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Vintage Computers Any vintage computer systems, calculators, video games etc., but with an emphasis on 1980s and earlier equipment.

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Old 4th Jan 2020, 2:15 pm   #1
trampintransit
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Default CF2-D disc

Found some CF2-D discs in my elderly mother's house...how would I read them...whatwith? Can anyone help?
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Old 4th Jan 2020, 3:42 pm   #2
G6Tanuki
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

There was a thread about those a while back.... see https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...d.php?t=151229
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Old 4th Jan 2020, 3:53 pm   #3
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

PM sent to trampintransit.

I further thought is to ask whether they were created on a PCW or CPC? I'm less familiar with the latter by the way.
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Old 4th Jan 2020, 4:34 pm   #4
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

Weren't they also used on Tatung Einstein and possibly others?
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Old 4th Jan 2020, 5:07 pm   #5
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

Although the drives were physically different, I'm pretty sure the electrical interface was the same as other drives. We had a PCW8256 that had just one CF2 disc drive. We bought a kit that allowed us to connect a 5 1/4 to the spare slot, instead of adding a second CF2.
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Old 4th Jan 2020, 5:37 pm   #6
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

It was common to add a 3½" drive to a PCW (in fact I have one with that modification), but I've not come across kits for adding a 5¼" drive.
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Old 4th Jan 2020, 5:47 pm   #7
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

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Originally Posted by Herald1360 View Post
Weren't they also used on Tatung Einstein and possibly others?
Yes they were (or in my case 'are'). The bare drives were also available and the Hitachi ones (at least) had a normal 34 pin edge connector and 4 pin power connector like a 5.25" drive and could be connected to just about any normal floppy disk controller. I've seen one boxed up with a PSU for use with a BBC micro, for example.
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Old 4th Jan 2020, 11:59 pm   #8
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

Be very careful if connecting up a PCW 3-inch drive to a non-PCW, as Amstrad (in their infinite wisdom) decided to swap the 5v and 12v connectors on the power plug for the floppy drive.

Source: http://fvempel.nl/3pc.html
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Old 5th Jan 2020, 12:55 am   #9
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

CF2-D Disks are the double density 720kb type, used on dual head drives in the Amstrad PCW 8512, or the 8256. The disks probably have word documents, spread sheet data, or phone book/diary entries etc on them in CP/M format my guess.

To read and write to these disks the kit you need is a working dual head drive from a PCW. The correct floppy cable, and power cable(5v and 12v is reversed), a PC that has a motherboard that supports floppy drives, and suitable software to read and write disk images. I've used Simon Owens SAMdisk in the past to re-write disk images on corrupted ZX Spectrum+3 game disks with success this way.
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Old 5th Jan 2020, 1:32 am   #10
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

Amstrad stopped selling special double density disks shortly before I got my PCW 8256 as it was found that the single density ones worked fine. I later installed an internal 720k second internal drive and an external 3 1/2" 720k drive that allowed me to transfer data to files in ASCII format between the PCW and my PC at work. I used third party software "PCW toolkit" to format the external drive in either PCW or DOS format. My PCW was working when put in store in my (heated) garden shed a couple of years ago. It wouldn't be difficult to dig out and power up.

I did once see a keyboard that had a 3" drive to record pieces but don't recall the make.

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Old 5th Jan 2020, 10:43 pm   #11
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

There certainly were other machines that used the CF2 disks, I remember seeing a Canon device (not I think a computer) back in the 80s.

I'm fairly sure that the designation of the disks was CF2 for the standard SD ones, and CF2-DD for the DD ones (double sided) but this applies more to the Amstrad range maybe, so something for another machine might not follow that rule.

Would be useful to see a picture of the disks, incl a picture of the two sides of the labels. A DD (720k) would have a full label on one side only, although if a CF2 disks was being used as a DD disk then the B: side might be marked 'Do Not Use' or suchlike.

As noted in the thread linked near the top, I can still read the CF2 disks, but not the CF2-DD. My PCW (still working also has 5.25" 360k drive, and 3" 720k) can be used to get files/data onto PC disks, or CD, etc.

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Old 5th Jan 2020, 11:03 pm   #12
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

Further to the above, I've checked via Google, and I see pics of Maxell variants marked CF2-D. The text on the package shows that they are Double Sided/Double Density, so I'd guess that the spec is suitable for the B: drive use 80T 720k, although they could still be used as CF2 as Single Sided 180k per side. In any case, it would depend how the disks were formatted.

At the time, the DD ones were more expensive that the standard (single sided) ones, so it would not be cost effective to use the CF2-DD in place of a CF2 although it's quite possible.

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Old 6th Jan 2020, 11:15 am   #13
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffB17 View Post
I can still read the CF2 disks, but not the CF2-DD. My PCW (still working also has 5.25" 360k drive, and 3" 720k) can be used to get files/data onto PC disks, or CD, etc.

Geoff
A couple of questions:

a) If your 3" drive is 720K, what's stopping it reading CF2-DD discs? Are these not what a 720K drive is for? As I recall, standard CF2 discs were 180K eack side, giving a total of 360K

b) Is your 5¼" drive externally mounted? There presumably isn't space to insert one into the PCW itself.
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Last edited by Dave Moll; 6th Jan 2020 at 11:18 am. Reason: by the way, Geoff posted while I was composing
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Old 6th Jan 2020, 7:21 pm   #14
GeoffB17
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

Er, oops. My apologies. I was referring to an external 3.5" drive, not a 3" one. The only built-in drive I have is the standard A: 180k SS 40T drive. So, I cannot access the 720k 80T DS variants, much as I'd like to.

Regarding the 5.25" drive, this is an external unit (quite a neat, solid, metal box) containing a standard 360k drive. I bought it from BOX a couple of years after I bought the PCW 8256 in 1985, mainly to allow access to the cheaper floppy disks, but also to open the door to file exchange with other machines. The unit was supplied with software for formatting the disks, and another prog to allow the unit to read/write an IBM format 360k disk

Aside - BOX stands for Benjamin Oughton Xenologicals so I understand!! Or something very close??

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Old 6th Jan 2020, 8:20 pm   #15
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Default Re: CF2-D disc

Quote:
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Aside - BOX stands for Benjamin Oughton Xenologicals so I understand!! Or something very close??
You're right, it is very close. Google tells me it was Benjamin-Oughton Xenologistics Limited. Unfortunately, this is immediately followed in the entry by "(closed)". Apparently, it was also quite close to where I used to live and work in Oxford.
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