Cartridge recommendations. - Page 3 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

mcourtman · 12th Feb 2018, 12:56 am

Yes, just the edge of the cartridge, however it makes an awful noise a bit like an electric planer

mcourtman · 12th Feb 2018, 12:58 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bikerhifinut

some links,
https://www.vinylengine.com/cartridg...tractors.shtml

http://www.styli.co.nz/protractor.pdf

theres more but the second one is nice and simple. Print it out on a piece of card and punch the spindle hole CAREFULLY and away you go!

Andy

Thanks for these links Andy. I printed out the 'simple' one as suggested and have posted two pictures - one of each of the two stylus 'locations'.

I think it looks reasonably ok?

D_S_J_R · 12th Feb 2018, 12:02 pm

That looks well set, as long as the distance from this 'point' is 60mm from disc centre as SME used to use. if it's 65-66mm as modern arms (including SME use now), I'm sure it doesn't matter but some audio types seem to think there's a sonic difference..

The shell as viewed from the side, should look parallel to the record surface. I appreciate ones eyes play tricks (my eyes are awful and I had to compensate when setting tonearms up and get colleagues to confirm), but the pictures you posted seemed to suggest the headshell from the side wasn't as parallel as the arm tube is and was causing the cartridge to look down at the back, which would give the issues you describe when playing singles (I'd rather you didn't with this cartridge unless they're proper 12" singles

)

The whole thing about tonearm/cartridge set up is that you should only need to do this once with an SME and it won't drift off over subsequent years..

Another can of worms, but I'll mention it anyway. Check with Loricraft, but the Garrard 401 may need its main bearing and idler bearings lightly lubricated. I'm not going to dare to suggest what oils to use (I got into trouble here last time!) but Loricraft, who know these decks backwards, should be able to recommend suitable *safe* lubricants. I'd also avoid after-market bearing 'mods' as these are often done by people with no knowledge of WHY the original was conceived the way it is - full replacement bearings complete may be a different matter though but it's unknown territory for me...

Edward Huggins · 12th Feb 2018, 3:37 pm

Is that Headshell deformed/damaged? There should be no reason for it to be canted up like that at the front. The top of the headshell should be parallel to the record surface as with the arm.

ToneArm · 12th Feb 2018, 9:16 pm

Funny, when I used the G1042 it would bottom out from time to time as well. My copy of UB40’s Present Arms had a warped edge and it wouldn’t play the first track (which annoyingly was the excellent One in Ten!).
Glyn

bikerhifinut · 12th Feb 2018, 10:20 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Huggins

Is that Headshell deformed/damaged? There should be no reason for it to be canted up like that at the front. The top of the headshell should be parallel to the record surface as with the arm.

I think its just the camera angle looking at that front view. The g1042 has a sloping front which can look a bit strange.
I have no knowledge of genuine SME headshells but I am sure it was mentioned earlier that the underneath of the headshell isnt completely flat, or did I get that wrong? If thats the case then it might be an idea to use a couple of shallow spacers between headshell and cartridge base as the G1042 has a very flat square mounting face to the underneath of the headshell. This could "cant" the cartridge at an angle and make it prone to grounding at the rear on the record surface.
Apologies if I misunderstood.

Yes the G1042, like many other modern cartridges rides low on the record surface making it difficult if impossible to ride bad warps. My ortofon is, if anything, worse. I need to adjust my arm to its maximum height on the pillar to get that to sit correctly on the record and even then the gap between cartridge body and record surface is very small. That said if the warp is that bad, the reproduction is going to be badly compromised anyway.

The only way we are going to tell from a picture if the top of the headshell is riding horizontal would be for Matt to take a photo side on with something like a piece of card with horizontal lines drawn on it behind and square to the headshell. With the camera lens at the same height as the headshell and set level to attempt to cancel any parallax errors.

A.

mcourtman · 12th Feb 2018, 10:54 pm

Hi,

I'm playing an LP and am using a weight which has parallel lines going around it. I've tried to capture a photo from the side of the headshell to see if the headshell looks aligned correctly.

It's not the best picture, but I find it very difficult to take a good one. But it looks reasonably ok to my poor eyes!

Ted Kendall · 12th Feb 2018, 11:23 pm

A very slight nose-up attitude is not unknown with the single-pin SME headshell when used with a compliant washer - I'd say that's OK. The later double pin shell pulls in dead level.

bikerhifinut · 12th Feb 2018, 11:34 pm

looks ok to me Matt.
A quick check you could do is to simply check the distance from the top of the headshell to record surface and do this at the front and rear of the headshell. Obviously both distances should be the same. It goes without saying that you should have the platter stopped at this time!

The shape of the headshell can play tricks with the eyes due to the slope of the bottom edge. The lined card trick is a nice one, but you need to do that at the start of the LP and have the card or paper close behind the headshell/arm wand. A bit of graph paper does nicely if you have any to hand.
Are you running the 1042 at 1.75g or thereabouts as recommended by Goldring?

Good luck with sourcing a replacement Shure, I saw a few on the usual site at reasonable prices and a couple with "fantasy island" pricing!

Looks like my post got crossed with Ted's. I wouldn't get worried about the cartridge being slightly canted back, as long as it clears the LP's you play.

A.

bikerhifinut · 12th Feb 2018, 11:39 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ted Kendall

A very slight nose-up attitude is not unknown with the single-pin SME headshell when used with a compliant washer - I'd say that's OK. The later double pin shell pulls in dead level.

That's interesting and useful, thanks Ted.

A.

RojDW48 · 13th Feb 2018, 1:07 am

I hate to disagree but that still looks wrong to me - the headshell is the business end and that should be parallel with the disc surface - even if that means creating a tiny angle in the tonearm - or maybe the cartridge isn't quite right in the headshell?

D_S_J_R · 13th Feb 2018, 12:41 pm

The headshell is slightly curvy-tapered towards the rear as seen from the top and this'll play tricks with a static picture.

Having started all this, the Rega decks which sounded so good with these 10** models (1012GX in Planar 2 and 1042 in Planar 3) had the 'RB' arms slightly down at the back (a Rega can of worms I won't go into) and in fact many cartridges din't mind this way of use I remember unless they're terminally dull in sound.

Since this arm has the detachable shell, may I suggest the OP buys a Technics-style shell for 45rpm singles and fits something like a Rega Carbon or posher, a Goldring E1 or E2 which appear to be AT based. With some ingenuity, it may be possible to match masses so the 1042 can still track at 1.75g or so and the others suggested above around 2g for singles without re-balancing the arm...

bikerhifinut · 13th Feb 2018, 7:00 pm

I think Matt is sourcing a replacement M7ED body for his other headshell so that will solve the issue of what to play singles on? He's got or will receive shortly a new set of headshell "pigtail" leads for it so hopefully Matt will be a happy bunny as I got the impression that he likes the Shure in that arm. And who are we to say otherwise?

Matt, if you get stuck for a replacement M75ED body give me a yell and I might be persuaded to part with mine as it isn't really suited to my Rega arms. I promise it will be cheaper than ebay!

Andy.

mcourtman · 13th Feb 2018, 9:38 pm

Hi,

Andy is quite correct - I have took the plunge and purchased a replacement Shure M75ED cartridge which I look forward to receiving soon. I personally prefer the sound of the Shure, yes the Goldring has more clarity but I prefer the warmer sound of the Shure which I suppose I have gotten used to over many years.

Thanks to Andy I also have a nice new set of headshell leads which I have fitted to my existing Shure cartridge just to make sure the old leads were not a fault. But sadly the problem remained, but these will be a great partner for my new cartridge.

Thanks again for everyone's advice.

Best wishes,

Matt

paulsherwin · 13th Feb 2018, 9:55 pm

The Shure M75 series did have a distinctive sound which many people liked, especially in the US. They became very unfashionable in the late 70s when they started to attract 'damning with faint praise' reviews in the hifi mags. The arrival of CDs made toppier cartridges more popular in the 80s, before everybody lost interest in vinyl for about 20 years.

bikerhifinut · 13th Feb 2018, 10:35 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulsherwin

The Shure M75 series did have a distinctive sound which many people liked, especially in the US. They became very unfashionable in the late 70s when they started to attract 'damning with faint praise' reviews in the hifi mags. The arrival of CDs made toppier cartridges more popular in the 80s, before everybody lost interest in vinyl for about 20 years.

Around the time that low mass arms went out of fashion Paul? I always liked the M75ED in our Pioneer PL12D and it still performs nicely in dad's stereo.
It doesn't sound over warm in my setup though.

For the record I never lost interest in vinyl, guess I was a diehard with a few LPs.

A

paulsherwin · 13th Feb 2018, 10:47 pm

Only the mainstream hifi market lost interest in vinyl. There were always enthusiasts, but they were a very small market - that's why most 90s integrated hifi amps don't have a mag cartridge input.

PJL · 13th Feb 2018, 11:27 pm

I have attached an image of a 1042 sitting correctly on a record. To me it looks like the headshell is not parallel to the record surface but it could be a damaged stylus?

lazythread · 14th Feb 2018, 9:03 am

I returned to the Shure M75 after a couple of decades with more modern moving magnet and moving coil cartridges. A worthwhile, but expensive, upgrade is the Jico SAS profiled stylus which really is a game-changer and brings the cartridge bang up to date in my opinion.

In the picture you can see how tiny the Jico cantilever is in comparison to the genuine Shure N75EJ next to it and the Shure N75ED on the right. I have to stress that this is just my opinion.

bikerhifinut · 14th Feb 2018, 6:08 pm

The standard Jico elliptical replacement has a very fine cantilever too. It looks a finer piece of kit than the OE. And certainly the M75ED sounds very smooth and more refined with the standard JICO.
Not sure about spending the huge amount of extra dosh on the SAS stylus for an M75 though.
A V15 though would be a different animal. In the right arm.

A.

12th Feb 2018, 12:56 am	#41
mcourtman Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Ely, Cambridgeshire, UK. Posts: 47	Re: Cartridge recomendations Yes, just the edge of the cartridge, however it makes an awful noise a bit like an electric planer

12th Feb 2018, 12:02 pm	#43
D_S_J_R Heptode Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Suffolk Coastal, UK. Posts: 603	Re: Cartridge recomendations That looks well set, as long as the distance from this 'point' is 60mm from disc centre as SME used to use. if it's 65-66mm as modern arms (including SME use now), I'm sure it doesn't matter but some audio types seem to think there's a sonic difference.. The shell as viewed from the side, should look parallel to the record surface. I appreciate ones eyes play tricks (my eyes are awful and I had to compensate when setting tonearms up and get colleagues to confirm), but the pictures you posted seemed to suggest the headshell from the side wasn't as parallel as the arm tube is and was causing the cartridge to look down at the back, which would give the issues you describe when playing singles (I'd rather you didn't with this cartridge unless they're proper 12" singles ) The whole thing about tonearm/cartridge set up is that you should only need to do this once with an SME and it won't drift off over subsequent years.. Another can of worms, but I'll mention it anyway. Check with Loricraft, but the Garrard 401 may need its main bearing and idler bearings lightly lubricated. I'm not going to dare to suggest what oils to use (I got into trouble here last time!) but Loricraft, who know these decks backwards, should be able to recommend suitable safe lubricants. I'd also avoid after-market bearing 'mods' as these are often done by people with no knowledge of WHY the original was conceived the way it is - full replacement bearings complete may be a different matter though but it's unknown territory for me... __________________ Best wishes, Dave

12th Feb 2018, 3:37 pm	#44
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 8,328	Re: Cartridge recomendations Is that Headshell deformed/damaged? There should be no reason for it to be canted up like that at the front. The top of the headshell should be parallel to the record surface as with the arm. __________________ Edward.

12th Feb 2018, 9:16 pm	#45
ToneArm Pentode Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Conwy, Clwyd, UK. Posts: 246	Re: Cartridge recomendations Funny, when I used the G1042 it would bottom out from time to time as well. My copy of UB40’s Present Arms had a warped edge and it wouldn’t play the first track (which annoyingly was the excellent One in Ten!). Glyn

12th Feb 2018, 10:54 pm	#47
mcourtman Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Ely, Cambridgeshire, UK. Posts: 47	Re: Cartridge recomendations Hi, I'm playing an LP and am using a weight which has parallel lines going around it. I've tried to capture a photo from the side of the headshell to see if the headshell looks aligned correctly. It's not the best picture, but I find it very difficult to take a good one. But it looks reasonably ok to my poor eyes! Attached Thumbnails

12th Feb 2018, 11:23 pm	#48
Ted Kendall Dekatron Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Kington, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 3,670	Re: Cartridge recomendations A very slight nose-up attitude is not unknown with the single-pin SME headshell when used with a compliant washer - I'd say that's OK. The later double pin shell pulls in dead level.

12th Feb 2018, 11:34 pm	#49
bikerhifinut Octode Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: Penrith, Cumbria, UK Posts: 1,993	Re: Cartridge recomendations looks ok to me Matt. A quick check you could do is to simply check the distance from the top of the headshell to record surface and do this at the front and rear of the headshell. Obviously both distances should be the same. It goes without saying that you should have the platter stopped at this time! The shape of the headshell can play tricks with the eyes due to the slope of the bottom edge. The lined card trick is a nice one, but you need to do that at the start of the LP and have the card or paper close behind the headshell/arm wand. A bit of graph paper does nicely if you have any to hand. Are you running the 1042 at 1.75g or thereabouts as recommended by Goldring? Good luck with sourcing a replacement Shure, I saw a few on the usual site at reasonable prices and a couple with "fantasy island" pricing! Looks like my post got crossed with Ted's. I wouldn't get worried about the cartridge being slightly canted back, as long as it clears the LP's you play. A. Last edited by bikerhifinut; 12th Feb 2018 at 11:38 pm. Reason: crossed posts.

13th Feb 2018, 1:07 am	#51
RojDW48 Nonode Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 2,074	Re: Cartridge recomendations I hate to disagree but that still looks wrong to me - the headshell is the business end and that should be parallel with the disc surface - even if that means creating a tiny angle in the tonearm - or maybe the cartridge isn't quite right in the headshell? __________________ '....don't go mistaking Paradise for that home across the road!' (Bob Dylan)

13th Feb 2018, 12:41 pm	#52
D_S_J_R Heptode Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Suffolk Coastal, UK. Posts: 603	Re: Cartridge recomendations The headshell is slightly curvy-tapered towards the rear as seen from the top and this'll play tricks with a static picture. Having started all this, the Rega decks which sounded so good with these 10** models (1012GX in Planar 2 and 1042 in Planar 3) had the 'RB' arms slightly down at the back (a Rega can of worms I won't go into) and in fact many cartridges din't mind this way of use I remember unless they're terminally dull in sound. Since this arm has the detachable shell, may I suggest the OP buys a Technics-style shell for 45rpm singles and fits something like a Rega Carbon or posher, a Goldring E1 or E2 which appear to be AT based. With some ingenuity, it may be possible to match masses so the 1042 can still track at 1.75g or so and the others suggested above around 2g for singles without re-balancing the arm... __________________ Best wishes, Dave

13th Feb 2018, 7:00 pm	#53
bikerhifinut Octode Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: Penrith, Cumbria, UK Posts: 1,993	Re: Cartridge recomendations I think Matt is sourcing a replacement M7ED body for his other headshell so that will solve the issue of what to play singles on? He's got or will receive shortly a new set of headshell "pigtail" leads for it so hopefully Matt will be a happy bunny as I got the impression that he likes the Shure in that arm. And who are we to say otherwise? Matt, if you get stuck for a replacement M75ED body give me a yell and I might be persuaded to part with mine as it isn't really suited to my Rega arms. I promise it will be cheaper than ebay! Andy.

13th Feb 2018, 9:38 pm	#54
mcourtman Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Ely, Cambridgeshire, UK. Posts: 47	Re: Cartridge recomendations Hi, Andy is quite correct - I have took the plunge and purchased a replacement Shure M75ED cartridge which I look forward to receiving soon. I personally prefer the sound of the Shure, yes the Goldring has more clarity but I prefer the warmer sound of the Shure which I suppose I have gotten used to over many years. Thanks to Andy I also have a nice new set of headshell leads which I have fitted to my existing Shure cartridge just to make sure the old leads were not a fault. But sadly the problem remained, but these will be a great partner for my new cartridge. Thanks again for everyone's advice. Best wishes, Matt

13th Feb 2018, 9:55 pm	#55
paulsherwin Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Oxford, UK Posts: 27,947	Re: Cartridge recomendations The Shure M75 series did have a distinctive sound which many people liked, especially in the US. They became very unfashionable in the late 70s when they started to attract 'damning with faint praise' reviews in the hifi mags. The arrival of CDs made toppier cartridges more popular in the 80s, before everybody lost interest in vinyl for about 20 years.

13th Feb 2018, 10:47 pm	#57
paulsherwin Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Oxford, UK Posts: 27,947	Re: Cartridge recomendations Only the mainstream hifi market lost interest in vinyl. There were always enthusiasts, but they were a very small market - that's why most 90s integrated hifi amps don't have a mag cartridge input.

13th Feb 2018, 11:27 pm	#58
PJL Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Seaford, East Sussex, UK. Posts: 5,997	Re: Cartridge recomendations I have attached an image of a 1042 sitting correctly on a record. To me it looks like the headshell is not parallel to the record surface but it could be a damaged stylus? Attached Thumbnails

14th Feb 2018, 9:03 am	#59
lazythread Pentode Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Berkshire, UK. Posts: 124	Re: Cartridge recomendations I returned to the Shure M75 after a couple of decades with more modern moving magnet and moving coil cartridges. A worthwhile, but expensive, upgrade is the Jico SAS profiled stylus which really is a game-changer and brings the cartridge bang up to date in my opinion. In the picture you can see how tiny the Jico cantilever is in comparison to the genuine Shure N75EJ next to it and the Shure N75ED on the right. I have to stress that this is just my opinion. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Richard It's great when it goes around to make a sound.

14th Feb 2018, 6:08 pm	#60
bikerhifinut Octode Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: Penrith, Cumbria, UK Posts: 1,993	Re: Cartridge recomendations The standard Jico elliptical replacement has a very fine cantilever too. It looks a finer piece of kit than the OE. And certainly the M75ED sounds very smooth and more refined with the standard JICO. Not sure about spending the huge amount of extra dosh on the SAS stylus for an M75 though. A V15 though would be a different animal. In the right arm. A.