Wet 1969 ITT-KB junior battery radio

[ekjdm14]

Wow, much respect for taking on this resurrection... Are you a fan of Shango066 on Youtube by any chance? I ask because this is a task I think even he'd shy from & he's done some pretty miraculous stuff with "too far gone" TV and radios.

Also mention it because in a recent video he was experimenting with swapping TOKO type coils to fix the FM on a set but found that they're very much not a standardised thing so take care to research the right ones & don't just grab anything the same colour.


On the speaker, 8.5x6cm? I'll have a root through my stash and see if there's anything 8R suitable & you'd be welcome to it if i can find one. EDIT- Just had a cursory glance through the box of goodies, only speakers I can find close-ish are either a 4-pack of 8R quarter watt 5.5cm round jobbies or an ex-LCD telly 8R 10w oval 4.5cm x 13cm approx measurements. (it is pretty shallow though, 3cm deepest at the magnet & under 2cm otherwise so either it or 2 of the .25w round could be bodged in at a push) Not sure if either would be any help to you, but you're welcome to them for postage if they're any use?

[Philips210]

Originally Posted by audion_1908

Strangely battery anti-rattle foam is still good! I'm tempted to put it back,

Hi.

That is odd. That type of foam usually turns to dust after being exposed to prolonged damp. I don't know but if the the radio was under water and starved of air then maybe the foam won't rot as it would say in damp air conditions?

Regards,
Symon

[Radio Wrangler]

Jeepers, I remember my brother getting one of these as a birthday present, and now I'm old enough to see one in the guise of an archaeological item!
As restorations go, this one is right up there with the driftwood telly.

Use a junior hacksaw or just a blade with a wound tale handle to cut the polyvaricon shaft off. The remaining stub might come out if pressed in a vice with careful support of the plastic. else it can be drilled and then cut apart with needle files. More work, but safer.

David

[audion_1908]

Originally Posted by ekjdm14

Wow, much respect for taking on this resurrection... Are you a fan of Shango066 on Youtube by any chance? I ask because this is a task I think even he'd shy from & he's done some pretty miraculous stuff with "too far gone" TV and radios.

Also mention it because in a recent video he was experimenting with swapping TOKO type coils to fix the FM on a set but found that they're very much not a standardised thing so take care to research the right ones & don't just grab anything the same colour.


On the speaker, 8.5x6cm? I'll have a root through my stash and see if there's anything 8R suitable & you'd be welcome to it if i can find one. EDIT- Just had a cursory glance through the box of goodies, only speakers I can find close-ish are either a 4-pack of 8R quarter watt 5.5cm round jobbies or an ex-LCD telly 8R 10w oval 4.5cm x 13cm approx measurements. (it is pretty shallow though, 3cm deepest at the magnet & under 2cm otherwise so either it or 2 of the .25w round could be bodged in at a push) Not sure if either would be any help to you, but you're welcome to them for postage if they're any use?

Yes I do watch Shango066 on YouTube and was thinking of him as I was cleaning all the dirt and rust out of the radio, I love his resurrections! But he mostly has desert baked goods lol

Yes I was not going to just swap can type coils, I was just looking to see ball park costs, and due to this radios condition I see no problem with modification if needed.

The speaker I have is so rusty I think I got the measurements wrong, an antique radio website list the speaker as 6 by 9 cm 8 ohms 0.4w.
I just went and had a look at the case is for a 6cm by 9 cm speaker hole, so 6-inch round will probably do fine, so I will go for 1 of your 5.5cm 0.25w speakers as there is barely 2 cm between the PCB and front grill, and a cut-out for the speaker magnet, so a real pain to fit any other speaker. Thanks for offering the speakers!
Do you take PayPal?

[audion_1908]

I can't find any datasheets on the bt-1 transistor other than the basic information that's it's
(PNP silicon planar transistor for universal purposes bias transistor in a medium power push-pull stage)
I will have to do more research, maybe on other ITT-KB radios

[audion_1908]

Originally Posted by Philips210

Hi.

That is odd. That type of foam usually turns to dust after being exposed to prolonged damp. I don't know but if the the radio was under water and starved of air then maybe the foam won't rot as it would say in damp air conditions?

Regards,
Symon

That is my theory to, though as it dries out to the cardboard box it might turn to dust, there was other foam in the radio that turned solid, and has been scraped out.

[audion_1908]

Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler

Jeepers, I remember my brother getting one of these as a birthday present, and now I'm old enough to see one in the guise of an archaeological item!
As restorations go, this one is right up there with the driftwood telly.

Use a junior hacksaw or just a blade with a wound tale handle to cut the polyvaricon shaft off. The remaining stub might come out if pressed in a vice with careful support of the plastic. else it can be drilled and then cut apart with needle files. More work, but safer.

David

This radio is like an archaeological item or something exhumed from the grave.
I had to Google driftwood TV but sadly didn't find anything, I googled polyvaricon as I had not known the name before and realised where two of the mystery trimmer caps where, as I couldn't find them on the PCB as they are hiding on the variable capacitor! and these small variable capacitors are sold on eBay and some come with extended shaft so a good replacement if they have the same capacity, unfortunately the tuning wheel is molded and goes all the way down to the surface the capacitor, and I need the wheel, the pictures show it must have originally had a screw go all the way down and too much of its head is rusted away so there's no slot left, I tried unscrewing with pliers but there's not enough to grab, I think I will have to just find a file and file the remains of of The screw heads off, then carefully wash all the iron filings away!

[ekjdm14]

Originally Posted by audion_1908

....6-inch round will probably do fine, so I will go for 1 of your 5.5cm 0.25w speakers as there is barely 2 cm between the PCB and front grill, and a cut-out for the speaker magnet, so a real pain to fit any other speaker. Thanks for offering the speakers!
Do you take PayPal?

Guessing 6" is a brain-trump moment & you mean 6cm? I hope so anyway as the round speakers I have are very definitely 5.5 cm not inches. I'll send the TV elliptical one as well as it quotes better power handling capability & is pretty darn slim/can be mutilated slightly to fit if required too. I have a feeling it might have better response than the round. (plus the only use I have for it is the mounting grommets are ideal turntable motor mount bodge fixers!)

I do have a paypal but depending how much it ends up being I might just put it down to my good deed for the decade! Will let you know when they're sent anyway, hopefully get to the post office next few days if you could PM your address.

Cheers

[audion_1908]

Yes 6inch was a mistake it's 6cm, and I would like to pay the post, as you being generous enough with speakers!

Also the filing of the remanence the screw heads proved useless.

At least the replacement capacitor trimmers are cheap

[Radio Wrangler]

Originally Posted by audion_1908

I had to Google driftwood TV but sadly didn't find anything, I googled polyvaricon as I had not known the name before and realised where two of the mystery trimmer caps where, as I couldn't find them on the PCB as they are hiding on the variable capacitor! and these small variable capacitors are sold on eBay and some come with extended shaft so a good replacement if they have the same capacity, unfortunately the tuning wheel is molded and goes all the way down to the surface the capacitor, and I need the wheel, the pictures show it must have originally had a screw go all the way down and too much of its head is rusted away so there's no slot left, I tried unscrewing with pliers but there's not enough to grab, I think I will have to just find a file and file the remains of of The screw heads off, then carefully wash all the iron filings away!

Someone on the forum had a go at a TV found washed up on the seashore and got it running!

Glad to have helped with a steer to 'polyvaricon'.

Looks like you'll have to drill the metal capacitor shaft away to free the tuning cord wheel.

David

[audion_1908]

I don't have a drill, and do you leave a link to the driftwood TV!

[Lloyd 1985]

Here’s the telly from the sea thread;

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...d.php?t=107328

Regards
Lloyd

[audion_1908]

Thanks for the link, it was very entertaining, I never knew CRT TV's float, you tend to think of them as heavy things and not think of the fact that they are actually hollow!

Saltwater Is much more corrosive than fresh especially with the dissimilar metals as you get galvanic corrosion, the TV was surprisingly good condition! Much better than my radio, how long was my radio submerged!

[Philips210]

Hi

I've opened my set and taken a few pics. Unfortunately, it's not the same PCB as in your set and appears to be a later model using silicon transistors in the output stage. The actual model I have is an ITT Junior 21.

The front end of the set may still use the same polyvaricon, IFTs, Osc coil and ferrite rod aerial assembly though.

I tried to find the numbers on the IFTs, Osc coil and polyvaricon:

TOKO Yellow IFT 10T1 460? last number obscured (presumably 4601)

TOKO Black IFT 10T1 4603

Unnamed Brown/White IFT T14 602

TOKO Red Osc coil wrapped in sellotape so would need to be removed for further inspection.

Mitsumi.Elec.Co.Ltd Polyvaricon Model PVC - 2X

Looking at the numbers on some of the TOKO IFTs, I wonder if the IF is 460kHz. From my experience, the majority of sets use 455kHz. Philips often use 470kHz.


The cord drive drum fitted to the polyvaricon is simply secured by a small screw as is usually the case. I have known this screw on other make sets to have corroded threads making it difficult to remove.


See attached pics of my PCB.

Hope this info may be of some use.

Regards,
Symon

EDIT: It appears the TOKO AM IFTs are designed for an operating range of 455 to 470kHz so my suggestion of the radio's IF being 460kHz may be incorrect. The service info should give the correct IF for your set.

[Lloyd 1985]

One thing I’ve thought of with your radio, was it submerged with batteries fitted? I have a strange electro mechanical clock made by Gibson, it used to be my Grandads, in his shed, but it went missing after he got dementia. When we were clearing his shed after he had died, my Dad came across a metal tin full of big rust drill bits and a disgusting slop of rust infused water, he passed it to me to chuck in the skip, I emptied it out to see if there was anything else in there, imagine my horror when I drained the slop from it and saw it was actually the Gibson clock!! It ran from 4.5V, and I remember years back I’d put a 3 AA cell holder in it and set it going with some batteries fitted, my guess is that it stopped, my Grandad took it down to change the batteries, forgot what he was doing with it, and promptly left it face down and used it to put some drills in... then the shed roof leaked, later collapsed, and filled the poor clock with water! The batteries must have still been in it, and they had corroded away completely, but the gunk from the dissolved cells had made a nasty corrosive solution which did the clock no good at all. Amazingly I managed to save the clock, a few new springs and a new hairspring for the balance wheel got it running, and a good clean and polish to the case made it look good again.

Regards
Lloyd

[audion_1908]

Originally Posted by Philips210

Hi

I've opened my set and taken a few pics. Unfortunately, it's not the same PCB as in your set and appears to be a later model using silicon transistors in the output stage. The actual model I have is an ITT Junior 21.

The front end of the set may still use the same polyvaricon, IFTs, Osc coil and ferrite rod aerial assembly though.

I tried to find the numbers on the IFTs, Osc coil and polyvaricon:

TOKO Yellow IFT 10T1 460? last number obscured (presumably 4601)

TOKO Black IFT 10T1 4603

Unnamed Brown/White IFT T14 602

TOKO Red Osc coil wrapped in sellotape so would need to be removed for further inspection.

Mitsumi.Elec.Co.Ltd Polyvaricon Model PVC - 2X

Looking at the numbers on some of the TOKO IFTs, I wonder if the IF is 460kHz. From my experience, the majority of sets use 455kHz. Philips often use 470kHz.


The cord drive drum fitted to the polyvaricon is simply secured by a small screw as is usually the case. I have known this screw on other make sets to have corroded threads making it difficult to remove.


See attached pics of my PCB.

Hope this info may be of some use.

Regards,
Symon

EDIT: It appears the TOKO AM IFTs are designed for an operating range of 455 to 470kHz so my suggestion of the radio's IF being 460kHz may be incorrect. The service info should give the correct IF for your set.

Yes the pics are invaluable and look nearly identical, and for starters I know that the tuning capacitor should be fixed with a Phillips screw mine's just rusted down, the dial chord needs a spring, and the updated audio out may be easier to clone than find rare and likely to be expensive transistors.
Thanks!

[audion_1908]

Originally Posted by Lloyd 1985

One thing I’ve thought of with your radio, was it submerged with batteries fitted? I have a strange electro mechanical clock made by Gibson, it used to be my Grandads, in his shed, but it went missing after he got dementia. When we were clearing his shed after he had died, my Dad came across a metal tin full of big rust drill bits and a disgusting slop of rust infused water, he passed it to me to chuck in the skip, I emptied it out to see if there was anything else in there, imagine my horror when I drained the slop from it and saw it was actually the Gibson clock!! It ran from 4.5V, and I remember years back I’d put a 3 AA cell holder in it and set it going with some batteries fitted, my guess is that it stopped, my Grandad took it down to change the batteries, forgot what he was doing with it, and promptly left it face down and used it to put some drills in... then the shed roof leaked, later collapsed, and filled the poor clock with water! The batteries must have still been in it, and they had corroded away completely, but the gunk from the dissolved cells had made a nasty corrosive solution which did the clock no good at all. Amazingly I managed to save the clock, a few new springs and a new hairspring for the balance wheel got it running, and a good clean and polish to the case made it look good again.

Regards
Lloyd

The the radios battery compartment was still screwed shut when I got it, and I had to break some of the plastic to get it open unfortunately, I saw no evidence of batteries, but if the original batteries where old teck zink with paper labels they could have still been in there and completely disintegrated, but one set of batterie contacts are nearly pristine. The nearly completely rusted steel speaker turned into dark slime that seems to corrode probably through galvanic reaction. Also the rust goo stained the plastic, and not all has come off, I know often batterys are left in stuff and a leak and destroy it, and don't even need water for that, I was guessing about paper labels, were AA batteries sold in the last 51 years with paper labels?
I'm glad you got the clock working

The itt radios seller found it in his grandfathers attic

[Philips210]

Hi

Just checked in the service info for the model Junior 21, the IF is 470kHz.

Regards,
Symon

[Philips210]

Hi

I checked to see if the service info is available on the Service Data DVD-ROM and 'up top' but couldn't see it listed. Over on Elektrotanya I found some info on the ML1 and ML2 which may be compatible https://elektrotanya.com/itt_junior_...wnload.html#dl

Regards,
Symon

[1100 man]

Of all the completely bonkers basket case rebuilds people have done:- this takes the biscuit!!

Very well done for having a go and I wish you good luck with it! That speaker is amazing!!

I know you wanted something 'rough', but did you know how bad it was before you bought it? I'm surprised someone even bothered to list it!

Usually by now, 'Crackle' would have been along to offer his wisdom. He is Mr KB and is never far away from a thread on ITT/ KB. I think you must have terrified him into silence. He's probably horrified that someone could treat a KB radio so badly!!

I've got one of these but it's in a fake wood case and probably slightly newer than yours. Bought at my school jumble sale in about 1981 I think!

All the best
Nick