Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

EyeFinkItzBroke · 16th May 2025, 9:20 pm

Hi all. Sorry to join and come cap-in-hand, but I'm new to vintage tech and this VCR has me stumped.

It's a Ferguson Videostar 3V23 I picked up at RetroTechUK (first time attending). In fairness to the seller, it did work the first time I tested it. While trying to tune it in to a TV a few days later, it ejected the tape uncommanded. This was about one minute into playing. Now it won't accept tapes.

The rollers accept the tape into the basket and lower it down but immediately send it back up and spit the tape out. The belt is a little loose, but the basket does reach the bottom and clicks the microswitch underneath.

The lamp illuminates when switched on and I've cleaned the optical sensors with alcohol.

The loading guides/rollers make no attempt to withdraw tape from the cassette. Winding the loading mechanism by hand confirms a full range of movement with no binding. Interestingly, I can get it to lace the tape and present it to the head if I hold the play button down. The machine seems to get into a "tug of war" with itself trying the both load and unload the tape at the same time. I think this confirms the loading motor, belt, and mechanism are all fine though.

The eject lamp flashes when it's rejecting a tape. Not sure if that's significant. I did take the front panel apart in hope of a sticking eject button. No such luck.

Any help on where I go from here?

George Cooper · 17th May 2025, 7:59 am

Back in the day I worked on a good few of these machines, but I don't recall the issue you describe, you seem to have covered the basic checks fine.

This may be a tad off the wall but I have in the past had a few issues with both TV's and videos doing strange things when placed in a different place, namely are you running any high frequency fluorescent tubes anywhere near the machine, I have found that some of those tubes give off Infra Red interference causing all sorts of issues in the process. With VCR's I had noticed that a tape might be ejected if it gets overloaded with spurious IR. Just a thought, and easy to eliminate.

vidjoman · 17th May 2025, 8:25 am

If trying to make it work with the top off you may need to place a cover over the top of the housing to prevent stray light getting to the sensors.

EyeFinkItzBroke · 17th May 2025, 12:33 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Cooper

This may be a tad off the wall but I have in the past had a few issues with both TV's and videos doing strange things when placed in a different place, namely are you running any high frequency fluorescent tubes anywhere near the machine, I have found that some of those tubes give off Infra Red interference causing all sorts of issues in the process. With VCR's I had noticed that a tape might be ejected if it gets overloaded with spurious IR. Just a thought, and easy to eliminate.

Thanks for the suggestion. Same behaviour in both living room and office though. No fluorescent lights in either.

EyeFinkItzBroke · 17th May 2025, 12:39 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by vidjoman

If trying to make it work with the top off you may need to place a cover over the top of the housing to prevent stray light getting to the sensors.

I don't think ambient light is making a difference here as the behaviour is the same cover on or off. I'll keep this in mind though when testing any changes I make.

EyeFinkItzBroke · 17th May 2025, 12:40 pm

Short demo video of the problem.

http://https://youtu.be/SE3Zr4r6k5w

http://https://youtu.be/3mOUgKnFAXw

agardiner · 17th May 2025, 1:19 pm

Sounds like the machine doesn't properly accept the tape. First thing to check is the loading belt, if it is loose then it might not complete the loading, resulting in rejection of the tape. Also perhaps give the mode switch a little squirt of contact cleaner.

As vidjoman says, stray light entering the sensors with the top cover off will also cause this problem which can result in red herrings when trying to troubleshoot.

John123 · 17th May 2025, 4:59 pm

Agreed, the fault seems pretty immediate so most likely to be loading-related. I'd recommend you try and source a 3V23/ HR7700 belt kit from somewhere and do all of them.

The cassette carriage comes out relatively easily, though can be a bit of a fiddle to refit! Just try not to force anything, or snag the flat-flex going to the indexing head.

dj_fivos_sak · 17th May 2025, 8:32 pm

I seem to recall this happening intermittently on my AKAI VS-10 (same machine). I didn't investigate the cause as it was only rarely happening on mine. Sensing the action of a cassette being pushed in is done by an optical sensor, but sensing of the cassette (carriage) going down is done by a leaf switch or micro switch, located at the right-hand side of the deck, underneath the carriage. I would suggest cleaning that switch and testing it with a multimeter for continuity. If the switch is OK then a syscon fault should be suspected, either a logic problem due to a failed IC or the signal isn't reaching the microprocessor.

Fivos

Spec-chum · 20th May 2025, 2:53 pm

I could be wrong but I seem to recall these machines would either eject the tape, or switch to standby if the timer switch was in the on position and the clock not set.

EyeFinkItzBroke · 22nd May 2025, 1:40 pm

Update on this: I ordered a belt kit and replaced all belts. No dice - still rejects tapes.

I have managed to get it play a tape twice since. Both sessions were interrupted by an uncommanded eject followed by the now familiar behaviour of rejecting tapes. I think this is diagnostically significant as the loading mechanism wasn't active at the onset of the problem behaviour, thus thinking of this as a loading failure is maybe taking the symptom too literally. Would failure in another system prompt an eject?

Only other observation is that the machine seems to have a higher chance of accepting a tape from cold (i.e. when the machine hasn't been used previously that day). Once the ejecting behaviour starts, it repeats until the machine is left for a significant period. Possibly a thermal trigger to the problem?

Welsh Anorak · 23rd May 2025, 10:01 am

Have you tried getting it going then disconnecting the front panel - or specifically the eject switch? Try the easy option first!

John123 · 23rd May 2025, 1:03 pm

Yes definitely look for anything obvious before delving deep into the inner workings of this rather complex beast. The only relevant faults I could find are listed below, but some are likely to be red herrings:

Cassette loading motor unloading all the time:
X10 s/c; X22 o/c on mechacon board

Rejects rewound tape when inserted:
X4 servo 2 panel (inside)

Tape unloads after playing for 2-3 sec:
Photo interruptor (under take-up reel)

'Tape-guard' circuit coming into operation:
Drum pick-up head o/c.

Hope that helps!

EyeFinkItzBroke · 26th May 2025, 9:04 pm

Couple more suspects ruled out. I tried the suggestion of programming the date/time. No change in behaviour. I also tested for actual continuity in the micro switch under the cassette carriage. No continuity when carriage raised. Continuity when carriage lowered. Results appear consistent with a functioning switch.

Front panel wiring soldiered in at the panel end. Followed the wiring as best I could back to a pcb plug, but it's a real rats nest of wires in there and the yellow wire used for the eject button is not unique. Disconnecting disabled the function lights for eject, play etc., so I think I pulled the right one. No change in behaviour.

The more we get into testing circuitry, the more I will need my hand holding.

16th May 2025, 9:20 pm	#1
EyeFinkItzBroke Diode Join Date: May 2025 Location: Oswestry, Shropshire, UK. Posts: 6	Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Hi all. Sorry to join and come cap-in-hand, but I'm new to vintage tech and this VCR has me stumped. It's a Ferguson Videostar 3V23 I picked up at RetroTechUK (first time attending). In fairness to the seller, it did work the first time I tested it. While trying to tune it in to a TV a few days later, it ejected the tape uncommanded. This was about one minute into playing. Now it won't accept tapes. The rollers accept the tape into the basket and lower it down but immediately send it back up and spit the tape out. The belt is a little loose, but the basket does reach the bottom and clicks the microswitch underneath. The lamp illuminates when switched on and I've cleaned the optical sensors with alcohol. The loading guides/rollers make no attempt to withdraw tape from the cassette. Winding the loading mechanism by hand confirms a full range of movement with no binding. Interestingly, I can get it to lace the tape and present it to the head if I hold the play button down. The machine seems to get into a "tug of war" with itself trying the both load and unload the tape at the same time. I think this confirms the loading motor, belt, and mechanism are all fine though. The eject lamp flashes when it's rejecting a tape. Not sure if that's significant. I did take the front panel apart in hope of a sticking eject button. No such luck. Any help on where I go from here?

17th May 2025, 7:59 am	#2
George Cooper Tetrode Join Date: Feb 2022 Location: Falkirk, Stirlingshire, Scotland, UK. Posts: 51	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Back in the day I worked on a good few of these machines, but I don't recall the issue you describe, you seem to have covered the basic checks fine. This may be a tad off the wall but I have in the past had a few issues with both TV's and videos doing strange things when placed in a different place, namely are you running any high frequency fluorescent tubes anywhere near the machine, I have found that some of those tubes give off Infra Red interference causing all sorts of issues in the process. With VCR's I had noticed that a tape might be ejected if it gets overloaded with spurious IR. Just a thought, and easy to eliminate.

17th May 2025, 8:25 am	#3
vidjoman Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: East Sussex, UK. Posts: 3,693	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes If trying to make it work with the top off you may need to place a cover over the top of the housing to prevent stray light getting to the sensors.

17th May 2025, 12:40 pm	#6
EyeFinkItzBroke Diode Join Date: May 2025 Location: Oswestry, Shropshire, UK. Posts: 6	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Short demo video of the problem. http://https://youtu.be/SE3Zr4r6k5w http://https://youtu.be/3mOUgKnFAXw

17th May 2025, 1:19 pm	#7
agardiner Nonode Join Date: Sep 2020 Location: Fakenham, Norfolk, UK. Posts: 2,117	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Sounds like the machine doesn't properly accept the tape. First thing to check is the loading belt, if it is loose then it might not complete the loading, resulting in rejection of the tape. Also perhaps give the mode switch a little squirt of contact cleaner. As vidjoman says, stray light entering the sensors with the top cover off will also cause this problem which can result in red herrings when trying to troubleshoot.

17th May 2025, 4:59 pm	#8
John123 Heptode Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Luton, Bedfordshire, UK. Posts: 930	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Agreed, the fault seems pretty immediate so most likely to be loading-related. I'd recommend you try and source a 3V23/ HR7700 belt kit from somewhere and do all of them. The cassette carriage comes out relatively easily, though can be a bit of a fiddle to refit! Just try not to force anything, or snag the flat-flex going to the indexing head. __________________ Regards, John

17th May 2025, 8:32 pm	#9
dj_fivos_sak Octode Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Lefkada, Greece Posts: 1,081	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes I seem to recall this happening intermittently on my AKAI VS-10 (same machine). I didn't investigate the cause as it was only rarely happening on mine. Sensing the action of a cassette being pushed in is done by an optical sensor, but sensing of the cassette (carriage) going down is done by a leaf switch or micro switch, located at the right-hand side of the deck, underneath the carriage. I would suggest cleaning that switch and testing it with a multimeter for continuity. If the switch is OK then a syscon fault should be suspected, either a logic problem due to a failed IC or the signal isn't reaching the microprocessor. Fivos

20th May 2025, 2:53 pm	#10
Spec-chum Tetrode Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Grantham, Lincolnshire, UK. Posts: 95	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes I could be wrong but I seem to recall these machines would either eject the tape, or switch to standby if the timer switch was in the on position and the clock not set.

22nd May 2025, 1:40 pm	#11
EyeFinkItzBroke Diode Join Date: May 2025 Location: Oswestry, Shropshire, UK. Posts: 6	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Update on this: I ordered a belt kit and replaced all belts. No dice - still rejects tapes. I have managed to get it play a tape twice since. Both sessions were interrupted by an uncommanded eject followed by the now familiar behaviour of rejecting tapes. I think this is diagnostically significant as the loading mechanism wasn't active at the onset of the problem behaviour, thus thinking of this as a loading failure is maybe taking the symptom too literally. Would failure in another system prompt an eject? Only other observation is that the machine seems to have a higher chance of accepting a tape from cold (i.e. when the machine hasn't been used previously that day). Once the ejecting behaviour starts, it repeats until the machine is left for a significant period. Possibly a thermal trigger to the problem?

23rd May 2025, 10:01 am	#12
Welsh Anorak Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: North Wales, UK. Posts: 7,685	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Have you tried getting it going then disconnecting the front panel - or specifically the eject switch? Try the easy option first! __________________ Glyn

23rd May 2025, 1:03 pm	#13
John123 Heptode Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Luton, Bedfordshire, UK. Posts: 930	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Yes definitely look for anything obvious before delving deep into the inner workings of this rather complex beast. The only relevant faults I could find are listed below, but some are likely to be red herrings: Cassette loading motor unloading all the time: X10 s/c; X22 o/c on mechacon board Rejects rewound tape when inserted: X4 servo 2 panel (inside) Tape unloads after playing for 2-3 sec: Photo interruptor (under take-up reel) 'Tape-guard' circuit coming into operation: Drum pick-up head o/c. Hope that helps! __________________ Regards, John

26th May 2025, 9:04 pm	#14
EyeFinkItzBroke Diode Join Date: May 2025 Location: Oswestry, Shropshire, UK. Posts: 6	Re: Ferguson Videostar 3V23 - rejecting tapes Couple more suspects ruled out. I tried the suggestion of programming the date/time. No change in behaviour. I also tested for actual continuity in the micro switch under the cassette carriage. No continuity when carriage raised. Continuity when carriage lowered. Results appear consistent with a functioning switch. Front panel wiring soldiered in at the panel end. Followed the wiring as best I could back to a pcb plug, but it's a real rats nest of wires in there and the yellow wire used for the eject button is not unique. Disconnecting disabled the function lights for eject, play etc., so I think I pulled the right one. No change in behaviour. The more we get into testing circuitry, the more I will need my hand holding.