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Vintage Television and Video Vintage television and video equipment, programmes, VCRs etc. |
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5th Sep 2019, 10:01 am | #21 |
Heptode
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: London, UK.
Posts: 500
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Philips occasionally sold the multi/France models in Ireland as well with /07 at the end of the model number.
I imagine the thinking was it was not worth producing a PAL I model with UHF/VHF for such a small market when existing multi/France models would do. |
5th Sep 2019, 3:14 pm | #22 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Haarlem, Netherlands
Posts: 4,203
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
If it has the /07 suffix (post 1980), it is really intended for Ireland, not for France. Did those also receive SECAM L?
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5th Sep 2019, 4:58 pm | #23 |
Heptode
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Carshalton, Surrey, UK.
Posts: 735
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Hi
Philips did do a multistandard KT3 for France ? I think. I can take some pictures if anyone is interested.
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5th Sep 2019, 9:51 pm | #24 |
Heptode
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: London, UK.
Posts: 500
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
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5th Sep 2019, 10:18 pm | #25 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Haarlem, Netherlands
Posts: 4,203
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
KT3M chassis, I think. Always interesting to see one.
Philips Multi France sets might have had suffix /01 when sold in various countries or /19 when mainly intended for sale in France. Suffix /01 could mean other things as well, so it shouldn't be assumed to recieve SECAM L for all models with that suffix. |
5th Sep 2019, 11:38 pm | #26 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Madrid, Spain / Wirral, UK
Posts: 7,498
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
(sorry for going off on a tangent here!)
You have just reminded me of a 22" stereo Philips set (L6 chassis?) I found dumped here in Madrid when it was only 3 or 4 years old. Can't recall what I did to get it working, but when I did so, I remember puzzling over why the Nicam wouldn't work (Spain uses Nicam), later I saw the /19 prefix... Presumably that set, apart from SECAM for France, would be PAL B/G (zweiton FM stereo !) I still have it somewhere in the workshop. It would be interesting to see the menus on it for clues.
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6th Sep 2019, 11:30 am | #27 |
Nonode
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Herefordshire, UK.
Posts: 2,495
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
I had a UK purchased Grundig Multi-Standard set for many years - long gone now - which could handle many standards including French Band I SECAM, system l', transmissions. It had Zweiton Stereo which indeed was no use in the UK, but did work on DX transmissions.
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6th Sep 2019, 2:14 pm | #28 |
Nonode
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Stockport, Cheshire, UK.
Posts: 2,004
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
My 21" Philips certainly had PAL B/G & I and could display NTSC via scart, I'm not sure if it could display SECAM.
Even when set to UK it could tune Bands I to V.
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6th Sep 2019, 11:01 pm | #29 | |
Heptode
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: London, UK.
Posts: 500
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Quote:
France was fairly late coming to Nicam and Grundig multistandard sets sold in the UK would not decode it even though they worked on UK Nicam. Early on France used Antiope for teletext and I never found any set that could decode it. They later switched to world service teletext. Philips sold one set in the UK the 3850/05 that had a zweiton decoder optimised for system I, presumably with the second sound carrier at 6.242 MHz. This was future proofing that didn't work out. |
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21st Sep 2019, 2:32 pm | #30 |
Tetrode
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Bratislava, Slovakia
Posts: 65
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
We had a tesla model, I cant recall which one, but on the front panel below tuner was 2 push buttons, D-K / B-G and other ofc PAL/Secam , i think it must have been bought early 90s. Incidentally channel R5 ( band 2 vhf) was still on air here until 1999 at least in my reigon. The OIRT FM band only switched off by 2004. Good old days !
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21st Sep 2019, 6:44 pm | #31 |
Triode
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Madrid, Spain.
Posts: 28
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Just for facts' sake: in Spain, the national channels (both 'public' —TVE 1&2— and 'private' —just Antena 3; Tele 5 and C+ never bothered—) used NICAM (but only on selected transmitters)... and just a few regional (public) ones used Zweiton. CATV systems were a mixed bag.
Last edited by Tester.; 21st Sep 2019 at 6:50 pm. |
22nd Sep 2019, 12:10 am | #32 |
Heptode
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo, Norway.
Posts: 632
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Could the Nicam sets decode Zweiton?
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22nd Sep 2019, 1:46 am | #33 | |
Dekatron
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Madrid, Spain / Wirral, UK
Posts: 7,498
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Quote:
The earliest reference to stereo TV audio in Spain I have is in a Video recorder magazine from circa 1983. At that time it was not implemented but the German system was described as a possible future advance. Clearly, zweiton was not adopted widely in Spain, or for more than a few years, as when Nicam appeared it was quickly dropped - by the mid 1990s Nicam was established. Even TeleMadrid used to broadcast films in Nicam Dual I/II. Certainly, that station plus TVE, Antena3 and Telecinco were all using Nicam in the mid to late 1990s when I started living here.
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22nd Sep 2019, 3:40 pm | #34 |
Triode
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Madrid, Spain.
Posts: 28
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Tele 5 and C+ didn't bother with NICAM. And then again, to my knowledge, Antena 3 only offered it in Madrid. All the main regional (public) channels also went with NICAM from 1992 onwards — except for Catalonian ‘TV3’ and ‘Canal 33’, which kept the Zweiton system for quite a few years more.
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22nd Sep 2019, 3:52 pm | #35 |
Triode
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Madrid, Spain.
Posts: 28
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
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22nd Sep 2019, 8:26 pm | #36 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Madrid, Spain / Wirral, UK
Posts: 7,498
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Yes, at least Telecinco did, in Madrid and Barcelona.
Canal plus/sogecable used the old Nagravisión analogue encryption signal. Since I never bothered paying the 15,000 ptas plus subscription charges I cannot say first hand what audio they used. My partner's father had it, and I vaguely recall mono audio and snowy picture quality .
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Regards, Ben. |
22nd Sep 2019, 8:29 pm | #37 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Madrid, Spain / Wirral, UK
Posts: 7,498
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Again I must disagree. I have never in 20 years here found such a machine. The stereo videos and TVs were either one or the other system. However, I would be interested to see proof to the contrary.
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Regards, Ben. |
22nd Sep 2019, 9:53 pm | #38 | |
Triode
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Madrid, Spain.
Posts: 28
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
My memory may be playing tricks on me, but I distinctly recall that Tele 5 perhaps briefly tried, but abandoned the idea (ST/bil transmissions). Some cable operators maybe did serve the channel in (false?) ST/NICAM.
I've just gone back to a few tapes I recorded back then (receiving from Torrespaña) and indeed — Antena 3 in stereo, Tele 5 in mono. And I've also found some old posts online confirming my recollections: Quote:
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22nd Sep 2019, 10:13 pm | #39 |
Triode
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Madrid, Spain.
Posts: 28
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
More examples... and on my experience, even later-production units that didn't proclaim so with a badge, actually supported both systems. Bear in mind, I mostly deal with EU/EG units... but I also found this behaviour in EK models. YMMV
Last edited by Tester.; 22nd Sep 2019 at 10:20 pm. |
23rd Sep 2019, 9:42 am | #40 | |
Dekatron
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Madrid, Spain / Wirral, UK
Posts: 7,498
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Re: From SECAM to PAL
Quote:
Interesting that Catalan local TV kept the zweiton system going. Do you know if TVE still broadcast on VHF in the 2000s? I remember finding it on Channel 2-4 but that may have just been the antenna distribution system in the building I was living in then.
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Regards, Ben. |
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