #5
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

As a total aside, I remember a children's book that had a character (who did indeed make bread) called 'Able Baker Charlie'. Even at that age I thought that there was some significance to the name.

What about languasges other than English? Somewhere I have a German field telephone with a plate on it giving what I assume is a phonetic alphabet. I will see if I can find it..

There are of course also the misleading ones. Two types that I know of, one based on verbal puns ('A for horses' (Hay for horses), 'B for mutton' (Beef or Mutton), etc) and one based on words that sound as though they start with another letter (A for Aisle, B for Bdellium, etc)
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 6:52 pm   #6
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Quote:
Originally Posted by ukcol View Post
'... WWI one was to use words the average British "Tommy" would be familiar with.'
The reverse happened too. The Talbot House Christian Fellowship movement started by The Revd. Philip 'Tubby' Clayton became known as the 'Toc H' club.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 6:58 pm   #7
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

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Originally Posted by merlinmaxwell View Post
Fascinating
I was about to say the same.

Many of these still seem to be used for informal spelling-out of things over the phone e.g. "C for Charlie, S for sugar..."

But what do Ac, Toc and Yorker mean (if anything)?
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 7:18 pm   #8
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Here's how it is, or was, in Sweden, from a 1950s field-telephone in the Karlskrona Marinmuseum.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 7:22 pm   #9
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Quote:
Originally Posted by merlinmaxwell View Post
Fascinating, I wonder if there was any research for the phonetic alphabets e.g. trying various words over a noisy link.
Indeed... Try discriminating between S and F, or B and V.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 7:28 pm   #10
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickthedentist View Post
But what do Ac, Toc and Yorker mean (if anything)?
Perhaps "Yorker" refers to the type of bowling delivery in cricket?
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 9:39 pm   #11
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

I now realise why Ac-Ac guns were so called (I think).

I recently saw an Agatha Christie play featuring characters named Pip and Emma. The story hinges in part on specific times of day; I found the subtle joke delightful, but wondered how many others in a modern audience would get it.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 9:52 pm   #12
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

I believe a lot of research was carried out before the current Nato phonetic alphabet was established in the 50s. The various words had to be unambiguous in all Nato languages.
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Old 28th Oct 2016, 11:33 pm   #13
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

You're absolutely right on that Paul, it's not now the NATO phonetic alphabet but the international code of signals alphabet. And yes it was deliberately contrived so that letters could be made out under poor reception conditions and words that could be understood by most nationalities. Ah happy days spelling names and words out over a Radiotelephone link.
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Old 29th Oct 2016, 12:00 am   #14
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

I recently started learning Italian, and for internal use, the Italians mostly use the names of towns or cities to spell out letters (learning them is my homework for half term!) : Acona, Bologna, Catania, Domodossola, etc., with John, Kaiser, Xylophone, York and Zara filling in the gaps.
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Old 29th Oct 2016, 12:50 am   #15
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

I saw some of that program today and believe they were at the Royal Signals Museum at Blandford Camp. Well worth a visit if you are into military comms through the years. Good cafe as well!
Alan.
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Old 29th Oct 2016, 7:10 am   #16
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyDuell View Post
Somewhere I have a German field telephone with a plate on it giving what I assume is a phonetic alphabet. I will see if I can find it.
Meanwhile, here is the list from my German field telephone:

A nton
Ä rger
B ertha
C äsar
Ch arlotte
D ora
E mil
F riedrich
G ustav
H einrich
I do
J ulius
K onrad
L udwig
M artha
N ordpol
O tto
Ö dipus
P aula
Q uelle
R ichard
S iegfried
T heodor
U lrich
Ü bel
V iktor
W ilhelm
X anthippe
Y psilon
Z eppelin
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Old 29th Oct 2016, 10:01 am   #17
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Quote:
Originally Posted by dseymo1 View Post
I now realise why Ac-Ac guns were so called (I think).
Yes, that is entirely plausible.
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Old 29th Oct 2016, 5:13 pm   #18
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

Ack Ack was I was led to believe derived from the German word for eight, acht as the guns were often 88mm artillery pieces "Acht Acht" anglicised to ack ack. Doe any one here know whether that is true?
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Old 29th Oct 2016, 6:59 pm   #19
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

hello Dave,

I think the Ido is a Ida

greetings
Martin
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Old 29th Oct 2016, 7:29 pm   #20
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Default Re: WWI phonetic alphabet

During WW2 there was a popular variety programme on the wireless called Ack Ack Beer Beer. Ken.
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