Vintage Clang Plug Adapters

[dark1stu]

oww that lot makes me cringe , but hear is a scary though i have been to a job this weekend to look at a job to fit a shower supply , i was horrified to find the house was still using round 3 pin and 2 pin sockets and wired in lead cables , needless to say i condemed the instlation "after talking with the couples kids " i isolated the supply to the house as it was in very dangerous and i have left them with a temp supply , if i get the job if rewire ill keep the old sockets etc

[Lucien Nunes]

Round pin electrical fittings aren't inherently unsafe though, if they are of good make, properly wired and in sound condition. I would rather trust a 1950's MK 5A socket and plug, wired with branded CMA-grade VIR to a Memrex fuse box by a competent electrician, than some of the grotesque aberrations put in during the last decade that I uncovered when I recently rewired a friend's flat.

Two-pin fittings are perhaps more likely to be dangerous, and of course an old installation is likely to have other faults. However I have some lead-sheathed rubber-insulated cable in service here that is perfectly fit for use.

Lucien

[AndiiT]

Hi,
Thinking about Petes adapters with reversed polarity, do they bear the logo "AC only" anywhere on the mouldings?
I ask this as many of these types of fittings would be in use when DC mains supplies were still being used and an adapter with reversed polarity on one of the sockets wouldn't be very "user friendly" on a DC supply.

Regards
Andrew

[Dave Moll]

No mention of AC on either of mine.

[Tractorfan]

Nope, no mention of AC on the French ones either.
Although, as an unrelated aside, they're marked with the maximum wattage at 230volts as well as the current.
Cheers de Pete.

[Ekco-Scott]

I have old BS 546 round pin plug wall sockets and plugs i made a converter that meins i can keep the old plug on the item. I have the light socket plug converter and i have an old converter that allows you to use 15 amp round pin plugs and two pin plugs on the current standard it must be from when the plugs were changed.

[Geoff 555]

Hi there, as regards post 15 yes that ties in with something I saw a couple of weeks ago and had to look twice at because I thought that I was seeing things,went in a cafe ( in a large restored house with a conference centre, so not old.) and in the bay window was a number of table lamps which all had 2 amp round pin plugs and sockets fitted, I didn't think that they were still available.
Cheers.
Geoff.

[Tractorfan]

Yes, round pin plugs, both 2amp & 5amp are often used for lighting circuits in restaurants, hotels & stately houses, etc. I think they're usually controlled from a light switch in reception. We once stayed at an hotel in Bangkok and they had them too! It's to avoid confusion with 13amp power sockets, but you knew that already
15amp plugs & sockets (usually rubber) are still used a lot in theatres where an unfused plug is needed as theatre lights are often way out of reach. Circuit protection being at the control panel.
MK used to make fused versions of round pin plugs, the 15amp one was fused to 5amp max. Not sure if they still do.
Cheers de Pete

[Ekco-Scott]

I know that the bs 546 plug is still legal so would that mean that you could use the 2a 5a and 15a as all your wall sockets i know you would have to change all the plugs when you buy something but i always liked them more they look better to me.

[julie_m]

You could, but the problem with the old plugs is that they don't have individual fuses. So in order for the installation to be safe, each socket would have to have a separate length of cable from its own individual circuit breaker in the consumer unit, and you'd probably end up needing an industrial one! Or you would need a consumer unit in each room. Either way, it's not pretty.

You could run more than one 5A socket from a single 6A breaker, or more than one 15A socket from a single 16A breaker; but then the total amps available would be shared between all the sockets connected to that breaker. You couldn't connect a 5A socket to a 16A breaker, even in parallel with one or more 15A sockets, because the appliance flex might not be able to withstand the tripping current if the 5A socket was the only one loaded.

[ppppenguin]

The previous post illustrates some common misunderstandings about circuit protection.

One of these is diversity. The improbability of all outlets being fully loaded at the same time. All power system design is heavily based on this, including the LV distribution network where I think only about 5kW is allocated for each house. Diversity is also why we can use multiway adaptors, 4 way blocks etc without problems. This includes vintage unfused adaptors.

Another is short circuit protection versus overload protection. Even a fairly puny bit of 3A flex will survive a short circuit that blows a 16A fuse and in the last resort the flex can be sacrificed provided the fuse blows. Overload protection is different. Here the fuse must blow before anything gets too hot. An example. A radio that normally uses 60W draws 0.25A from the mains. A fault causes it to draw 120W or 0.5A which makes something far too hot for comfort. Will your 3A fuse in the plug or 5A fuse at the fusebox blow? No, of course not, you have to rely on a fuse in the appliance itself.

[Ekco-Scott]

You can get the bs 546 with a fuse for modern appliances i like the style of the plug my reasoning was that i could keep the old plug on my vintage electrical equipment and for modern electrical equipment use the fused 2a 5a 15a from this site.

http://www.ebulbshop.com/acatalog/3_...mp_Fused_.html

Originally Posted by Ekco-Scott

You can get the bs 546 with a fuse for modern appliances i like the style of the plug my reasoning was that i could keep the old plug on my vintage electrical equipment and for modern electrical equipment use the fused 2a 5a 15a from this site.

http://www.ebulbshop.com/acatalog/3_...mp_Fused_.html

Even so, the socket wiring would have to be fused/breakered at the socket rating. The plug fuse is only there to protect the flex. The ring main (a supurb example of diversity) is so much better. I am quite sure that a ring main requires the use of sockets that only have fused plugs available, and I think that is only the BS1363 type.

A simple expedient would be to run a fused spur from a ring main to the round pin sockets, then you couldn't use 15A sockets as the maximum fuse would be 13A and the socket would advertise 15A available.

[ppppenguin]

If you are using a ring final you must use 13A sockets. The wiring regs also allow radial finals with 13A sockets, 32A MCB with 4mm cable, 20A MCB with 2.5mm cable. I believe that radials are now becoming more widely used.

It is entirely possible to have multiple 15A or 5A sockets on a single radial final. Just as it's possible to have multiple 16A BS4343 sockets on a 20A radial using 2.5mm cable. I would need to check the wiring regs but I don't think there would be a problem using multiple 15A sockets on a 16A or 20A radial provided suitable diversity is considered. The rule for a 20A radial feeding 13A sockets is 20sq m floor area served and this seems sensible as a first approximation.

The 20A MCB will provide short circuit protection for all but the smallest flex. In the last resort the flex would be sacrificed in a short circuit, just as it might have been in the old days when you used an adaptor to plug a small appliance into a 15A socket. For overcurrent protection you are relying either on a fuse in the appliance or something like a lamp which is not really going to cause an overcurrent fault.

I don't have an early edition of the wiring regs to hand to look up the whole business of close and coarse overcurrent protection. The basis was changed in (I think) the 15th edition to the rules which are familiar today.

PS: I have not taken grouping, thermal insulation or any other derating factors into account. These may require larger cable sizes.

PPS: I don't see any problem running a 15A socket from a 13A fused spur. If the fuse blows because you've used an exceptional load for a long period then it doesn't really matter. Very few portable appliances are rated between 3120W and 3600W anyway. (240V mains assumed)

"PPS: I don't see any problem running a 15A socket from a 13A fused spur. If the fuse blows because you've used an exceptional load for a long period then it doesn't really matter. Very few portable appliances are rated between 3120W and 3600W anyway. (240V mains assumed) "

I don't see a real problem either, but the HSE (or whomever) might.

[Tractorfan]

Hi,
I was rummaging round in a box under the bench and unearthed a Clang adaptor that I'd forgotten I had that takes two 15amp plugs. The second plug went into the left hand side and the right hand side is left blank except for the "earth" hole where the nut holds it all together.
Just thought you'd like to know
Cheers de Pete

[AndiiT]

Pete, I have also seen one of the types of adapter that you have just mentioned and had also forgotten about that version.

Was their perhaps a similar one which had a two three pin (front and one side) and one two pin (opposing side) socket? Maybe someone can confirm.

Regards
Andrew