E.A.R. DeLuxe record player.

[ms660]

Heater motor snippet, the 3.3k would now figure.

Lawrence.

[Sideband]

I may be looking at your line drawing wrong but it appears that you have numbered the valve pins wrong. With the B9A base if you look at them with the pins facing you (in other words looking at the valveholder from the component side) and the gap towards you, pin 1 is the first pin on the left of the gap and then pin 9 is the last pin on the right side of the gap so counting clockwise round.

The reason I say this is because looking at your line drawing, you couldn't have pins 4/5 (heater) connected to the output transformer......

[parlourtw73vs]

Sideband, I had to think about this when making the sketch. I've drawn the bases as though looking down on them with the valves inserted down into them. As I was informed that the pins were numbered clockwise from the gap when looking at the pins then I worked out that they would be numbered in a mirror fashion, thus making pin1 on the right of the gap and going around anticlockwise to 9. I may well be wrong and have misunderstood the correct way to draw a circuit. If this is the case I'll try to correct it.

[Station X]

Your drawing is fine, but it's more usual to show the valve holders as viewed from underneath as that's where the components are.

Have you checked that the wiring is consistent with Lawrence's drawing?

[parlourtw73vs]

Thanks for verifying my drawing Graham. I understood that Lawrence was working on a finished version of the circuit diagram so was waiting for that to appear. I'm not at all proficient in reading a circuit schematic so will need to really pore over it to try and understand it.

[Station X]

All you need to understand at this stage is the circuit in post #41.

[ms660]

Reversed engineered schematic, 1st revision based on photo's up to and including Post#40.

Note: I've shown the motor and the heater circuit W.W resistor (R17) connected as I think it should be......so far as I can figure out.

Comments/ideas welcome.

Lawrence.

['LIVEWIRE?']

Looks to be a fairly standard 'concertina' push-pull amplifier design, Lawrence, similar to those used by Hacker, Silvertone, Dansette and others. The main difference is the use of the motor as a dropper, and the UCL82 valves instead of the ECL8x types used by the others. The3k3 resistor in parallel with the heaters seems only to be there to allow the motor to run if the heaters are open circuit or the valve(s)physically removed, but why would that be necessary?

[parlourtw73vs]

With ref. to the drawing in post 41. Does this show the 2 thick green leads which go to the motor as being moved over 1 place on the connector strip so that the empty socket will then be on the extreme right of my diagram? Please bear with me if I've interpreted this wrong and explain the correct meaning if you will. Also, if I've deciphered it correctly I presume I cannot power the player up until the blown 25mfd. capacitor is replaced. I can solder a replacement in but I don't know where to obtain one or if any other value could be substituted.

[Nuvistor]

Originally Posted by 'LIVEWIRE?'

The3k3 resistor in parallel with the heaters seems only to be there to allow the motor to run if the heaters are open circuit or the valve(s)physically removed, but why would that be necessary?

Perhaps the motor requires more than 100ma, the 3.3k would draw a further 30ma giving 130ma throgh the motor and 100ma through the valves.

[Station X]

Originally Posted by parlourtw73vs

With ref. to the drawing in post 41. Does this show the 2 thick green leads which go to the motor as being moved over 1 place on the connector strip so that the empty socket will then be on the extreme right of my diagram? Please bear with me if I've interpreted this wrong and explain the correct meaning if you will. Also, if I've deciphered it correctly I presume I cannot power the player up until the blown 25mfd. capacitor is replaced. I can solder a replacement in but I don't know where to obtain one or if any other value could be substituted.

There are two circuits shown in post #41.

The one on the left shows the wiring as it is believed to be at present.

The one on the right shows how the wiring should be.

The 25 uF capacitor will have no affect on the valves lighting up and the motor running.

[parlourtw73vs]

Ha Ha, eureka!!! I swapped the leads over as suggested by Lawrence and both valves lit up followed after some seconds by a very loud hum from the speaker. This hum was unaffected by the volume control remaining at the same intensity even at the lowest setting. I also reconnected the GC8 cartridge to see if their was any response when stroking the stylus but I couldn't hear any.I guess this doesn't necessarily mean the cartridge is duff, after all there's still that blown capacitor [or condenser, is there a difference?] still to be replaced. I do have an older ceramic cartridge whose name and type eludes me for now as I have to dig it out but, if Edward is correct which I don't doubt, it should enable some degree of reproduction once the amp. is sorted. Lastly, the motor still spins as soon as the power is switched on. I now will endeavour, with the kind and able assistance of you knowledgeable folk, to try to get the amplifier working correctly. Once again, much gratitude to all who've contributed so far, I am hugely impressed by your ability to work out the circuitry from my photos and rudimentary sketch.
Malc.

[Station X]

Progress at last! Well done Malc and well done Lawrence.

I suggest that you now test the two metal rectifiers using the diode test function of your DMM as described in the first post in this thread:-

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ad.php?t=42194

I've never tested a metal rectifier in this way, so I don't know what readings to expect. Post the readings here for analysis.

[crackle]

Have you checked that mains neutral is connected to chassis and not the live.

I don't think it is possible to test a metal rectifier with a DMM diode function. I would measure the voltage, keeping your fingers well away from any other part of the circuit or "live chassis".

But before any of that I would try and reform the main electrolytic smoothing capacitors. If you dont have the means to do this then carefully remove the wires from the capacitor terminals noting where each came from and connect in some new 450 volt ones of the correct value.

Mike

[Station X]

I thought it was worth a try as it can be done without applying power.

I think the OP is going to need a more detailed explanation regarding checking the neutral connection, measuring the voltage and reforming capacitors.

['LIVEWIRE?']

The motor will spin as soon as the switch is set to the 'on' position. It is designed to do this in order that the valve heaters remain powered. This is true of all 'live chassis' record player circuits where the motor winding is used to drop the incoming AC mains to the 90v or so required by the valve heaters. As to the 25uf Cap., the nearest modern equivalents are 22 or 33uf, but a 47uf of suitable working voltage will also suffice as a replacement. Frank, I didn't think about the motor possibly drawing more current than the 100mA required by the valve heaters!!

[Station X]

Originally Posted by crackle

I don't think it is possible to test a metal rectifier with a DMM diode function. Mike

I tested a SenTerCel rectifier using the diode function of a DMM and couldn't get sensible readings. However testing using a high ohms range showed a considerable difference between the forward and reverse resistance measurements. So resistance testing is the way to go.

[parlourtw73vs]

Back again, sorry to be a little late but we've been making preparations for the New Year and later this afternoon will be going over to our daughters to spend New Years Eve. there. This will be my last post until sometime tomorrow so apologies in advance but any more help is most welcome and will be carefully read later. Thanks for the congrats. stationx but all I did was move 2 leads, I think the real accolades go to Lawrence for his patience and efforts. This really begs the question as to why the leads were incorrect in the first place. They obviously weren't like that to begin with, it's such an elementary mistake that it's hard to believe that any competent repair man would have made, therefore either the previous owners had had a poke around and switched them or I've inadvertently switched them. When I removed the turntable for servicing I made a sketch of the pin positions and replaced them according to that sketch, but could I have made a mistake? Who knows. Stationx I've had a look at that link to check the diodes and would like a little help. I've uploaded some more images and one is of my DMM. Is the position for checking the diodes the one at 6 oclock on its dial? if not, which setting should I use to give the readings you require and presumably I place the probes on the terminals of each. Will I do this with the power on or off?
Crackle, I'm afraid I don't know with certainty what you mean about the mains neutral connection, is it merely checking that the two green wires to the motor are in their correct sockets? IE, should they perhaps need swapping with each other? If not perhaps you could explain further, bearing in mind I'm virtually an electronic virgin.
Included in the images is one photo of some capacitors which I have. I've placed them on a white sheet in such a way as to hopefully allow you to read their values and have numbered them so I can be guided to any which may be of use in replacing those in my circuit.
I've posted an image of what I believe is the smoothing capacitor trying to show its value, is this the one you recommend I replace?
Lastly are 2 images of the ceramic cartridge I have [I actually have 2 of these] and hope someone can advise on their suitability. I also have mounting brackets for these so that shouldn't be a problem.
Sorry for the long post but as I say I really need leading by the hand in this restoration process. With your assistance I seem to have come some way to getting this player back into service and don't wish to be beaten now.
Thanks again, Malc.

[ms660]

If it were mine I'd check that the output transformer is viable and if so replace the metal rectifiers with a single silicon rectifier, those old rectifiers shouldn't be connected in parallel anyways, I would also replace all the electrolytics and the rest of the capacitors (some should be Y Class types) also the output valves cathode bias resistor, others might take a different view but that's my take on it.

Good luck whicheverways.

Lawrence.

[Station X]

MAINS NEUTRAL TEST.

Player UNPLUGGED from the mains supply, but switched ON.

Set your meter to the 200R range, that's next to the 2k range. Confirm that the meter is working by touching the leads together whereupon a zero or near zero reading should be displayed.

Connect either meter lead to the player's metal chassis. Connect the other meter lead to the LIVE and NEUTRAL pins of the mains plug in turn noting the two readings.

If the NEUTRAL pin gives the lowest reading then all is well. If the LIVE pin gives the lowest reading, then swop over the wires on the LIVE and NEUTRAL pins within the plug and repeat the test.