Ferrograph Series 7 Model Number Identification

[Ferrograph723]

I've just realised looking at your pictures again, it looks like there are fasteners on the main unit cabinet which the lid clips on to - but mine doesn't have those. I wonder if mine was designed to not have a lid :-(

[Reelman]

Only metal cased Ferros have fasteners from those I have seen. If you have a wooden cased one then either you need the clear Perspex cover which just clips on and is fairly rare or the original plain wood lid. See #23.

Peter

[Tim]

Ferrographs were used by the royal Navy, presumably for recording underwater noises etc. I have come across a few (usually metal cased) and Admiralty machines often have a weight stated on the info plate. I suppose you need to know whether your submarine will actually sink when it's supposed to.

I serviced a couple of Super 7's about 30 years ago for the Central Office of Information (Bristol). I remember ringing Ferrograph for service info and or parts, but upon learning there was a Y in the model number("Sorry that's a government machine, therefore we can't help you)they sent me away with a flea in my ear!

Fortunately as I recall there were only minor issues with the machines, including replacements of pinch wheels etc.

[DMcMahon]

In the early 70's on wards I worked on various underwater weapons systems specialising in SONAR for the MOD, working on a wide range of Naval Surface ships as well as Diesel Electric submarines.

In the submarines for use with the various SONAR systems they used 2 large solid state stereo Ferrograph tape recorders (pretty sure they were 1/4" tape), unfortunately I cannot remember the model number (on the submarines they were identified as the REO & REP recorders).

At the time I had a fairly basic mono valve Grundig TK 23, so the Ferrographs at the time seemed so modern and all singing/all dancing in comparison. I don't think they would have been domestic recorders, most likely Professional/Industrial.

Every time I see a Ferrograph recorder online, I wonder if I will ever see the same ones as I remember from my MOD days but I never have.

[Ted Kendall]

Around 1970, in Studio Sound, Ferrograph ran a series of adverts showing Sevens in various professional situations - the Moon landing, Radio London and I think on a submarine - could have been a surface ship - Naval anyway.

[DMcMahon]

That is interesting Ted. I am sure as I can be that the recorders I worked with on submarines were not Series 7s.

It may be my memory being incorrect but I would say they looked more modern in looks/design. Difficult to be certain but I would say they were larger in size, at least width and height, in the submarines they were used in the horizontal position, their depth was not that large but they were very heavy.

I do not remember any standard R2Rs being used with the SONAR systems on surface ships (some may well have been) but with the larger active sonars on Frigates and Destroyers
they used large R2Rs with at least 1" tape, maybe 2" ?

They were called A/S 10XX Teacher/Trainers, I think A/S was Asdic/Sonar. I am sure I knew at the time who made them but I cannot now remember.

David

[DMcMahon]

Originally Posted by Ferrograph723

I've just realised looking at your pictures again, it looks like there are fasteners on the main unit cabinet which the lid clips on to - but mine doesn't have those. I wonder if mine was designed to not have a lid :-(

Photos showing the lid and fasteners etc on the incomplete unit.

[DMcMahon]

More photos of the incomplete unit

[DMcMahon]

1 photo of the complete (relatively) unit, it is not so keen to come out of its case like the incomplete unit was, will get back to it later today.

[BillDWVA]

Hi, Hope you don’t mind me adding a reply to this thread?

Here is my military Series 7, model type Y722HG.
Although the circuit elements are similar to the civilian versions there are many, many detail differences. Here are just a few I’ve noted:-
1. It’s two-speed; this one is 7.5/15 as it’s a high-speed model.
2. There is no equalisation switch. Changeover is via relays on the replay amp boards.
3. The record and replay boards are plug-in and can be accessed via the opening flap on the rear of the case.
4. It has an industrial style ‘hours run’ meter. Called ‘elapsed time counter’ on the circuit. My example only had about 32 hours on the clock when it came to me.
5. The capstan motor has external connections for a variable speed unit.
6. The level meters are driven, reverse operation like Ferros of old and are only active during record.
7. Input and output connections and record monitoring are all different to standard Series 7s. For example during recording ‘off tape’ monitoring is automatic unless ‘Monitor input during run’ button is pressed.
8. Racal type mains connector - I’ve replaced with normal Bulgin type.
9. It does not have the Ferrograph model and serial number plate.
10. Spool clamps are ‘twist’ type.

Cheers,
Bill

[DMcMahon]

Hi Bill,

Thank you for all the very interesting information.

I still consider that the Ferrographs I remember were not Series 7 military or non military spec. I am pretty sure the ones I remember did not have metal cases, they had lovely real wood cases, this is one of the reasons why I thought they looked so good/superior (at the time) compared to my own little modest plastic cased Grundig TK 23.

I always try to keep an open mind, so it could be possible that after nearly 50 years my memories of what they actually looked like, could have become distorted/embellished, you never know

David

[Reelman]

Judging by how different Bill’s military 7 is compared to a “standard” 7 I wonder if the metal case was a factory option taken up by enthusiastic amateurs wanting a more robust container for their pride and Joy.

Peter

[DMcMahon]

My order for three Series 5 idler wheels arrived today, look to be in good condition.

[DMcMahon]

Originally Posted by Mistral13

David,
If you need to replace the 3 idler wheels, they were for sale very recently on eBay for £30 a set. They are from earlier models (series 6 or 5) and don't suffer from the Series 7 'turn to jelly' problem.

They are used but servicable and seeing as a single refurbished exchange idler wheel costs over £35 exc p&p from the USA they work well enough to get you going.

My Series 7 pinch wheel was missing entirely, but I found a new replacement - again on eBay - for £40. The seller had had a batch made up and was selling the excess.

David

I found out the eBay seller has more Series 7 Pinch wheels/rollers but not still advertised (currently) and they are also getting a batch of new idler wheels manufactured.

[DMcMahon]

Originally Posted by DMcMahon

Seller has come back saying the label is missing (a shame), he has another incomplete stereo one where model number is P722/BBC.

From the part numbers on the heads of the complete unit, have worked out that it must be a 722, 1/2 track stereo machine.

[Mistral13]

Re: Pinch Wheel

I was about to ask if you wanted me to contact the guy for further supplies as I have his e-mail address.

As far as I can see, the only difference between these and the original is that the new ones use polyurethane instead of rubber (neoprene?) for the roller surface.

Naturally I can't speak for their longevity having only recently fitted one, but my roller fits, works, is concentric and does the job. Apart from ordering one from the USA, these are currently the only game in town.

[Ted Kendall]

The whole problem with the originals was that they were polyurethane - in common with Chilton, Ferrograph went for this "wonder" material and came a cropper, as did Ampex eventually when their polyurethane binders turned to goo. Fortunately, the chemistry is now better understood, and modern supplies should be OK.

[Mistral13]

Thanks for that Ted, I didn't know that!
RACAL had something similar with their early LCD displays, which had a nasty habit of bleeding after a few years - the risk of being and early adopter I suppose.

[DMcMahon]

Last night after a little struggling removed the complete unit from its metal case. A quick inspection and everything appears to be present (apart from the few minor items already identified as missing).

Compared to the incomplete unit it was very dirty with lots of cobwebs, dust, fluff and dead insects (plus 2 live spiders) but after 15 minutes of brushing and hoovering now
looks a lot better, but will need a more thorough clean up later on.

Initially could not see the idler wheels in either unit, then spotted them, black, very sticky and soft and very easy to deform their shape by touching, so a very good shout from Mistral13 about getting the Series 5 set of 3.

Looking down the right hand side of the Power Supply Unit (PSU) there is a metal cased 3 terminal component (assume capacitor) hanging down, so assume it has come adrift from its fixing. So will have to get inside the PSU to investigate, I need to get inside anyway to connect/hardwire a temporary mains power cable. Looking down the PSU on the incomplete unit could not easily see the same component.

[DMcMahon]

Originally Posted by Mistral13

Re: Pinch Wheel

I was about to ask if you wanted me to contact the guy for further supplies as I have his e-mail address.

As far as I can see, the only difference between these and the original is that the new ones use polyurethane instead of rubber (neoprene?) for the roller surface.

Naturally I can't speak for their longevity having only recently fitted one, but my roller fits, works, is concentric and does the job. Apart from ordering one from the USA, these are currently the only game in town.

Thank you, I was going to ask how the new Pinch Roller was performing.