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Vintage Audio (record players, hi-fi etc) Amplifiers, speakers, gramophones and other audio equipment. |
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23rd Nov 2019, 10:49 pm | #1 |
Triode
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Mid Glamorgan, Wales, UK.
Posts: 18
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Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
Hi once more, didn't think I'd be back so soon, but I've inherited a BCR record player with a BSR UA15 deck and a pickup still fitted with a TC 8M cartridge that had died. I replaced the cartridge with a BSR SC12H and now have a decent sounding machine, except when the volume is turned to maximum which creates a loud, high pitched squeal, a little bit like a a referee's whistle with a vibrating pea inside. Would this be caused by the new cartridge being the wrong type for this player? Should I have looked through the existing information on the Forum for the answer before posting this? If so, I apologise for my laziness.
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24th Nov 2019, 12:09 am | #2 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK.
Posts: 8,302
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
The replacement cartridge is the right type for your record player. It's just that now the amplifier is now being better driven, it is likely to be putting pressure on the HT power supply. If it is a BRC player is is likely to be valved. Please supply more details and photos.
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Edward. |
24th Nov 2019, 1:03 am | #3 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Heckmondwike, West Yorkshire, UK.
Posts: 9,637
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
What is the model number?
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24th Nov 2019, 11:42 am | #4 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK.
Posts: 16,528
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
Just a thought..... you've replaced a medium output cartridge by a high output type. Maybe it's acoustic feedback from speaker to cartridge? Is the deck floating on its springs correctly and not physically touching the cabinet anywhere?
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24th Nov 2019, 1:21 pm | #5 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK.
Posts: 8,302
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
The BR SC12H, in spite of the "H" suffix, is not a high-output type. It may be highish for a Ceramic type, but gives less than half of the output of the one it replaces.
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Edward. |
24th Nov 2019, 4:35 pm | #6 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lincolnshire, UK.
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
Absolutely correct on that one, Edward. Many people seem to think that the ceramic BSR SC12H cartridge is a high output type due to it's 'H' suffix, but as you say, it's pretty much equivalent to a medium 'M' suffix crystal cartridge. However, what Chris says regarding acoustic feedback is certainly worth looking into, although it's usually more of a low pitched sound than that being described by the OP. The fault described sounds like some sort of instability oscillation type effect - I suppose it's possible that with marginal design by the original manufacturer, that the slightly different loading of the replacement cartridge could have some effect and cause the circuit to go unstable at a certain setting of the volume pot.
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25th Nov 2019, 10:22 pm | #7 |
Triode
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Mid Glamorgan, Wales, UK.
Posts: 18
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
Many thanks one and all, a few things for me to take on board, though "instability of oscillation" is a little above my head! I'll do my best to supply a picture or two along with the relevant model numbers. It may take me a little time, but I will return!
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30th Nov 2019, 10:23 pm | #8 |
Triode
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Mid Glamorgan, Wales, UK.
Posts: 18
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
Hi everybody, not sure if I've uploaded the photos of my BCR record player correctly, fingers crossed! The model number appears to be 2014-3272 (it's the only one I've found). I've checked the deck and it appears to be positioned correctly. I hope the photos are of some help or interest.
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30th Nov 2019, 10:25 pm | #9 |
Triode
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Mid Glamorgan, Wales, UK.
Posts: 18
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
Having seen how my picture have appeared on my post, it looks like I need some tuition on how to submit them correctly.
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30th Nov 2019, 10:47 pm | #10 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Wigan, Greater Manchester, UK.
Posts: 9,428
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
Although a slightly older model with a UA8 record deck the layout of the PCB and valves which from the photos look like UCL83’s look very similar to the Ferguson 394G, service info available from .
https://www.service-data.com/product...02/2525/m11902
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Frank |
1st Dec 2019, 12:00 am | #11 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK.
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Re: Volume control fault on BCR record player
Yes, this is essentially the same amplifier and capable of very good quality sound.
Although this BRC (not BCR) model is from as "late" as 1961/62 - don't let that old finned rectifier put you off. It can give 6 watts on a good day!
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Edward. |
1st Dec 2019, 2:06 am | #12 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Heckmondwike, West Yorkshire, UK.
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
It's a BRC as Edward says, and 2014 is the model number: https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ad.php?t=45641
Beware, this is a live chassis player, so it is essential that the mains plug is correctly wired. It appears to have the old red/black colour code, so the red wire is live (fused pin). |
1st Dec 2019, 10:50 am | #13 |
Heptode
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Coventry, West Midlands, UK.
Posts: 518
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
Sorry that is not a UA15 it is a UA14
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1st Dec 2019, 5:27 pm | #14 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: East Sussex, UK.
Posts: 3,315
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
Looking at your photos, there are several Hunts black capacitors and some wax types that need replacement and might be the cause of your problem. You are also running the risk of destroying the output transformer if they are not replaced.
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3rd Dec 2019, 10:01 pm | #15 |
Triode
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Mid Glamorgan, Wales, UK.
Posts: 18
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
Once again, very informative replies from you guys (apologies if any of you are gals) I have taken note of the danger these players can present, put the wind up me a bit regarding replacing capacitors, which are items I confess are beyond my capabilities. Furthermore, I'm slightly puzzled regarding the mains electrical lead, where the red wire is live and must go to the fused pin in the plug, yet that seems to be contradicted by the suggestion that just switching live and neutrals is not the way to make the wiring safe? Maybe it's my inability to grasp the subject that's the problem, after all, I got the deck model number wrong. Thanks for your patience folks.
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3rd Dec 2019, 11:08 pm | #16 |
Rest in Peace
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: N.W. Oxfordshire(Chipping Norton)
Posts: 7,306
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
With 'live chassis' equipment it's important to ensure that the mains lead is wired the correct way round, with Neutral to chassis and live (or phase as some insist on calling it) to the on/off switch and from there on to the rectifier, usually in the case of a record player via a series resistor. If a double pole on/off switch is fitted make sure that the neutral lead is connected to chassis via one pole. As your player is fitted with the old type of mains lead, note that the Red lead is 'live',and the black lead is Neutral. As others have said, please ensure that the mains lead is correctly wired in the plug, and that a 3 Amp. plug fuse is fitted. These are important safety requirements. Changing capacitors and other faulty components is straightforward of you know what you are doing, and have a good quality soldering iron and a multimeter, but if you are unsure, then, again, for safety reasons it's better to take the player to someone more knowledgeable, such a another forum member in your area, for repair.
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4th Dec 2019, 10:26 am | #17 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK.
Posts: 16,528
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
Looking at picture 5 in post#8, I would be inclined to physically check that the black wire in the mains lead does in fact end up connected to the chassis (via any switch contact that may be on route). If those inline crimps hide a "crossover" they'll need to be redone!
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....__________ ....|____||__|__\_____ .=.| _---\__|__|_---_|. .........O..Chris....O |
12th Dec 2019, 9:48 pm | #18 |
Triode
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Mid Glamorgan, Wales, UK.
Posts: 18
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
Hello again,
I'm beginning to think that "Livewire" has made a good suggestion when advises taking the machine to some knowledgeable member in my area, the only problem with that is the fact that I don't know if such a person exists. Should any member know of someone in the area between Cardiff and Swansea I would appreciate knowing how to make contact, naturally, I wouldn't expect anyone to give up their time at this busy period, 2020 would be soon enough. Cheers, guys. |
12th Dec 2019, 9:52 pm | #19 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Wigan, Greater Manchester, UK.
Posts: 9,428
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
In the repairs offered section there is someone in Cardiff, don’t know the cost.
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Frank |
22nd Dec 2019, 10:54 pm | #20 |
Triode
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Mid Glamorgan, Wales, UK.
Posts: 18
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Re: Volume control fault on BRC 2014 record player
Thanks for that Frank, I'll have a look at that.
Terry |