UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Powered By Google Custom Search Vintage Radio and TV Service Data

Go Back   UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum > Specific Vintage Equipment > Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players

Notices

Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players Open-reel tape recorders, cassette recorders, 8-track players etc.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 28th Aug 2022, 7:10 pm   #1
ubaldojhp
Triode
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Cartagena, Spain
Posts: 37
Default Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Hi, long time since my last visit.
I have a Grundig tk 23 L. It's nothing to write home about but it works and I have a couple of tapes on it. I have recorded them with the akai 4000 ds which has not given me any problem at 3 3/4 but when I play them on the Grundig they sound very fast, like twice the speed. The belts look good but before I started changing them I wanted to know if there is a way to adjust the speed.
I have it set to 240 v and I changed two capacitors that were bad and I also cleaned and greased it. Fast forward and reverse go perfectly.

Thanks in advance, Ubaldo
ubaldojhp is offline  
Old 28th Aug 2022, 10:39 pm   #2
DMcMahon
Dekatron
 
DMcMahon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK.
Posts: 6,736
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Hello Ubaldo and a warm welcome to the Forum.

That sounds unusual, there is no speed adjustment.

What is your mains voltage frequency ? if you are on 60Hz and the machine has a 50Hz motor pulley then I think the machine would run 20% faster.

David
DMcMahon is online now  
Old 28th Aug 2022, 11:28 pm   #3
DMcMahon
Dekatron
 
DMcMahon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK.
Posts: 6,736
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

If your machine has the 50Hz/60Hz selection links/tags (on the voltage selection panel) then ensure they are correctly set to match your mains voltage frequency.

David
DMcMahon is online now  
Old 29th Aug 2022, 9:38 am   #4
ubaldojhp
Triode
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Cartagena, Spain
Posts: 37
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Thanks for answering. I'll take a look and see if it fixes it. Thanks a lot
ubaldojhp is offline  
Old 29th Aug 2022, 5:36 pm   #5
simpsons
Octode
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Harrow, London, UK.
Posts: 1,554
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Hi Ubaldo

Whilst Grundigs are made in Europe, the 50Hz pully may have been changed because an earlier owner travelled to the USA or another 60Hz country. Not too sure though.

I wonder though if it isn't down to the tracks your Akai Stereo recorder used to make your recordings.

The Grundig is a Mono 4 track recorder. Google: Track Positions for a more detailed explanation.

Before examining the pully and I guess it may have some markings to identify the mains frequency, who knows, record on the Grundig and playback on the Akai to confirm the Grundig speed is correct.



Chris
simpsons is offline  
Old 29th Aug 2022, 6:28 pm   #6
ubaldojhp
Triode
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Cartagena, Spain
Posts: 37
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Thanks for your reply. It is a very logical option and it is something that I am thinking about. I will try to see
ubaldojhp is offline  
Old 29th Aug 2022, 6:54 pm   #7
ubaldojhp
Triode
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Cartagena, Spain
Posts: 37
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Before recording I have to solve a problem. I have connected the auxiliary input to a cd but I have no sound. I have to find out what's going on. The same thing happens with the external speaker output.
ubaldojhp is offline  
Old 29th Aug 2022, 9:02 pm   #8
Analogue man
Hexode
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Raunds, Northamptonshire, UK.
Posts: 382
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

The speed issue could well be the motor run capacitor.
__________________
Graham
Analogue man is offline  
Old 29th Aug 2022, 9:27 pm   #9
ubaldojhp
Triode
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Cartagena, Spain
Posts: 37
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

I have found this under the chassis

Scheme
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20220829_222234.jpg
Views:	91
Size:	46.1 KB
ID:	263890   Click image for larger version

Name:	Screenshot_2022-08-29-22-22-02-984_cn.wps.moffice_eng.jpg
Views:	89
Size:	27.2 KB
ID:	263891   Click image for larger version

Name:	Screenshot_2022-08-29-22-50-54-021_cn.wps.moffice_eng.jpg
Views:	78
Size:	37.2 KB
ID:	263900  
ubaldojhp is offline  
Old 29th Aug 2022, 10:04 pm   #10
DMcMahon
Dekatron
 
DMcMahon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK.
Posts: 6,736
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

This series of Grundig machines do not use motor run capacitors.

David
DMcMahon is online now  
Old 29th Aug 2022, 10:24 pm   #11
DMcMahon
Dekatron
 
DMcMahon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK.
Posts: 6,736
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by ubaldojhp View Post
Before recording I have to solve a problem. I have connected the auxiliary input to a cd but I have no sound. I have to find out what's going on. The same thing happens with the external speaker output.
Have you lost the Playback sound you had from the tapes at Post # 1 ?

David
DMcMahon is online now  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 5:42 am   #12
ubaldojhp
Triode
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Cartagena, Spain
Posts: 37
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

No David, the tape sounds ok with the same issue. The other problem is with the aux input. No sound when I connect the iPod in radio or mic input. Maybe Im doing something wrong
ubaldojhp is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 9:14 am   #13
DMcMahon
Dekatron
 
DMcMahon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK.
Posts: 6,736
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

I am not sure what you are trying to do:-

1. Playback the iPod signal using the TK 23 as an amplifier.

2. Trying to record but no sound on playback of recording.

3. Trying to record but not able to hear/monitor the record signal during recording (I don't think that the TK 23 can monitor the record signal).

If it is 2 or 3, is it the same in manual and automatic recording and do you see the record signal on the Magic Eye record level.

David
DMcMahon is online now  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 9:49 am   #14
ubaldojhp
Triode
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Cartagena, Spain
Posts: 37
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Sorry if I'm doing something wrong. I'm trying to record something from Grundig itself but I don't think I'm doing it right. I connect the ipod to the input and press the red key and play but it doesn't record. Only the music already recorded on the tape is heard
ubaldojhp is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 10:02 am   #15
simpsons
Octode
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Harrow, London, UK.
Posts: 1,554
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Hi Ubaldo

Do you have the user manual for this recorder?

I don't have the TK23L in front of me right now but Grundig recorders had many features which include dubbing, audio amplifier only and so on. The downside was that the user needed to understand how each was turned on or off.

The user manual is available on the web but be careful that you don't end up downloading the service manual. Suppliers can have the habit of saying one thing and doing the other!

Chris
simpsons is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 11:08 am   #16
ubaldojhp
Triode
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Cartagena, Spain
Posts: 37
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

I have the manual downloaded but it is in German. I have to translate it word for word
ubaldojhp is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 12:11 pm   #17
DMcMahon
Dekatron
 
DMcMahon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK.
Posts: 6,736
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Your attachments to Post 9 are from radiomuseum and are from the German Service Manual, if this is the same manual you reference directly above, then it is not the User manual.

David
DMcMahon is online now  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 12:32 pm   #18
DMcMahon
Dekatron
 
DMcMahon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK.
Posts: 6,736
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Somewhere I have the TK23L User manual (English only), just need to find it.

If you are happy to pass on your email address to me via a PM (Private Message) I can scan it and email to you.

David
DMcMahon is online now  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 12:36 pm   #19
Analogue man
Hexode
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Raunds, Northamptonshire, UK.
Posts: 382
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMcMahon View Post
This series of Grundig machines do not use motor run capacitors.

David
OK, I based my comment on other Grundig machines of the era which did and although I did own a TK23 it was when I was 14 and I'm over 50 years older now so the memory is probably playing tricks.
__________________
Graham
Analogue man is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2022, 12:57 pm   #20
DMcMahon
Dekatron
 
DMcMahon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK.
Posts: 6,736
Default Re: Grundig tk 23 L speed issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by ubaldojhp View Post
I have found this under the chassis

Scheme
The photo shows it correctly linked for 240 volts operation, this assumes your local mains voltage supply is a nominal 230/240 volts.

The green and blue wires soldered to the 50Hz tags is correct for 50Hz mains supply.

Note that some variants of the TK 23 have no mains voltage frequency adjustment (intended for 50Hz operation only). The variants with mains voltage frequency adjustment can either be by solder tags (like yours) or selectable links, like the voltage adjustments.

David
DMcMahon is online now  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 5:55 pm.


All information and advice on this forum is subject to the WARNING AND DISCLAIMER located at https://www.vintage-radio.net/rules.html.
Failure to heed this warning may result in death or serious injury to yourself and/or others.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2002 - 2024, Paul Stenning.