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Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players Open-reel tape recorders, cassette recorders, 8-track players etc.

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Old 17th Jan 2020, 4:58 pm   #1
Trevor Leese
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Default Marconiphone 4214 Reel to Reel

Hi everyone, I'm a learner here so forgive me for such a menial post. I have stripped down my Marconi 4214 because the FF and RW are not working, the player is very clean inside with no grease anywhere, all rubbers are soft and the item works fine in play mode. The idler wheel situated between the selonoid wheel and the take up reel appears to do nothing at all, my question is : what does this wheel do and how should it work and how can I get this unit operational again.
Thanks
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 5:50 pm   #2
DMcMahon
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Default Re: Marconi phone 4214 Reel to Reel

Not menial at all. The arrangement look very similar to some of my Grundigs but the functionality may not be the same.

For the Grundigs when FFD is selected the mechanical linkages shift the Take Up reel table a small amount over to the left, making contact with the idler wheel and also results in the idler wheel being pushed over to make contact with the flywheel (directly motor driven), so the rotating flywheel then rotates the idler wheel which in turn rotates the Take Up Reel.

I sometime have problems with FFD (when loaded with tape), i.e. FFD can struggle sometimes depending upon the amount/ratio of tape on each spool, when this occurs the idler wheel I think still rotates, but does not then drive the Take Up Reel table, which I personally think maybe due to worn/hardened rubber of the idler wheel.

For the Grundig in RWD the mechanical linkages shift the Supply Reel Table over to the right a small amount to make contact with the rotating flywheel (metal in the case of the Grundig) and the Supply Reel Table then is directly driven by the flywheel (the rubber idler wheel then not doing anything).

What I am calling Flywheel in the Grundig is what you are calling I think solenoid wheel, which looks like rubber in your case, so if the solenoid wheel is worn or hardened then may cause some problems.

Note - with no tape/spools loaded I would expect RWD and FFD to basically function even if the rubber wheels are worn or hardened.
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 6:20 pm   #3
Trevor Leese
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Unhappy Re: Marconi phone 4214 Reel to Reel

Hi and thank you for your help, the rubber idler wheel next to the take up reel seems to be attached to nothing at all, if I manually push the wheel onto the solenoid wheel and hold it in place then it will rewind. What actually pushes the wheels over so as to engage the FF and RW?

Last edited by Trevor Leese; 17th Jan 2020 at 6:21 pm. Reason: word missing
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 6:50 pm   #4
dazzlevision
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Default Re: Marconi phone 4214 Reel to Reel

The turntables are mounted on cast metal swivel arms, and the grease in the bearings dries out, causing them not to move much. You will have to remove the turntables in order to gain access to these.

The turntable spindles pass through to the underside of the deck and are held in place by circlips/grip rings and there are also thin PTFE washers - be careful not to lose any and make a careful note of the assembly as you dismantle it.
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 8:42 pm   #5
DMcMahon
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Default Re: Marconi phone 4214 Reel to Reel

If the same as my Grundigs then yes the idler wheel is not attached, it is just driven in the case of FFD by the fact that the Take Up Reel Table is moved over to he left and makes contact with the idler wheel, which in turn is pushed over and makes contact with the motor driven flywheel so then all 3 are rotating.

If similar to Grundig then sounds like the Take Up Reel Table (and presumably the Supply Reel table) is not mechanically moving or not moving enough when FFD is selected to make contact with the idler wheel.

Sounds like dazzlevision hopefully has guided you to the area that maybe at fault.
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 8:46 pm   #6
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Default Re: Marconi phone 4214 Reel to Reel

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMcMahon View Post
Sounds like dazzlevision hopefully has guided you to the area that maybe at fault.
I’ve overhauled several of these decks and they all suffered from this fault.

The best way to separate the swivel arm component parts, is to heat the cast metal up (by the bearing) with a soldering iron, which softens the grease, allowing the bearing and shaft to come apart.
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 8:50 pm   #7
Trevor Leese
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Default Re: Marconi phone 4214 Reel to Reel

Quote:
Originally Posted by dazzlevision View Post
The turntables are mounted on cast metal swivel arms, and the grease in the bearings dries out, causing them not to move much. You will have to remove the turntables in order to gain access to these.

The turntable spindles pass through to the underside of the deck and are held in place by circlips/grip rings and there are also thin PTFE washers - be careful not to lose any and make a careful note of the assembly as you dismantle it.
Fantastic, I didn't realise the cast metal swivel arms move as they are jammed solid, I thank you so much for you invaluable experience and help. Trevor
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 8:52 pm   #8
Trevor Leese
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Default Re: Marconi phone 4214 Reel to Reel

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMcMahon View Post
If the same as my Grundigs then yes the idler wheel is not attached, it is just driven in the case of FFD by the fact that the Take Up Reel Table is moved over to he left and makes contact with the idler wheel, which in turn is pushed over and makes contact with the motor driven flywheel so then all 3 are rotating.

If similar to Grundig then sounds like the Take Up Reel Table (and presumably the Supply Reel table) is not mechanically moving or not moving enough when FFD is selected to make contact with the idler wheel.

Sounds like dazzlevision hopefully has guided you to the area that maybe at fault.
Thanks so much Dave, hopefully I can sort it now I've learnt something.
Trevor
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Old 17th Jan 2020, 10:11 pm   #9
DMcMahon
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Default Re: Marconiphone 4214 Reel to Reel

Trevor,

I have learned (you never stop learning) something also, I now know what to check on this model (or one of its alias's) if it exhibits these symptoms.

David
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Old 18th Jan 2020, 6:04 pm   #10
Trevor Leese
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Default Re: Marconiphone 4214 Reel to Reel

Thanks Dave and dazzle vision, I done it and everything is fine now.
Thank you so much.
Trevor
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Old 18th Jan 2020, 6:07 pm   #11
Trevor Leese
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Thumbs up Re: Marconiphone 4214 Reel to Reel

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMcMahon View Post
Trevor,

I have learned (you never stop learning) something also, I now know what to check on this model (or one of its alias's) if it exhibits these symptoms

David
We are never too old to learn are we, I try to learn something new everyday if I can.
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Old 18th Jan 2020, 7:20 pm   #12
DMcMahon
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Default Re: Marconiphone 4214 Reel to Reel

Very well done !
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