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Old 8th Oct 2017, 6:20 pm   #1
imull2001
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Default Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

Hi,

I'm in the process of repairing a Grundig RC400 radiogram for a friend's Uncle. I've managed to sort the PSU fault (shorted zener) and now the radio side of things are up and running, however I've just tried the turntable and got zip.

There is power (120VAC) going out of the chassis to the turntable but I can't get any life out of it, are there any pointers? I might not be using it correctly as it's been a while since using a turntable but I do have an album to test it with.

I guess I put the record on the turntable, switch to start on the toggle and then press the start pushbutton? I thought it would all start from there!

Any ideas appreciated,

Ian
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Old 8th Oct 2017, 10:09 pm   #2
Audio1950
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

The first thing to do would be removing the circlip from round the base of the record spindle, and lifting the turntable off. Then check that the motor itself is turning when you press the "start" button.
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Old 8th Oct 2017, 11:12 pm   #3
Edward Huggins
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

The turntable was actually made by Philips. You may be able download a manual.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 6:28 pm   #4
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

OK, got round to removing the turntable and testing the motor. It doesn't turn but you can feel that it's energised.

What's the next step, can it be freed (not sure how hard to work these are) or is it new motor time? If I do need to replace the motor, how do I remove the turntable?!!?
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 7:41 pm   #5
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

In your first paragraph you say that you've removed the turntable, but in the second paragraph you ask how to remove the turntable.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 7:47 pm   #6
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

Assume Ian meant he's removed the platter but is wondering how to remove the deck.

Anyway, I think the motor needs removing, dismantling, cleaning and oiling. Not a difficult job.

Good luck,

Nick,
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 7:53 pm   #7
imull2001
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

Yes, sorry I meant the platter!

OK Nick, I'll give that a go.

Now to remove the turntable assembly from the cabinet, are the screws underneath?
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 8:18 pm   #8
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

OK, no screws underneath or in the sides. The turntable assembly lifts off its springs but I can't lift it all of the way out or figure out what's holding it in.

Does anyone have any pointers?!
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 6:54 am   #9
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

Possibly under the platter towards the front left is a lever tightened with a screw, loosen the screw and slide the lever back towards the spindle. lift up that corner and slide the deck out?
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 1:04 pm   #10
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

Come on now, let's not make hard work of this!

I'm not familiar with this particular deck, but let's look at the facts so far - the motor shaft is not spinning but a feeling of the AC current in the field coils can be felt, so we know that there are no open circuits and power (current) is flowing through the motor.

So have you tried rotating the motor spindle with your fingers?

If it's tight or will not rotate then the first thing that I would do is to apply a drop of clock oil to the end of the blade of a very small screw driver and apply this drop of oil via the screwdriver blade to the spindle where it goes into the top bearing of the motor and let it soak for a while. You could apply several drops this way if need be. I'm assuming you can get access to this top bearing from beneath the platter without any further dismantling. Let it soak and then try turning the shaft with your fingers.

It could be argued that for long term reliability the complete motor may need dismantling and both bearings lubricated properly, but it's usually the top bearing that dries up and binds. Replacement motors are very unlikely to be available, so mending the one you have is the only option.

Last edited by Techman; 13th Oct 2017 at 1:09 pm.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 1:30 pm   #11
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

As a follow on, if it turns out that the motor shaft does in fact turn by hand, but not when powered, even though power can be felt flowing, then it may indicate that a 'starter/direction' winding is either not being powered or is open circuit, this is less likely, though.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 1:42 pm   #12
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

That sounds plausible, but what kind of motor are you thinking this might have? I'd be amazed if it's not just the usual shaded-pole affair used on 99.9% or autochangers.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 1:50 pm   #13
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

I agree, Nick. I think it's likely to be just a very standard type of motor as you say, but not being familiar with the deck and particularly with it being a Grundig, I thought I'd better cover all possibilities, however remote.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 1:59 pm   #14
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

The deck might be a Philips 22GC036 or variant?:

https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/philip...22gc03655.html

Lawrence.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 2:13 pm   #15
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

True, in which case it looks like it floats on coil springs in each corner, and is retained by some kind of screws at 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock w.r.t. the platter.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 2:17 pm   #16
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

Well done Lawrence, this is the one I was thinking of in my Post #3......Philips had Manuals for everything and there's sure to be one for this. If not identical, it's likely to be simliar as it's from the same period.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 2:48 pm   #17
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

A photo from the OP would confirm.

According to the instruction manual for the 22GC036 the two transit screws are removed completely so maybe the deck Just floats and there's nothing fixing it to the mounting board?

Inst. manual link (if allowed):

http://85.144.192.2/nvhr/Philips_22GC036_usr.pdf

Lawrence.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 3:04 pm   #18
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

Thanks for the advice guys, it does look like that a derivative of that Philips model (apart from the arm at the back, autochanger?)

The oil has helped, it now turns by hand but is still quite stiff. It still doesn't turn when energised.

There doesn't appear to be any sort of fixing holding it in place, I think it's something catching somewhere.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 4:43 pm   #19
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

Philips 22GC060 ?:

https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/grundi...?language_id=2

http://85.144.192.2/nvhr/Philips_22GC060.pdf

Lawrence.
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Old 13th Oct 2017, 5:37 pm   #20
imull2001
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Default Re: Grundig RC400 Turntable Help

That's the puppy! Thank you
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