UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Powered By Google Custom Search Vintage Radio and TV Service Data

Go Back   UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum > Specific Vintage Equipment > Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players

Notices

Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players Open-reel tape recorders, cassette recorders, 8-track players etc.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 18th Jun 2014, 1:52 am   #21
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmyhaflinger View Post
you can tell the year and place of mfg. of your recorders by looking at a sticker in the battery compartment, it it reads WR it means it was made in Philips' Wiener Radiowerke plant Austria, AH means it was made in Hasselt, belgium (marked as "Made in Holland) and SV means it was made in Singapore
"АН" sticker is on the motor enclosure in mine. Early one also had a good shoulder strap since it has an additional pivot metal pieces on the hard case mounts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmyhaflinger View Post
that's strange as i rarely had problems with original Philips capacitors... maybe that's because you live in Florida which has a much hotter climate than i have here in Northern Italy.
I've been getting them from all over the country, so it's not climate-related. The only loud one so far is Norelco. I only buy the original Philips/BC Components caps.
toshik1 is offline  
Old 18th Jun 2014, 5:39 pm   #22
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Got one with motor speed way faster than it should be - outputs about 4.9V to the motor instead of average 3.75V! All components seem to be ok on the regulator board - bad 100 Ohm variable resistor?
toshik1 is offline  
Old 19th Jun 2014, 1:46 pm   #23
Jimmyhaflinger
Heptode
 
Jimmyhaflinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

if the VR tests OK but you're still totally unable to adjust the speed, then you may have a leaky transistor
Jimmyhaflinger is offline  
Old 19th Jun 2014, 4:54 pm   #24
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Ok I stopping right there - six pieces is more than enough!
So far only half of them work: both Norelco EL3302/52G and one black-grilled Philips EL3302/52G.
Two have extremely low and distorted sound. I fed line-level audio direct into the volume control pot and it's still the same. So something in the output stages is at blame.
Last one has some self-oscillating in the amp, output stages are fine and too high motor regulator output voltage.
I'm sure we have here people knowing those in and out.
So any word of advise would be greatly appreciated!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCF8013EL.jpg
Views:	194
Size:	128.3 KB
ID:	94287  

Last edited by toshik1; 19th Jun 2014 at 5:03 pm.
toshik1 is offline  
Old 19th Jun 2014, 7:05 pm   #25
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Low and distorted output is due to faulty output transistors AC187/AC188.
What totally puzzles me is that in the meter non-working transistors measure exactly the same as good ones!!!
I guess the regulator issue is suffering from defective AC127 or AC128.

Edit: Yes the regulator has a defective AC128.
toshik1 is offline  
Old 20th Jun 2014, 11:06 am   #26
Jimmyhaflinger
Heptode
 
Jimmyhaflinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

germanium transistors sometimes become leaky, out of spec and noisy and still test good on a simple multimeter diode test
Jimmyhaflinger is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2014, 12:21 am   #27
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Thanks everyone for great help! Feel like repair pro now
I plan to fix them all, keep a few and sell the extras.
I also found unlisted in this thread code WT on newer EL3302A/15P with clear cover.
I've got Pioneer CT-F1250 in my hands so making calibration cassette is no longer an issue

Last edited by toshik1; 21st Jun 2014 at 12:36 am.
toshik1 is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2014, 8:09 am   #28
Jimmyhaflinger
Heptode
 
Jimmyhaflinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

WT still means it was made in Austria, just not in the Wiener Radiowerke Philips plant i think

you'll find plenty of facts about these recorders in this thread:
https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...t=75160&page=5
Jimmyhaflinger is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2014, 2:32 pm   #29
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

You are perfectly correct, the grille shield says: "made in Austria"
toshik1 is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2014, 10:57 pm   #30
Maarten
Dekatron
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Haarlem, Netherlands
Posts: 4,185
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Three codes were commonly used for different factories in Vienna: WR, WT and WD. The latter is mostly used on radios TV sets and videorecorders.
Maarten is online now  
Old 23rd Jun 2014, 12:06 pm   #31
Jimmyhaflinger
Heptode
 
Jimmyhaflinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

What's strange is that you're finding Philips branded machines in the US... wasn't Philips forced to use the Norelco brand after Philco sued them in the 50s?

i think they were still unable to use the Philips brand until the 80s when Philco went bust
Jimmyhaflinger is offline  
Old 23rd Jun 2014, 6:25 pm   #32
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Bringbacks from Europe? None of them but one Norelco came with power adapters.

Last edited by toshik1; 23rd Jun 2014 at 6:54 pm.
toshik1 is offline  
Old 23rd Jun 2014, 10:18 pm   #33
Jimmyhaflinger
Heptode
 
Jimmyhaflinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

these are very rarely found with power adapters here in europe too, few people bought them and of course most adapters got lost long ago
Jimmyhaflinger is offline  
Old 24th Jun 2014, 2:24 am   #34
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

I'd imagine not too many Norelcos at all?
toshik1 is offline  
Old 24th Jun 2014, 4:22 pm   #35
Jimmyhaflinger
Heptode
 
Jimmyhaflinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

virtually none of them here
Jimmyhaflinger is offline  
Old 26th Jun 2014, 2:07 am   #36
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Got the original replacement AC128 from Germany for the regulator - surprise! Transistor case diameter is about 1mm smaller than the original one so it won't sit tight in the heat sink...
Go figure! I hope the AC187/188 won't have the same problem!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCF8039ASS.jpg
Views:	185
Size:	98.8 KB
ID:	94521  
toshik1 is offline  
Old 26th Jun 2014, 12:13 pm   #37
Jimmyhaflinger
Heptode
 
Jimmyhaflinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: La Spezia, Italy
Posts: 834
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

those current production (chinese i think) Germanium transistors always have this smaller package inherited from the French SFTxxx series, which won't fit well in heatsinks made for Philips/Mullard transistors
Jimmyhaflinger is offline  
Old 27th Jun 2014, 10:18 am   #38
ronbryan
Octode
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Guildford, Surrey, UK.
Posts: 1,958
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

Siemens AC128s are also supplied in this undersize package.

I deal with the undersize AC128s by wrapping a small piece of 0.020" brass shim around a suitable drill, filing off any burrs and then pressing it on to the transistor. The shimmed transistor is then a good fit in the heat sink.

Ron
ronbryan is offline  
Old 27th Jun 2014, 4:23 pm   #39
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

My transistors are by Tungsram.
I took 0.5 mm brass sheet, cut it to size and made a round tube-spacer to go in between the transistor and original steel heat sink.
BWT total recapping was a very good idea-50% of caps were totally dry.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCF8111HS.jpg
Views:	174
Size:	84.9 KB
ID:	94570  
toshik1 is offline  
Old 3rd Jul 2014, 1:21 am   #40
toshik1
Tetrode
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: St.Augustine, Florida, USA
Posts: 81
Default Re: Philips/Norelco EL3302

I found another early Norelco EL3302/94 (7th one!) without the spring latch and finally with a different PCB layout!
It has "boxes" on the PCB by the battery compartment end same as shown in service manuals.
Will report later.
toshik1 is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:40 pm.


All information and advice on this forum is subject to the WARNING AND DISCLAIMER located at https://www.vintage-radio.net/rules.html.
Failure to heed this warning may result in death or serious injury to yourself and/or others.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2002 - 2023, Paul Stenning.