Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? - Page 4 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Edward Huggins · 7th Feb 2018, 12:29 pm

The BSR X3M is a genuine stereo-compatible cartridge and there is no point in replacing it.
It will play all types of records and was designed for this purpose. Just replace the stylus if you have to - still easily available.

martinpinner · 7th Feb 2018, 1:34 pm

Thanks

martinpinner · 10th Feb 2018, 5:37 pm

I have now put the deck back in the player after cleaning where required. Unfortunately, the auto changer still does not work. Records will not drop down when using auto and when playing on manual the record will not return once it has finished. Is there any specific area of the mechanism that I should be looking at. Also, I originally had sound but now the volume is hardly audible.

Martin.

Edward Huggins · 10th Feb 2018, 7:11 pm

Oh dear! It sounds like you have disturbed the connection/s between the cartridge and the amplifier. This can often happen when removing the deck/motorboard assembly and will have put stress onto the wiring as there is usually very little slack. As to the auochanger function not working again, you will need to retrace all you previous steps and re-read through the stickies as there is obviously a linkage failure.

martinpinner · 11th Feb 2018, 1:36 pm

Thanks

martinpinner · 13th Feb 2018, 3:45 pm

Just checking the deck etc again. I noticed that one of the wires to the cartridge was not very tight - that might be the problem with the sound. I will not know until I have it back together. Other questions are - I have changed some of the Sufflex capacitors on the advice of Lawrence - see photo 1.Number 5 capacitor was replaced but when removing the old one which was a little difficult I am nor sure if it was actually soldered to the circuit below as well - see photo 2. If it does I will have to solder it again.I took a photo of the wires on the pick up connector before removing but unfortunately it is out of focus. Please can you confirm the the wires are fitted left to right with the third being the earth.The other end of the earth connection goes to underneath the metal control panel. Wouldn't this be better grounded to the chassis plate?

ms660 · 13th Feb 2018, 4:34 pm

That capacitors' wires on the print side look too long to me, only need to be 3mm at the very most.

Normal convention so far as I know for the pickup cartridge wires is:

Red = RH+ (RH signal)

Green = RH- (RH signal ground)

White = LH+ (LH signal)

Blue = LH- (LH signal ground)

Yes, the centre tag is the deck earth.

Note: Signal ground is not the same a turntable deck ground, deck ground is mains earth.

Do not connect mains earth to the main chassis or the controls sub chassis

Lawrence.

martinpinner · 13th Feb 2018, 5:05 pm

Thanks. I will clip the wire so that it is not infringing on the circuit below.
Wire colour's are different but the order is correct to how I am fitting.
Will leave signal ground as is.

Martin

Audio1950 · 13th Feb 2018, 6:40 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by martinpinner

Unfortunately, the auto changer still does not work. Records will not drop down when using auto and when playing on manual the record will not return once it has finished.

Make sure the clip round the base of the record spindle is present and in the right position. The flat on the inside must correspond with the flat on the base of the spindle, and the spindle should click into place when inserted, otherwise records will not drop correctly. Not returning at the end of the record is down to the trip pawl sticking. Refer to the "stickies" at the top of this section for how to proceed with this simple cure.

martinpinner · 13th Feb 2018, 7:08 pm

Thanks. I have had the trip pawl apart today and cleaned but having a problem with getting the top clip on at the moment. Clip on the base of the spindle is present and will make sure it is fitted correctly when I assemble.

Martin

Edward Huggins · 13th Feb 2018, 7:54 pm

I'm losing track of what you have done, but on seeing the new photos above, don't forget to bridge the LH and RH channels on that tag strip. Edward

martinpinner · 14th Feb 2018, 12:02 am

Sorry not sure what is meant by bridging the tag strip.

'LIVEWIRE?' · 14th Feb 2018, 9:54 am

Connect the LH & RH +ve outputs (red & white wires) together. The LH & RH -ve outputs (green & blue wires) should already be joined together. The reason for doing this is to ensure that you hear full mono sound from the stereo cartridge when fitted to a mono record player such as your Bermuda. This process is commonly called 'bridging the channels'

martinpinner · 14th Feb 2018, 10:12 am

Thanks

'LIVEWIRE?' · 14th Feb 2018, 10:52 am

Glad to help. Ensure that you bridge the connections by running a link wire from the tag with the red wire to that with the white wire. This ensures that both are connected to the Bermuda's amplifier input.

ms660 · 14th Feb 2018, 11:15 am

Why bridge the connections? I thought a mono cartridge was fitted? Bridging with a mono cartridge fitted will only increase the possibility of extra hum pickup.

This player has facilities for one channel (of a stereo pair) output via a socket on the players control panel should a stereo cartridge be fitted.

There should be a screened cable from red and green to amp input and another from white and blue to the stereo channel output socket, hard to tell from the photos whether those screened cables would be hard wired to the tags under the deck or whether it's a plug job, maybe the OP or someone can confirm on that one.

Lawrence.

martinpinner · 14th Feb 2018, 3:02 pm

The cartridge fitted is a BSR X3M and all of the screened tags are hard wired to the tags.
The red and green are fitted to the cartridge and the blue/white are currently spare for a 4 pin cartridge?

'LIVEWIRE?' · 14th Feb 2018, 4:59 pm

As Lawrence (ms660) says, with a mono cartridge, such as the X3M, the connections should not be bridged. This is only necessary if a stereo pickup is fitted to a player with no provision for a second channel amplifier.

martinpinner · 17th Feb 2018, 4:13 pm

The auto changer finally works but I still have only very low volume that is only coming through the stylus.
I have checked the "stickies" and removed the wires to the cartridge and touched them and got no hum and also rubbed my fingers on the rubbers that the stylus shank sits on and got no rumbly noise.
It did play before I started to work on it and therefore looking for advice as to whether there is anything else to check or should I replace the cartridge?
Martin

'LIVEWIRE?' · 17th Feb 2018, 6:48 pm

If you get no hum or buzz when touching the ends of the leads which connect the pickup to the amplifier, the amp is in some way faulty. Caution; This amplifier uses a 'Live Chassis'so be careful when carrying out any tests with the amplifier powered up and switched on

7th Feb 2018, 12:29 pm	#61
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 8,326	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? The BSR X3M is a genuine stereo-compatible cartridge and there is no point in replacing it. It will play all types of records and was designed for this purpose. Just replace the stylus if you have to - still easily available. __________________ Edward.

7th Feb 2018, 1:34 pm	#62
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Thanks

10th Feb 2018, 5:37 pm	#63
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? I have now put the deck back in the player after cleaning where required. Unfortunately, the auto changer still does not work. Records will not drop down when using auto and when playing on manual the record will not return once it has finished. Is there any specific area of the mechanism that I should be looking at. Also, I originally had sound but now the volume is hardly audible. Martin.

10th Feb 2018, 7:11 pm	#64
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 8,326	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Oh dear! It sounds like you have disturbed the connection/s between the cartridge and the amplifier. This can often happen when removing the deck/motorboard assembly and will have put stress onto the wiring as there is usually very little slack. As to the auochanger function not working again, you will need to retrace all you previous steps and re-read through the stickies as there is obviously a linkage failure. __________________ Edward.

11th Feb 2018, 1:36 pm	#65
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Thanks

13th Feb 2018, 3:45 pm	#66
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Just checking the deck etc again. I noticed that one of the wires to the cartridge was not very tight - that might be the problem with the sound. I will not know until I have it back together. Other questions are - I have changed some of the Sufflex capacitors on the advice of Lawrence - see photo 1.Number 5 capacitor was replaced but when removing the old one which was a little difficult I am nor sure if it was actually soldered to the circuit below as well - see photo 2. If it does I will have to solder it again.I took a photo of the wires on the pick up connector before removing but unfortunately it is out of focus. Please can you confirm the the wires are fitted left to right with the third being the earth.The other end of the earth connection goes to underneath the metal control panel. Wouldn't this be better grounded to the chassis plate? Attached Thumbnails

13th Feb 2018, 4:34 pm	#67
ms660 Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 13,454	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? That capacitors' wires on the print side look too long to me, only need to be 3mm at the very most. Normal convention so far as I know for the pickup cartridge wires is: Red = RH+ (RH signal) Green = RH- (RH signal ground) White = LH+ (LH signal) Blue = LH- (LH signal ground) Yes, the centre tag is the deck earth. Note: Signal ground is not the same a turntable deck ground, deck ground is mains earth. Do not connect mains earth to the main chassis or the controls sub chassis Lawrence.

13th Feb 2018, 5:05 pm	#68
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Thanks. I will clip the wire so that it is not infringing on the circuit below. Wire colour's are different but the order is correct to how I am fitting. Will leave signal ground as is. Martin

13th Feb 2018, 7:08 pm	#70
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Thanks. I have had the trip pawl apart today and cleaned but having a problem with getting the top clip on at the moment. Clip on the base of the spindle is present and will make sure it is fitted correctly when I assemble. Martin

13th Feb 2018, 7:54 pm	#71
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 8,326	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? I'm losing track of what you have done, but on seeing the new photos above, don't forget to bridge the LH and RH channels on that tag strip. Edward __________________ Edward.

14th Feb 2018, 12:02 am	#72
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Sorry not sure what is meant by bridging the tag strip.

14th Feb 2018, 9:54 am	#73
'LIVEWIRE?' Rest in Peace Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: N.W. Oxfordshire(Chipping Norton) Posts: 7,306	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Connect the LH & RH +ve outputs (red & white wires) together. The LH & RH -ve outputs (green & blue wires) should already be joined together. The reason for doing this is to ensure that you hear full mono sound from the stereo cartridge when fitted to a mono record player such as your Bermuda. This process is commonly called 'bridging the channels'

14th Feb 2018, 10:12 am	#74
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Thanks

14th Feb 2018, 10:52 am	#75
'LIVEWIRE?' Rest in Peace Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: N.W. Oxfordshire(Chipping Norton) Posts: 7,306	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Glad to help. Ensure that you bridge the connections by running a link wire from the tag with the red wire to that with the white wire. This ensures that both are connected to the Bermuda's amplifier input.

14th Feb 2018, 11:15 am	#76
ms660 Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cornwall, UK. Posts: 13,454	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? Why bridge the connections? I thought a mono cartridge was fitted? Bridging with a mono cartridge fitted will only increase the possibility of extra hum pickup. This player has facilities for one channel (of a stereo pair) output via a socket on the players control panel should a stereo cartridge be fitted. There should be a screened cable from red and green to amp input and another from white and blue to the stereo channel output socket, hard to tell from the photos whether those screened cables would be hard wired to the tags under the deck or whether it's a plug job, maybe the OP or someone can confirm on that one. Lawrence.

14th Feb 2018, 3:02 pm	#77
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? The cartridge fitted is a BSR X3M and all of the screened tags are hard wired to the tags. The red and green are fitted to the cartridge and the blue/white are currently spare for a 4 pin cartridge?

14th Feb 2018, 4:59 pm	#78
'LIVEWIRE?' Rest in Peace Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: N.W. Oxfordshire(Chipping Norton) Posts: 7,306	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? As Lawrence (ms660) says, with a mono cartridge, such as the X3M, the connections should not be bridged. This is only necessary if a stereo pickup is fitted to a player with no provision for a second channel amplifier.

17th Feb 2018, 4:13 pm	#79
martinpinner Hexode Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 252	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? The auto changer finally works but I still have only very low volume that is only coming through the stylus. I have checked the "stickies" and removed the wires to the cartridge and touched them and got no hum and also rubbed my fingers on the rubbers that the stylus shank sits on and got no rumbly noise. It did play before I started to work on it and therefore looking for advice as to whether there is anything else to check or should I replace the cartridge? Martin

17th Feb 2018, 6:48 pm	#80
'LIVEWIRE?' Rest in Peace Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: N.W. Oxfordshire(Chipping Norton) Posts: 7,306	Re: Dansette Bermuda MK II ?? If you get no hum or buzz when touching the ends of the leads which connect the pickup to the amplifier, the amp is in some way faulty. Caution; This amplifier uses a 'Live Chassis'so be careful when carrying out any tests with the amplifier powered up and switched on Last edited by 'LIVEWIRE?'; 17th Feb 2018 at 6:55 pm.