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Old 22nd Apr 2021, 8:14 pm   #21
stacman
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Not a TV engineer by any stretch, but it looks like the type of fault that occurs on a modern LCD type display, like poor edge connectors on the panel, very odd..
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Old 23rd Apr 2021, 12:08 am   #22
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

I have no idea about anything about these sets, so i may be way out here, but if it does have a tuning indicator, could it possibly be that the circuitry is playing up a bit and trying to generate a line of some sorts?

I'll be following this thread with interest as I do quite like these sets

Good luck with it

'77
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Old 23rd Apr 2021, 6:24 am   #23
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

The TV does not have an auto tuning band. I still think it's a decoupling problem. I think it's non-remote with manual tuning. 30 years since I've seen one of these.....

If it was mine I would have scoped the supply rails by now.......
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Old 23rd Apr 2021, 7:26 am   #24
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sideband View Post
I still think it's a decoupling problem.

If it was mine I would have scoped the supply rails by now.......
Absolutely agree!

My first thought when I saw the fault was decoupling to the RGB output stages. Even though it looks a little different to how that fault normally looks and the line is very narrow, the picture disturbance is still happening at line rate.

Therefore it's most likely to be line rate hash on one or more supply rails that are derived from the line output stage.

The other possibility is pick up from the line stage by the leads going to the tube base PCB. Less likely I know on a modern TV rather than a valve line O/P stage, but still theoretically possible.

Will be interested to see what it turns out to be! Reminds me of the monthly 'test case' in 'Television' magazine!

Cheers
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Old 23rd Apr 2021, 9:53 am   #25
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

I recall a similar fault but with horizontal stripes and other odd symptoms that affected patches of the raster in a CTX set of similar vintage. That was solved by resoldering dry joints around the chroma circuit.

Never seen anything like this though.
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Old 23rd Apr 2021, 12:18 pm   #26
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Doesn't the colour decoder use one or more horizontal deflection derived signals for timing? A sandcastle pulse maybe? Might be something wrong there. In any case, the fault seems to be coupled to the horizontal defelection. Could also be some kind of ripple on a horizontal derived supply line.
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Old 23rd Apr 2021, 12:58 pm   #27
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

This is possibly a rare case of Barkenhausen. Does the line remain stationary as you tune the tv throughout the UHF band.
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Old 23rd Apr 2021, 6:29 pm   #28
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maarten View Post
Could also be some kind of ripple on a horizontal derived supply line.
...Which is exactly what I was suggesting when I suggested starting with the 4.7uF decoupler on the 155V rail back in post 17. It's line derived and probably has lots of line-rate spikes on it that shouldn't be there......
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Old 24th Apr 2021, 8:05 am   #29
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

I was thinking more along the lines of a low voltage supply line to the decoder, but could be.
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Old 24th Apr 2021, 7:53 pm   #30
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maarten View Post
I was thinking more along the lines of a low voltage supply line to the decoder, but could be.
Yes...that is why I said to 'start with' the RGB decoupler. It could well be a supply to the decoder also.
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Old 25th Apr 2021, 10:00 am   #31
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Ah yes, I must have missed or forgot the "also try ..." part of your message. Sorry.
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Old 28th Apr 2021, 6:36 pm   #32
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Hi folks. As this set only lives 25 miles away, I offered to have a look at it as it looked like an interesting fault. Anyway it arrived this morning and is now sorted. Annoyingly I have not got a K30 or a manual and worse still, I seem to have lost my 1981/1982 Newenes book.
The set turned out to be a lovely low usage set with a good CRT. I could not see any evidence of a repair, not even the 4.7ohm surge limiter had been replaced. Not bad for a 40 year old set. I remember seeing these when they first came out at a London trade show in one of the big hotels they used to use. We were Pye dealers back then so stocked the Pye version, which in my opinion was the better looking, set. Back in the day they were one of the best for reliability, just let down by short CRT life sadly.
First thing I did was remove the “IF” module, the line was still there so that had eliminated the “IF” and tuner. Next I scoped around the TDA3560 and the Sandcastle pulse, even though it was there and reasonable amplitude did not look right. This pulse is generated in the TDA2571AQ line osc. chip. Luckily I had a new one in stock and it cured the problem line.
So a happy ending for a very nice set.
Cheers David.
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Old 28th Apr 2021, 7:13 pm   #33
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Well done David!
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Old 28th Apr 2021, 7:34 pm   #34
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

We can all sleep soundly now - odd how these faults still turn up to perplex us all even when we thought we knew the sets inside out!
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Old 29th Apr 2021, 12:28 pm   #35
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

The tv is back home with me now all looking great and working fine, turns out it was the tda2571aq chip on the line oscillator module, thankyou so much for everyone's help much appreciated
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Old 29th Apr 2021, 12:30 pm   #36
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Many thanks to David
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Old 29th Apr 2021, 12:31 pm   #37
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Default Re: Philips 22cs1002

Moderators please close thread
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