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Vintage Audio (record players, hi-fi etc) Amplifiers, speakers, gramophones and other audio equipment.

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Old 23rd Nov 2019, 10:49 pm   #1
deedawales
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Default Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

Hi once more, didn't think I'd be back so soon, but I've inherited a BCR record player with a BSR UA15 deck and a pickup still fitted with a TC 8M cartridge that had died. I replaced the cartridge with a BSR SC12H and now have a decent sounding machine, except when the volume is turned to maximum which creates a loud, high pitched squeal, a little bit like a a referee's whistle with a vibrating pea inside. Would this be caused by the new cartridge being the wrong type for this player? Should I have looked through the existing information on the Forum for the answer before posting this? If so, I apologise for my laziness.
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Old 24th Nov 2019, 12:09 am   #2
Edward Huggins
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

The replacement cartridge is the right type for your record player. It's just that now the amplifier is now being better driven, it is likely to be putting pressure on the HT power supply. If it is a BRC player is is likely to be valved. Please supply more details and photos.
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Old 24th Nov 2019, 1:03 am   #3
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

What is the model number?
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Old 24th Nov 2019, 11:42 am   #4
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

Just a thought..... you've replaced a medium output cartridge by a high output type. Maybe it's acoustic feedback from speaker to cartridge? Is the deck floating on its springs correctly and not physically touching the cabinet anywhere?
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Old 24th Nov 2019, 1:21 pm   #5
Edward Huggins
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

The BR SC12H, in spite of the "H" suffix, is not a high-output type. It may be highish for a Ceramic type, but gives less than half of the output of the one it replaces.
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Old 24th Nov 2019, 4:35 pm   #6
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

Absolutely correct on that one, Edward. Many people seem to think that the ceramic BSR SC12H cartridge is a high output type due to it's 'H' suffix, but as you say, it's pretty much equivalent to a medium 'M' suffix crystal cartridge. However, what Chris says regarding acoustic feedback is certainly worth looking into, although it's usually more of a low pitched sound than that being described by the OP. The fault described sounds like some sort of instability oscillation type effect - I suppose it's possible that with marginal design by the original manufacturer, that the slightly different loading of the replacement cartridge could have some effect and cause the circuit to go unstable at a certain setting of the volume pot.
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Old 25th Nov 2019, 10:22 pm   #7
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

Many thanks one and all, a few things for me to take on board, though "instability of oscillation" is a little above my head! I'll do my best to supply a picture or two along with the relevant model numbers. It may take me a little time, but I will return!
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Old 30th Nov 2019, 10:23 pm   #8
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

Hi everybody, not sure if I've uploaded the photos of my BCR record player correctly, fingers crossed! The model number appears to be 2014-3272 (it's the only one I've found). I've checked the deck and it appears to be positioned correctly. I hope the photos are of some help or interest.
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Old 30th Nov 2019, 10:25 pm   #9
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

Having seen how my picture have appeared on my post, it looks like I need some tuition on how to submit them correctly.
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Old 30th Nov 2019, 10:47 pm   #10
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

Although a slightly older model with a UA8 record deck the layout of the PCB and valves which from the photos look like UCL83’s look very similar to the Ferguson 394G, service info available from .
https://www.service-data.com/product...02/2525/m11902
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Old 1st Dec 2019, 12:00 am   #11
Edward Huggins
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player

Yes, this is essentially the same amplifier and capable of very good quality sound.
Although this BRC (not BCR) model is from as "late" as 1961/62 - don't let that old finned rectifier put you off. It can give 6 watts on a good day!
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Old 1st Dec 2019, 2:06 am   #12
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

It's a BRC as Edward says, and 2014 is the model number: https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ad.php?t=45641
Beware, this is a live chassis player, so it is essential that the mains plug is correctly wired. It appears to have the old red/black colour code, so the red wire is live (fused pin).
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Old 1st Dec 2019, 10:50 am   #13
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

Sorry that is not a UA15 it is a UA14
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Old 1st Dec 2019, 5:27 pm   #14
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

Looking at your photos, there are several Hunts black capacitors and some wax types that need replacement and might be the cause of your problem. You are also running the risk of destroying the output transformer if they are not replaced.
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Old 3rd Dec 2019, 10:01 pm   #15
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

Once again, very informative replies from you guys (apologies if any of you are gals) I have taken note of the danger these players can present, put the wind up me a bit regarding replacing capacitors, which are items I confess are beyond my capabilities. Furthermore, I'm slightly puzzled regarding the mains electrical lead, where the red wire is live and must go to the fused pin in the plug, yet that seems to be contradicted by the suggestion that just switching live and neutrals is not the way to make the wiring safe? Maybe it's my inability to grasp the subject that's the problem, after all, I got the deck model number wrong. Thanks for your patience folks.
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Old 3rd Dec 2019, 11:08 pm   #16
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

With 'live chassis' equipment it's important to ensure that the mains lead is wired the correct way round, with Neutral to chassis and live (or phase as some insist on calling it) to the on/off switch and from there on to the rectifier, usually in the case of a record player via a series resistor. If a double pole on/off switch is fitted make sure that the neutral lead is connected to chassis via one pole. As your player is fitted with the old type of mains lead, note that the Red lead is 'live',and the black lead is Neutral. As others have said, please ensure that the mains lead is correctly wired in the plug, and that a 3 Amp. plug fuse is fitted. These are important safety requirements. Changing capacitors and other faulty components is straightforward of you know what you are doing, and have a good quality soldering iron and a multimeter, but if you are unsure, then, again, for safety reasons it's better to take the player to someone more knowledgeable, such a another forum member in your area, for repair.
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Old 4th Dec 2019, 10:26 am   #17
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

Looking at picture 5 in post#8, I would be inclined to physically check that the black wire in the mains lead does in fact end up connected to the chassis (via any switch contact that may be on route). If those inline crimps hide a "crossover" they'll need to be redone!
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Old 12th Dec 2019, 9:48 pm   #18
deedawales
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

Hello again,
I'm beginning to think that "Livewire" has made a good suggestion when advises taking the machine to some knowledgeable member in my area, the only problem with that is the fact that I don't know if such a person exists. Should any member know of someone in the area between Cardiff and Swansea I would appreciate knowing how to make contact, naturally, I wouldn't expect anyone to give up their time at this busy period, 2020 would be soon enough.

Cheers, guys.
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Old 12th Dec 2019, 9:52 pm   #19
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

In the repairs offered section there is someone in Cardiff, don’t know the cost.
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Old 22nd Dec 2019, 10:54 pm   #20
deedawales
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Default Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player

Thanks for that Frank, I'll have a look at that.

Terry
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