Mystery console set - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

mark pirate · 22nd Jul 2018, 9:41 pm

Can anyone recognise this huge set I just saved from a skip?
It is post war as the dial has third, home & light on it.
There is no sign of a maker or model number, but if I had to guess, it could be an RGD. It certainly looks to be a high quality set, with push-pull output & 12" Truvox speaker. The dial is a rotating drum, all valves are Mazda.

Mark

G6Tanuki · 22nd Jul 2018, 9:45 pm

3-gang tuning-capacitor, what looks like two IF stages, and P/P output; it's certainly a cut above your average set.

bigtony · 22nd Jul 2018, 9:48 pm

Looks like a `Sobell', no idea of the model but had a table model with the same chassis some years ago.

music-centre · 22nd Jul 2018, 9:55 pm

Hi,
Yes a Sobell -possibly a 717C
Steve.

Nanozeugma · 22nd Jul 2018, 10:31 pm

This thread might help - although the cabinet.....
https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ad.php?t=64683

mark pirate · 22nd Jul 2018, 11:06 pm

Thanks to all for your help, I am guessing that it is quite a rare beast?
It certainly is in poor cosmetic shape, although no sign of damp storage or woodworm, the curved dial glass (perspex?) is missing and the the trim is pretty bent up and chips out of the veneer do nothing for it's appearance!

The innards however, look in good condition, I think it may be worth sticking it on the variac....

Mark

Techman · 22nd Jul 2018, 11:34 pm

Absolutely, give it the mains - I would!

Looks like it has a couple of KT61 (or their equivalent) type valves for the output.

I'm guessing the back cover is missing, hence not knowing the model type until identified?

joebog1 · 22nd Jul 2018, 11:42 pm

Whatever it is its a nice set worth restoring.
RF stage, 2 IF stages and about 17 watts out.
I wish I had it

Joe

Techman · 23rd Jul 2018, 12:01 am

Looks like it may use PEN45 output valves. Should sound good. Such a shame there's hardly anything left to listen to on straight AM only sets.

At least the VP41s are upright - I find they're less than long term reliable when operated in a chassis that's mounted on its side or at an angle. The trick I've found is that when there's more than one on such a chassis, is that as luck would have it, the valve holders tend to be mounted in different orientations, so swapping the valves between holders/bases every so often usually sorts out any problems - a bit like turning a speaker to make the cone droop the other way. The TH41 type seems not to suffer from this problem, which is lucky seeing as there's always only one on the chassis.

Herald1360 · 23rd Jul 2018, 12:32 am

Looks like it's a 719C- same chassis as 717. There's a Trader sheet for it in Paul's CD and up top which helpfully has a picture showing the console cabinet.

TonyDuell · 23rd Jul 2018, 4:53 am

I thought I remembered something odd about that set...

There is a nice surprise in the output stage. There is a negative feedback winding on the output transformer in the cathode circuit of the output valves. That is not too common in a radio/radiogram. You did well to rescue it, it should be an interesting set.

mark pirate · 23rd Jul 2018, 8:42 am

Quote:

I'm guessing the back cover is missing, hence not knowing the model type until identified?

There is a back, although it has had the cloth on the vent holes changed for some old curtains

Quote:

Looks like it may use PEN45 output valves. Should sound good. Such a shame there's hardly anything left to listen to on straight AM only sets.

It does indeed have two PEN45's, in fact all seven valves are Mazda.
All the Sobell sets I have used international octal valves (mostly Brimar, as the set in my avatar).

Quote:

Absolutely, give it the mains - I would!

I will get round to it one evening this week, and report back.
Also rescued at the same time was a Grundig 2035/56 & a Brenell TR MK5, both are in a better condition, although the Grundig has had something pushed through the speaker cloth and damaged the cone.

Here is a photo of the Sobell back panel.

Mark

Techman · 23rd Jul 2018, 12:31 pm

That has a nice 'proper' back cover - sign of quality?

The large round ventilation holes probably wouldn't have had any grill behind them originally - wouldn't have complied with today's regulations.

You can't beat an old curtain, although it's kept some of the dust out, its density wouldn't have been very good as regards cabinet ventilation, but it looks like the innards survived the possible added heat.

unitaudio · 23rd Jul 2018, 4:15 pm

Why would someone throw something like that on a skip?! I despair of people, I really do. Thankfully you were in the right place at the right time! Well saved!

Regards,
Paul

FERNSEH · 23rd Jul 2018, 6:30 pm

Michael Sobell's company always made good stuff but the first post war products were magnificently over engineered, bear witness to the set we're discussing here. I'm glad it's been saved.

DFWB.

mark pirate · 23rd Jul 2018, 9:59 pm

Quote:

Michael Sobell's company always made good stuff but the first post war products were magnificently over engineered, bear witness to the set we're discussing here.

I have a few examples of Sobell's early postwar sets, very well made & good performers.

Initial testing showed an O/C mains switch, with this bridged there is still no power getting through. I am hoping the transformer primary is OK.
I will have a better look when time allows.

Quote:

Why would someone throw something like that on a skip?! I despair of people, I really do. Thankfully you were in the right place at the right time! Well saved!

It came from a house being cleared, I was tipped off that there were a few TV's, but modern plastic sets hold no interest for me.

Mark

boxdoctor · 29th Jul 2018, 9:57 am

The (very dark) shot of the speaker suggests its not the original one for that set.
It doesn't seem to be fittted properly, from what I can make out from the picture. Also the bit of the baffle showing suggest it may possibly have originally had an elliptical speaker.
I could, of course, be mistaken. Tony.

Herald1360 · 29th Jul 2018, 11:38 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by unitaudio

Why would someone throw something like that on a skip?

Regards,
Paul

Scenario:

You live in Birmingham. Your sole surviving parent dies in Worthing, leaving you with a house worth £350,000 along with its contents, worth maybe £10,000 if you pick them over carefully and spend time selling them. A local house clearance bloke has a look and says he'll give you £500 and clear the place for you. Your parents had all sorts of old stuff, some from your grandparents. You're overworked, your missis never liked her inlaws anyway, what would you do?

Take the £500 (a drop in the ocean) or spend weeks sorting through a heap of old junk in case anything might interest a stranger?

greenstar · 29th Jul 2018, 12:02 pm

A half competent dealer would either have taken it to a car boot sale or had the valves out of it. And it's easier to Freecycle something than haul it into a skip! I guess the problem is this was perceived as junk.

22nd Jul 2018, 9:41 pm	#1
mark pirate Dekatron Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK Posts: 5,185	Mystery console set Can anyone recognise this huge set I just saved from a skip? It is post war as the dial has third, home & light on it. There is no sign of a maker or model number, but if I had to guess, it could be an RGD. It certainly looks to be a high quality set, with push-pull output & 12" Truvox speaker. The dial is a rotating drum, all valves are Mazda. Mark Attached Thumbnails

22nd Jul 2018, 9:45 pm	#2
G6Tanuki Dekatron Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Wiltshire, UK. Posts: 14,007	Re: Mystery console set 3-gang tuning-capacitor, what looks like two IF stages, and P/P output; it's certainly a cut above your average set.

22nd Jul 2018, 9:48 pm	#3
bigtony Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Diss, Norfolk, UK. Posts: 26	Re: Mystery console set Looks like a `Sobell', no idea of the model but had a table model with the same chassis some years ago.

22nd Jul 2018, 9:55 pm	#4
music-centre Heptode Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK. Posts: 687	Re: Mystery console set Hi, Yes a Sobell -possibly a 717C Steve.

22nd Jul 2018, 10:31 pm	#5
Nanozeugma Heptode Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: London, UK. Bury, Lancashire quite regularly :) Posts: 611	Re: Mystery console set This thread might help - although the cabinet..... https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ad.php?t=64683 __________________ Thermionic Emission, warms the cockles of your tubes.

22nd Jul 2018, 11:06 pm	#6
mark pirate Dekatron Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Worthing, West Sussex, UK Posts: 5,185	Re: Mystery console set Thanks to all for your help, I am guessing that it is quite a rare beast? It certainly is in poor cosmetic shape, although no sign of damp storage or woodworm, the curved dial glass (perspex?) is missing and the the trim is pretty bent up and chips out of the veneer do nothing for it's appearance! The innards however, look in good condition, I think it may be worth sticking it on the variac.... Mark Attached Thumbnails

22nd Jul 2018, 11:34 pm	#7
Techman Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Lincolnshire, UK. Posts: 5,000	Re: Mystery console set Absolutely, give it the mains - I would! Looks like it has a couple of KT61 (or their equivalent) type valves for the output. I'm guessing the back cover is missing, hence not knowing the model type until identified?

22nd Jul 2018, 11:42 pm	#8
joebog1 Banned Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Mareeba, North Queensland, Australia Posts: 2,704	Re: Mystery console set Whatever it is its a nice set worth restoring. RF stage, 2 IF stages and about 17 watts out. I wish I had it Joe

23rd Jul 2018, 12:01 am	#9
Techman Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Lincolnshire, UK. Posts: 5,000	Re: Mystery console set Looks like it may use PEN45 output valves. Should sound good. Such a shame there's hardly anything left to listen to on straight AM only sets. At least the VP41s are upright - I find they're less than long term reliable when operated in a chassis that's mounted on its side or at an angle. The trick I've found is that when there's more than one on such a chassis, is that as luck would have it, the valve holders tend to be mounted in different orientations, so swapping the valves between holders/bases every so often usually sorts out any problems - a bit like turning a speaker to make the cone droop the other way. The TH41 type seems not to suffer from this problem, which is lucky seeing as there's always only one on the chassis. Last edited by Techman; 23rd Jul 2018 at 12:09 am.

23rd Jul 2018, 12:32 am	#10
Herald1360 Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 16,536	Re: Mystery console set Looks like it's a 719C- same chassis as 717. There's a Trader sheet for it in Paul's CD and up top which helpfully has a picture showing the console cabinet. __________________ ....__________ ....\|____\|\|__\|__\_____ .=.\| _---\__\|__\|_---_\|. .........O..Chris....O

23rd Jul 2018, 4:53 am	#11
TonyDuell Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Biggin Hill, London, UK. Posts: 5,225	Re: Mystery console set I thought I remembered something odd about that set... There is a nice surprise in the output stage. There is a negative feedback winding on the output transformer in the cathode circuit of the output valves. That is not too common in a radio/radiogram. You did well to rescue it, it should be an interesting set.

23rd Jul 2018, 12:31 pm	#13
Techman Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Lincolnshire, UK. Posts: 5,000	Re: Mystery console set That has a nice 'proper' back cover - sign of quality? The large round ventilation holes probably wouldn't have had any grill behind them originally - wouldn't have complied with today's regulations. You can't beat an old curtain, although it's kept some of the dust out, its density wouldn't have been very good as regards cabinet ventilation, but it looks like the innards survived the possible added heat.

23rd Jul 2018, 4:15 pm	#14
unitaudio Heptode Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Manchester, UK. Posts: 862	Re: Mystery console set Why would someone throw something like that on a skip?! I despair of people, I really do. Thankfully you were in the right place at the right time! Well saved! Regards, Paul __________________ ...No, it's not supposed to pick up the World Service, it's not a radio!

23rd Jul 2018, 6:30 pm	#15
FERNSEH Dekatron Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Gateshead, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 7,444	Re: Mystery console set Michael Sobell's company always made good stuff but the first post war products were magnificently over engineered, bear witness to the set we're discussing here. I'm glad it's been saved. DFWB.

29th Jul 2018, 9:57 am	#17
boxdoctor Rest in Peace Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Ripley, Derbyshire, UK. Posts: 785	Re: Mystery console set The (very dark) shot of the speaker suggests its not the original one for that set. It doesn't seem to be fittted properly, from what I can make out from the picture. Also the bit of the baffle showing suggest it may possibly have originally had an elliptical speaker. I could, of course, be mistaken. Tony.

29th Jul 2018, 12:02 pm	#19
greenstar Octode Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Leicester, Leics. UK. Posts: 1,685	Re: Mystery console set A half competent dealer would either have taken it to a car boot sale or had the valves out of it. And it's easier to Freecycle something than haul it into a skip! I guess the problem is this was perceived as junk.