UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Powered By Google Custom Search Vintage Radio Service Data

Go Back   UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum > General Vintage Technology > Cabinet and Chassis Restoration and Refinishing

Notices

Cabinet and Chassis Restoration and Refinishing For help with cabinet or chassis restoration (non-electrical), please leave a message here.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 27th Feb 2018, 4:54 pm   #1
G6Tanuki
Dekatron
 
G6Tanuki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Wiltshire, UK.
Posts: 7,281
Default Paint Stripper.

With traditional 'Nitromors' stripper [the Methyl Chloride version] having been outlawed a while back, when I've wanted to strip paint from metal cabinets etc. I've been using a paste made from Sodium Hydroxide crystals and water. It's effective but not nice-to-know because of its extreme alkalinity and ability to digest wood, fabrics, flesh if it gets splashed on them. It's also no good on 'soft' metals like aluminium zinc or magnesium-alloys for the same reason.

So recently when I wanted to remove aqccumulated paint from an aluminium-alloy diecasting I was in a quandary: NaOH would have destroyed it. In the past I've been deeply cynical of the strippers offered to replace Nitromors, but I thought I'd have a go with using "Diall Paint and Varnish Remover" from B&Q. This is an off-white gel (looks a bit like runny custard!) which contains Benzyl Alcohol as the active ingredient.

https://www.diy.com/departments/b-q-.../262263_BQ.prd

To my surprise, it worked - leaving the casting sitting in a jam-jar full of the stripper, the paint was then easy to work-off using one of the little brass-bristled brushes sold for cleaning suede.

The paint on the casting was ordinary gloss: how well this stripper would work on cellulose, or two-pack paint/varnish I have yet to discover. But it worked, so I'm happy.
G6Tanuki is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2018, 5:13 pm   #2
Bazz4CQJ
Nonode
 
Bazz4CQJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Oxfordshire, UK.
Posts: 2,385
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Yes, the benzyl alcohol product has been available from Wickes for a few years. I think they sell it as their own brand paint and varnish remover. I've been really pleased with it and have mentioned it on the Forum a few times previously.

It often takes a little time to work, and isn't suitable for all materials, but it is pretty much at the top of my "go to list" for removing paint, varnish and other 'soils' from surfaces.

B
__________________
We know there are known unknowns. But there are unknown unknowns ones we don't know we don't know.
Bazz4CQJ is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2018, 6:27 pm   #3
YoungManGW
Hexode
 
YoungManGW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Oswestry, Shropshire, UK.
Posts: 338
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Langlow still make a proper paint stripper, akin to the old Nitromors.

Regards,
Richard
__________________
Blog: www.ymgw.blogspot.com
YoungManGW is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2018, 6:37 pm   #4
G6Tanuki
Dekatron
 
G6Tanuki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Wiltshire, UK.
Posts: 7,281
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by YoungManGW View Post
Langlow still make a proper paint stripper, akin to the old Nitromors
I thought Methylene Chloride/Dichloromethane - the active component of 'classic' Nitromors - had been banned for consumer-sale as paint-stripper within the EU some years back?

http://www.paintsquare.com/news/?fus...n=view&id=7328

I guess it depends on what counts as 'industrial' or 'commercial' use. I can still buy traditional Creosote in 25-litre drums though its sale for domestic use was also banned some years back.
G6Tanuki is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2018, 6:49 pm   #5
David G4EBT
Dekatron
 
David G4EBT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Cottingham, East Yorkshire, UK.
Posts: 3,586
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

True - dichloromethane is supposed to be only used by professionals in a controlled environment by suitably trained and equipped personnel and most suppliers won't supply to the general public

The guidance sheet states that LANGLOW'S 'STRIPAWAY PRO' is only approved for use by suitably trained and equipped professional operators within a suitably equipped working environment, such as a locally exhaust ventilated paint booth, where operators can be equipped with the appropriate respiratory protection to ensure they are not exposed to DCM vapours which are above the workplace exposure.

That said, surprisingly perhaps, it's on unrestricted sale via Amazon at 34.99 for 5 Litres, and from at least one e-bay supplier for 24.99.

I won't give the links, for obvious reasons.

It really is vicious stuff - ride at your own risk!
__________________
David.
BVWS Member.
G-QRP Club member 1339.
David G4EBT is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2018, 6:49 pm   #6
emeritus
Dekatron
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK.
Posts: 3,139
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

It seems from the press release that the product might still available for de-greasing, but that its packing would not include any mention of using it as a paint stripper. Rather like Jeyes Fluid, which no longer advises its use for sterilizing soil, or the Gardeners' Question time programme where one of the panel mentioned that they are no longer able to advise gardeners to use diluted washing up liquid to kill aphids without wearing complete body protection (because it will irritate the eyes if any gets there).
emeritus is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2018, 7:08 pm   #7
G6Tanuki
Dekatron
 
G6Tanuki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Wiltshire, UK.
Posts: 7,281
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Re: Dichloromethane:

Quote:
Originally Posted by David G4EBT View Post
It really is vicious stuff - ride at your own risk!
True: as a student I used it to strip the paint/signwriting off a 2500-gallon agricultural fuel-bowser/trailer, applying it with a paint-roller-on-a-broomhandle. It was summer, and so I was wearing only a pair of [nylon] football-shorts. Half an hour later I came out in desperately-itchy smallpox-style blisters, and my shorts looked like they'd suffered a major clothes-moth infestation.

Since then I've used DCM with more respect.
G6Tanuki is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2018, 10:17 pm   #8
dazaaa1
Triode
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: East London, UK.
Posts: 43
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

You can still buy dichloromethane based strippers on ebay, exactly like the old Nitromors, great stuff that burns your skin on contact!
dazaaa1 is offline  
Old 28th Feb 2018, 8:53 am   #9
YoungManGW
Hexode
 
YoungManGW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Oswestry, Shropshire, UK.
Posts: 338
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

In my neck of the woods the agricultural factors will say, "I'm supposed to ask whether you've got a licence / are trained", and leave it at that. It's thus still possible to get paint stripper, proper creosote and weedkiller that actually work. Of course one must take suitable precautions, but that's a personal responsibility, not the job of a nanny state.

Regards,
Richard
__________________
Blog: www.ymgw.blogspot.com
YoungManGW is offline  
Old 28th Feb 2018, 10:30 am   #10
robinshack
Heptode
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Spalding, Peterborough, Cambridgeshire, UK.
Posts: 801
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Dichloromethane (methyl chloride) was also used as a refrigerant!
Rob
__________________
I am also interested in and collect 00 model railway.
robinshack is offline  
Old 28th Feb 2018, 10:59 am   #11
The Philpott
Octode
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Colchester, Essex, UK.
Posts: 1,780
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Selection of gloves is important. Polish Pete and I put one of the disposable gloves we had been supplied with to 'safely' make PU mouldings, into the bin, and sprayed DCM onto it. It started bubbling.
The Philpott is offline  
Old 28th Feb 2018, 1:23 pm   #12
Goldie99
Heptode
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Boston, Lincolnshire, UK.
Posts: 509
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by G6Tanuki View Post
With traditional 'Nitromors' stripper [the Methyl Chloride version] having been outlawed a while back....
Quote:
Originally Posted by robinshack View Post
Dichloromethane (methyl chloride) was also used as a refrigerant...
(Common) chemical names can be very confusing, but could I just point out that Dichloromethane (aka Methylene Chloride, or even Methylene Dichloride), is not at all the same chemical as Methyl Chloride - they are very different.
Goldie99 is offline  
Old 28th Feb 2018, 1:58 pm   #13
ColinTheAmpMan1
Heptode
 
ColinTheAmpMan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Wimbledon, London, UK.
Posts: 937
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

I agree with Goldie99 here. Common, or trivial, chemical names are a pain, though sometimes better understood over the somewhat pedantic systematic names. For completeness, the chemicals that involve one carbon atom, up to four hydrogen atoms and from zero to four chlorine atoms are:

Methane - one carbon, four hydrogen atoms - a gas (also called marsh-gas).
Chloromethane - one carbon, three hydrogen and one chlorine atom - a gas (also called methyl chloride).
Dichloromethane - one carbon, two hydrogen and two chlorine atoms - a volatile liquid (also called methylene chloride or methylene dichloride).
Trichloromethane - one carbon, one hydrogen and three chlorine atoms - a volatile liquid (also called chloroform).
Tetrachloromethane - one carbon, four chlorine atoms - a volatile liquid (also called carbon tetrachloride).

The chlorine-containing ones are pretty much all limited in sale to qualified, responsible customers who are aware of the various hazards including toxicity and depletion of the ozone levels in the atmosphere.

Colin.
ColinTheAmpMan1 is offline  
Old 28th Feb 2018, 10:32 pm   #14
Bazz4CQJ
Nonode
 
Bazz4CQJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Oxfordshire, UK.
Posts: 2,385
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

On the subject of toxicity of chemicals, I was listening on the radio to a scientist talking about lead. At the start of his career (in the US), it was thought that there was a 'safe' level of lead in human blood and that it was around 50 units (units might have been ug/litre). Anyway, during the last forty years that limit has come down and down. In some rural areas of the US, some kids now test as low as 1-5 units, but... the statistics still suggested that the kids with 1 unit showed better cognitive development than kids with 5 units. The suggestion is that some exposure does some harm and more exposure does more harm. The idea of "Safe Levels" has always been largely speculative, and that probably applies to lots of other stuff too!

B
__________________
We know there are known unknowns. But there are unknown unknowns ones we don't know we don't know.
Bazz4CQJ is offline  
Old 28th Feb 2018, 10:42 pm   #15
robinshack
Heptode
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Spalding, Peterborough, Cambridgeshire, UK.
Posts: 801
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Sorry, I was mistaken. But, at least half right about methyl chloride used as an old time refrigerant. It was seeing the linked names in an earlier (but later corrected) post that prompted my comment.
According to my dad (who came across it in the 1940s), it had a slightly sweet smell! Unlike R12 which was odourless, unless burned! Burning was a sure way to detect leaks before the electronic leak detectors!
Rob
__________________
I am also interested in and collect 00 model railway.
robinshack is offline  
Old 1st Mar 2018, 11:37 pm   #16
astral highway
Nonode
 
astral highway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London, UK.
Posts: 2,921
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bazz4CQJ View Post
On the subject of toxicity of chemicals, I was listening on the radio to a scientist talking about lead. At the start of his career (in the US), it was thought that there was a 'safe' level of lead in human blood and that it was around 50 units
Some of the level-setting was expedient.

The USA had huge swathes of industrial land until the 1920-s to 30's. There were foundries everywhere, as well as chemical plants using lead to make paint. Later on, that deeply contaminated land became used for building projects for the poor.

Soil levels of lead in the yards of these houses still spiked out test equipment well into the turn of this century. There were a number of civil lawsuits filed for health problems relating to the unwitting ingestion of lead from these places. If permitted levels were lowered, these would have proliferated hugely.
__________________
Al
astral highway is offline  
Old 6th Mar 2018, 8:01 pm   #17
stuarth
Hexode
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Heysham, Lancashire, UK.
Posts: 331
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Dihydrogen monoxide is a fairly weak solvent, but can be quite harmful in some circumstances. Just lately, large amounts of it in its solid form has caused a degree of travel disruption. No restrictions on its sale though.

Stuart
stuarth is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2018, 1:18 am   #18
astral highway
Nonode
 
astral highway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London, UK.
Posts: 2,921
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stuarth View Post
Dihydrogen monoxide is a fairly weak solvent, but can be quite harmful in some circumstances..,
Hahaha!! Better be careful next time I have a bath.

It reminds me ... a defence that ‘even milk can be toxic’ was made by a chemical engineer on the witness stand, defending his part in corporate environmental malfeasance.

He was in charge of operations in a smelter with multiple, felony violations - air and water pollution. His levity incensed the EPA.
__________________
Al
astral highway is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2018, 1:11 pm   #19
fetteler
Heptode
 
fetteler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Staffordshire Moorlands, UK.
Posts: 676
Default Re: Paint Stripper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stuarth View Post
Dihydrogen monoxide is a fairly weak solvent
Have to disagree there, sorry. Water dissolves more things any other liquid and is known as the 'universal solvent' because of this property

Cheers,
Steve.
__________________
Those who lack imagination cannot imagine what is lacking...
fetteler is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 2:36 am.


All information and advice on this forum is subject to the WARNING AND DISCLAIMER located at https://www.vintage-radio.net/rules.html.
Failure to heed this warning may result in death or serious injury to yourself and/or others.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2002 - 2019, Paul Stenning.