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Old 8th May 2006, 7:35 pm   #1
ukcol
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Default TV at the NVCF

I know that this has been mentioned in other threads about the NVCF but I feel it deserves a thread of its own.

Well wasn't the Vintage TV display at the NVCF FANTASTIC!!!!!!

Displays of system converters including Kat Manton's PC base experimental system. (Is this a world first?) I saw this early on in the day when it was being display on the small Sony TV and the only imperfections I could see were poor low/zero frequency response which caused some streaking. This though I am confident would be due to the video signal being AC coupled to the CRT in the TV and nothing to do with the converter.

Three, yes 3!!, WORKING mechanical TV systems were on display and were very impressive.

There was also a very good working display of early TVs including 5 pre-war sets. I have never seen a pre-war set working let alone 5.

There were other displays of projection sets, colour TV and so on.

Congratulations to all those involved, I am sure that the Science Museum in South Kensington with all its resources could not have come close to this.
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Old 8th May 2006, 8:21 pm   #2
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Colin, many thanks for the compliments. With much help from David Robinson and Kat Manton we were able to mount a demostration of technologies for producing 405 line pictures. At times we were feeding Kat's pictures to the high quality Prowest monitor. This showed them to be of excellent quality. The little Sony is a very handy receiver/monitor but hardly of professional quality. One minor sadness is that we were not able to get a 405 NTSC colour set to show David Robinson's converter at its best.

Malcolm Everiss was responsible for the signals fed to the main display of sets. Many people supplied sets for the display.

Peter Smith devised the display of mechanical TV.

The only notable absences from the display of standards conversion were Darius's analogue converter and the Jim Daniels's Pineapple of about 1992.

In total we had the following converters:
BBC CO6/509 (static exhibit)
Original multistandard Aurora
New Aurora with modulator
Domino
Dinosaur (static exhibit but could easily have been working)
David Robinson
Kat Manton

The main display of vintage receivers was run from 2 further Dominos.

Peter Smith's mechanical display was run from his own converter.

The display gathered more vintage TVs together than at any time since the 50th anniversary of TV celebration in 1986 at the Royal Festival Hall. That display was based on John Gillies's incomparable collection of pre-war receivers and was at least partly responsible for introducing me to the world of vintage TV.

Since 1986 and before yesterday there have been 2 other significant vintage TV displays in the UK. One at a BVWS Harpenden meeting in the 1990s, the other at an NVCF in about 2001. The latter also showed Brian Summers's 1950s image orthicon camera channel working which attracted a lot of attention.
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Old 8th May 2006, 8:50 pm   #3
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

There are several excellent photos of the vintage TV display (only the 405 line stuff though, not the mechanical or the standards converters) on Malcolm's site here http://www.domino405.co.uk/nvcf_may_2006.html
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Old 8th May 2006, 9:38 pm   #4
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

A big thank you to Peter for his mechanical TV display, I never thought Id see a working 30 line TV! I was stunned by the quality of the exibits.
I fear Engineers of this caliber are a dying breed!
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Old 8th May 2006, 9:50 pm   #5
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Hi Jeffrey

Thank you for the information contained in your post and particularly the names of some of the people involved.

You may be interested to know that I was a workshop based TV engineer for most of my working life until about 3 years ago when the throw-away society tipped me into a late career change. I had thought I would be happy if I never saw another television set again.

However seeing these sets, some of which were getting a bit long in the tooth when I was an apprentice, has really taken my interest. The pre-war sets of course I never saw at all.

It made me seriously think about getting involved in vintage TV. I will of course have to thin out my radio collection considerably first.


Paul, thanks for the link, I did take my camera with me to the NVCF but I only took one picture of the hall from upstairs.
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Old 8th May 2006, 10:59 pm   #6
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Hi,

By way of drifting back on topic, I was very impressed with the TV display; it was the first time I'd seen most of the sets present "in the flesh"; and working, too. I'd like to congratulate all those who restored and preserved these fine examples of technology and brought them along. I'm impressed to the point of running out of superlatives - and have developed a strong desire to own a mirror-lid set at some point

I'd like to make a suggestion; assuming this is to be repeated at a future event (and I hope it will be.) There recently seems to have been a proliferation of standards converters (and other means of generating 405-line video) now appearing. I feel it would add to the display if sufficient distribution/switching could be arranged along with maybe a timetable; such that different conversion systems could feed groups of sets at certain times; with details up on a board somewhere. I'd have liked to have seen how my PC system (and others, actually) looked on a few more sets but that wasn't possible at the time.

Regards, Kat
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Old 8th May 2006, 11:14 pm   #7
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

PC standards converter discussion split off to here https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ead.php?t=8927
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Last edited by Paul Stenning; 8th May 2006 at 11:21 pm.
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Old 9th May 2006, 7:19 am   #8
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kat Manton
I'd like to make a suggestion; assuming this is to be repeated at a future event (and I hope it will be.) There recently seems to have been a proliferation of standards converters (and other means of generating 405-line video) now appearing. I feel it would add to the display if sufficient distribution/switching could be arranged along with maybe a timetable; such that different conversion systems could feed groups of sets at certain times; with details up on a board somewhere. I'd have liked to have seen how my PC system (and others, actually) looked on a few more sets but that wasn't possible at the time.
I would have liked to have readily accessible selector switches so that different 405 line feeds could easily be routed to groups of TVs. Alas this wasn't possible with the resources I had available. I'll try harder next time.
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Old 9th May 2006, 9:02 am   #9
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Smile Re: TV at the NVCF

I have been looking through the photographs taken of the sets on display, and think that they are absolutely fascinating All the pictures that i have ever seen of 405 sets have been on Ebay and the like and this is the first time i have ever seen photos of these sets actualy working the people who restored them have every right to be very proud. Were any photos taken of forum members at the event?

Regards.
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Old 9th May 2006, 10:05 am   #10
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Quote:
Were any photos taken of forum members at the event?
Yep, see 12th reply here :-

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ead.php?t=8876

TTFN,
Jon
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Old 9th May 2006, 6:29 pm   #11
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

I thought the TV display was fantastic. I spent most of my day there and now I have a growing interest in 405 line TV...
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Old 9th May 2006, 6:38 pm   #12
Dave Moll
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoshWard
I thought the TV display was fantastic. I spent most of my day there and now I have a growing interest in 405 line TV...
If you already have a space problem with radios, where on earth would you put 405-line TVs?
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Old 9th May 2006, 7:28 pm   #13
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Hi,

I guess this is as good a place as any for this so, here goes!

I'd just like to say a BIG thankyou to everyone involved in the TV Display area for making myself and Kat feel so welcome

I really didn't know what to expect, never having been to a show like this before, never mind as an exhibitor (okay, so I was just a lowly helper ) but I had a great time meeting everyone, seeing all the fantastic things on display (mirror lids sets.... wow!) and even explaining Kat's system several times over myself

Great fun... if very tiring! I think i'm still recovering - I spent most of yesterday asleep and feel ready for bed again... But you'll doubtless all be glad to know that your boundless enthusiasm is infectious... I can see me and Kat doing more of these shows and enjoying it thoroughly.

Many thanks for having us and helping make it a great day.

Cobweb
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Old 9th May 2006, 7:53 pm   #14
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kat Manton
Hi,

By way of drifting back on topic, I was very impressed with the TV display; it was the first time I'd seen most of the sets present "in the flesh"; and working, too. I'd like to congratulate all those who restored and preserved these fine examples of technology and brought them along. I'm impressed to the point of running out of superlatives - and have developed a strong desire to own a mirror-lid set at some point

Regards, Kat
I would say that this this event has been excellent and has inspired people too. Would you consider bringing your PC based standards converter again to another event, I didnt have much time to have a look.
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Old 9th May 2006, 8:11 pm   #15
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Hi,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Photo_Tube
Would you consider bringing your PC based standards converter again to another event, I didnt have much time to have a look.
Definitely; I'd be pleased to demonstrate the system at any event where vintage television sets are gathered. As work progresses, more and more of the system will work; there are hardware and software refinements still to do - so at every demonstration there's likely to be a bit more to demonstrate - such is the way of software-based systems.

Hopefully I'll have my own transport working again soon; that'll help. I'm also going to sort out a modulator and a few other things to make these demonstrations more practical using my own equipment. I think the vintage television bug has bitten...

Regards, Kat
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Old 9th May 2006, 8:15 pm   #16
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobweb
and even explaining Kat's system several times over myself
It was nice to meet you - the science fiction writer - too. And after speaking briefly to both of you , it seemed here we had not single, but double-barrelled expertise in residence. You must have been able to take a good bit of the load off Kat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobweb
Great fun... if very tiring! I think i'm still recovering - I spent most of yesterday asleep and feel ready for bed again...
I was 'out of it' the whole of Monday and only today I'm getting back + indigestion for some reason.

I think the television display (including your and Kat's contribution) seems to have made a quite exceptional impact. So thanks to the organisers for thinking of it (and I suspect, having to lug most of it away afterwards...)

Steve
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Old 9th May 2006, 8:54 pm   #17
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Default Re: TV at the NVCF

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panrock
It was nice to meet you - the science fiction writer - too. And after speaking briefly to both of you , it seemed here we had not single, but double-barrelled expertise in residence. You must have been able to take a good bit of the load off Kat.
I didn't envisage that that's what I'd be doing! But there were just so many people crowding round at some points that I simply couldn't point them at Kat and say "ask the one wot did it" because she was already busy. Plus she did nip off to help bring in the Pye monitor and yet more people turned up then so I just got on with it. I guess it's just as well that I take an interest in her hobbies...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panrock
I think the television display (including your and Kat's contribution) seems to have made a quite exceptional impact. So thanks to the organisers for thinking of it (and I suspect, having to lug most of it away afterwards...)

Steve
Ah yes... the lugging away afterward. Don't remind me! Of course, it's always worse going back than it is coming because you always end up leaving with more than you arrived with - and it's funny how they always seem to be heavy things, too

Oh, I should also mention that I was very impressed by your Marconi mirror-lid set Kat had told me that it was being brought but at the time I didn't realise you were the fellow responsible for its presence and its current marvellous condition. Otherwise I would have said something on the day but I think I was too flustered by so many new names and faces to really put two and two together. Anyway, fantastic job, sir!


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