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Old 18th Nov 2018, 3:30 pm   #1
sobell1980
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Default Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Hi all,
I think I've done my homework correctly. I'm hoping to purchase the original Beomaster amp and tuner to match with my Beogram 1000.
My Beogram 1000 does not have a pre amp so I'm currently using a sepearate pre amp to use it. Can anyone help me confirm that the Beomaster has an RIAA built in internal preamp? Or will I still have to use a sepearate one? Looking on Beoworld I believe it should already have this but thought I would ask the experts on here. Also would the Beovox 1000 speakers be original and suitable to this amp?
Many thanks.
Dave.
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Old 18th Nov 2018, 5:02 pm   #2
Nickthedentist
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

This page from Studio263's amazing site implies that the Beomaster 1000's RIAA preamp was optional too: https://beocentral.com/beomaster1000

Quote:
Two record players could be connected, initially both of the type with ceramic pickups, though an optional preamplifier could be fitted inside the Beomaster so that a B&O magnetic pickup could be connected directly.
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Old 18th Nov 2018, 5:15 pm   #3
sobell1980
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Hi Nick,
Great to hear from you. Thanks for the reply. I was reading from here
https://www.beoworld.org/prod_details.asp?pid=316
If you check the tech spec it says RIAA built in? Oh no, it's a bit conflicting.
Dave
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Old 18th Nov 2018, 5:21 pm   #4
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

On that link above it tells us that only the Stereo decoder was an option on one of the models.
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Old 18th Nov 2018, 5:37 pm   #5
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

From memory (you need to check), the early germanium 1000s with white keys tended NOT to have the phono preamp or the stereo decoder fitted, the later silicon models with black keys mostly had preamp and decoder fitted. Whether that reflected standard fitting out in the factory, or the customers of later models usually requesting both options I couldn’t say.

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Old 18th Nov 2018, 8:37 pm   #6
sobell1980
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Many thanks, Stuart for your reply. I have contacted the seller and he tells me it's a type 2316. He also tells me it has the pre amp built in because it is type 2316. Checking the photos it does have the black type piano keys.
Dave.
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Old 18th Nov 2018, 9:16 pm   #7
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

I had one with black keys for a while and that certainly had an RIAA preamp built in.
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Old 19th Nov 2018, 7:33 pm   #8
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Unfortuneately I missed out on the Beomaster 1000. There are still a few about so I will keep looking for the right one. Thanks to all the replies. It will serve well for the future when I finally get one armed with a bit of product knowledge now. Many thanks
Dave
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Old 23rd Nov 2018, 6:15 pm   #9
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

On the original (white) one the magnetic cartridge pre-amplifier is a separate module on a hinged bracket on top of the main PCB. The stereo decoder (if fitted) is next to it. This model uses germanium transistors and gives about 15W of output, enough to 'destroy small loudspeakers' as it says on the back. They didn't put that on the Beolab 5000s of the same era though - 2 x 60W or 120W mono!

In the case of the later (black) one the magnetic pre-amplifier is part of the main PCB, but the stereo decoder is still separate and lives in the same place that it did before. This model uses silicon transistors and gives about 20W. Most of these later ones came with stereo decoders, unlike the 900 of the era which usually didn't. Be ware though, since collectors seem to prefer 900s to 1000s many of the latter seem to have had their decoders removed to fit to the former (they are much the same). Check that it is present if this is important to you. The green 'stereo' lamp also comes on when tape or phono are selected, so it is easy to be fooled by pictures.

The black Beomaster 1000 was reputedly the first piece of work for B&O undertaken by designer Jacob Jensen, who is credited with giving B&O the long, thin look which characterised their range for the next couple of decades. It would be my choice, they work a lot better than the white ones.
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Old 6th Dec 2018, 9:14 pm   #10
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Looking at the B and O 900 models they are much more appealing than th3 Beomaster 1000! I think I've been converted, although the 900 will still need the preamp. The output of the 900 is 2x5 watts. What would be suitable Beovox speakers to run off the 900? I wouldn't want to buy something that would end up under powered as the Beomaster 1000 is 2x15 watts power for the speakers.
Also regarding my Beogram 1000, are there different coils required for the styli SP9 and the Sp14? Or can both these styli be used on the same coil. I've had some advice about needing to change the coil if I'm to upgrade to the Sp14.
Many thanks.
Dave.
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Old 7th Dec 2018, 12:10 pm   #11
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sobell1980 View Post
Looking at the B and O 900 models they are much more appealing than th3 Beomaster 1000!
Remember that the Beomaster 900 didn't meet the DIN45500 standards for hi-fi but the 1000 did. The 1000 is a much better performer, especially the later ones. The 900 is nice though, but it's more a radio than a hi-fi.

Cartridges:

SP1 and SP2 use the same body, one has a standard mount, the other a B&O mount. There is only one stylus, it has a conical tip.

SP7 and SP8 are an updated version of this which use a 15 Deg. tracking angle. They are not interchangeable with the SP1 or SP2 in any way. These also have conical styli, but the SP9 stylus fits them and has an elliptical tip.

SP10 / 10A and SP12 were for the new arm designs, starting with the Beogram 1800 (60s type) and 1200. This cartridge and stylus combination will fit in the Beogram 1000 type arm but the compliance is wrong. The SP10 is conical, the SP12 is elliptical. The SP10A is an SP10 with a B&O-type mount, the SP10 has a standard mount.

SP14 is a general purpose replacement stylus which is intended to work with everything. You can fit it to a Beogram 1000, but you need the SP10A-type body as it doesn't fit on the SP6 / SP7 one properly. It also works for SP10 and SP12 applications, but it is a simple conical stylus.

SP15 is a special cartridge just for the Beogram 4000. It was later re-named 'MMC4000'. This was the start of the little plug-in ones that you can'r replace the stylus in.
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Old 7th Dec 2018, 4:49 pm   #12
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

That's great. Very useful information. So what should be fitted as standard to my Beogram 1000? Everything I look up tells me an SP14A and no variants on that either. I will post some pictures too shortly of mine.
Many thanks
Dave.
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Old 7th Dec 2018, 5:04 pm   #13
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

It would have come with an SP7, unless the owner was feeling flush and decided to spring for an SP9 (gold coloured, and it came in a little rosewood box with a gold B&O badge on it too!) instead. The Beogram 1001 (same thing really) came with an SP14 from new.

An SP14 is fine so long as you have the correct cartridge body for it. The SP7 one has a flange at the back (pin end) which prevents the outer can of the SP14 stylus going back all the way. If your cartridge body in your 1000 is the later type then the SP14 is the correct replacement. Avoid the SP10 and SP12 for that application though, as mentioned in my previous reply.

Later on the SP14 was all they stocked for this range, which is great if you had a Beogram 1000 (etc) but less exciting if you had a big Beocenter 3500 and your elliptical SP12 had worn out (guess how I know!). Similarly they only made the MMC20S and the MMC4 to cover the later types, even though these were just the basic ones. A Beogram 8000 with an MMC20S in it is a strangely pitiful sight, although sometimes it is necessary.

The downforce adjustment seems to be fantastically inaccurate on the Beogram 1000 so don't trust it, especially if you go down the SP14 route. Instead, use a test record or advance the setting until the bottom of the cartridge just avoids scraping on the record. 2.5 > 3.0 on the scale is usually about right.
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Old 7th Dec 2018, 5:16 pm   #14
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Here are some photos.
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Old 7th Dec 2018, 5:29 pm   #15
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

That's an SP9 on an SP7 body, correct for the machine. Unless its worn out or broken an SP14 is NOT an upgrade from what you have. An SP14 stylus does not fit properly on that type of cartridge body.

Note that if you choose a Beomaster 900 instead of a 1000 your turntable will need a built-in preamplifier - the 900 does not have an input for magnetic cartridges (odd, I know!). The Beogram 1000VF normally has one, the 1000V normally does not (it has a shorting plug instead).

Just a thought, the Beomaster 1400 is a good blend of the merits of both the Beomaster 900 and the 1000, and is superbly made (a die cast chassis - for a radio!). The 1600 is much the same thing, just not quite as nice looking in my view. You don't need a Beogram 1000 with a preamplifier if you go for the 1400 / 1600. Or just 'go large' with a chunking big Beolab 5000, it's the correct era...
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Old 7th Dec 2018, 5:45 pm   #16
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sobell1980 View Post
Unfortuneately I missed out on the Beomaster 1000.
I had one for a few years back in the late 80s and wasn't particularly impressed, probably because its output wasn't very powerful. Always sounded a bit 'muddy' and lacking in detail. The selector switches were also a bit crude, IIRC. I think the radio section was better than the amp! Still, I used it until the magic smoke came out one day (output stage self destructed!). The amps from only a few years later seemed a great deal better to my ears.
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 7:10 pm   #17
sobell1980
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Hi Studio263 and to all else who have contributed. I am now the proud owner of a Beomaster 1000. It still comes with its original box and instruction book. Now just to find the period speakers to suit it.
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 8:41 pm   #18
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Well done, Dave.

I have a pair of these you can have FOC if they're any good to you: https://beocentral.com/beovox600

They were originally partnered with one of these: https://beocentral.com/beogram1500recordplayer

Nick.
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 9:56 pm   #19
sobell1980
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

Wow, really Nick? I'm overwhelmed . I thought I was going to have to wait to save some more to find a pair . This could even mean I have the whole set up running by Christmas. Will these speakers handle the 20 watt output from the amp? I think it's 20 watt, may be 15 watt.
Kindest regards
Dave.
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Old 9th Dec 2018, 11:13 pm   #20
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Default Re: Beomaster 1000 Preamp?

They'd be fine if you didn't drive it flat out.

They're nothing spectacular, but they'd fit in style- and period-wise, and you could always upgrade to something more upmarket later.

N.
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