Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

tri-comp · 25th Nov 2018, 7:32 pm

I've recently come into possession of a lot of NOS Lorenz EM71A magic eye valves with Loctal sockets.
You will not find a lot of valve-testers with setup data for testing these.
Possibly AVO CT/VT/VCM-testers have but an AVO is quite out of my league (says my wife

)
What I do have are emission-testers (Heathkit TC-1 & TC-2) and they're fine for testing eye-valves imho.
They'll easily show what's left of the magic green glow (if any) and even do an emission test of the amplifying element (triode) inside.
What's missing is of course the setup data for any European valve other than EM80 (=6BR5), EM81 (=6DA5) and EM84 (=6FG6).
In this thread I'll publish whatever setup data I manage to get working for NOS eye-valves on the Heathkit TC-tester line.
EM4 / EM34 with appropriate socket-adapters are planned.

EM71A:
EYE Closed:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BDE, Bottom = FGH
EYE Open:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BD, Bottom = EFGH
Triode:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 22, TOP = FE, Bottom = GH

tri-comp · 25th Nov 2018, 8:22 pm

I got a few Russian 6E5C (6E5S in Latin) and a single 6E5 a month ago when I went to Kiev, UA.
The major technical market is located about 1Km away from our apartment there.
Quite a place for finding vintage valves and passive components from the Soviet era.
Vintage valve data books are in another place; the "Petrovka" book market.
I homed in on that place too

The setup data for 6E5C/6E5 is here:

6E5C/6E5:
EYE Closed:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = CF, BOTTOM = EGH
EYE Open:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = F, BOTTOM = CEGH
Triode:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 30, TOP = CE, BOTTOM = GH

tri-comp · 25th Nov 2018, 8:52 pm

Setup for EM34:

EM34:
EYE Closed, both sections:
TYPE = 4, Fil.= 6.3V, Plate = 0, TOP = CEF, BOTTOM = DGH
EYE Open, Section a:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3V, Plate = 0, TOP = EF, BOTTOM = DGH
EYE Open, Section b:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6,3V, Plate = 0, TOP = CE, BOTTOM = DGH
Triode:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 22, TOP = CDF, BOTTOM = GH

turretslug · 25th Nov 2018, 9:08 pm

You lucky fellow! The EM71 (and -A) must be one of the nicest magic eyes around.

tri-comp · 26th Nov 2018, 12:16 am

Yes, that was quite a bit of luck. I got 22 NOS in one fell swoop.

And you are of course right; the EM71(A) is one of the nicest eye-valves ever developed.
Even when it's turned-off it has an appealing look.
My camera doesn't work well for taking pictures of bright objects but here's what I got.

FrankB · 26th Nov 2018, 12:59 am

Those are pretty much unobtainium here in the U.S. I envy your trip there to find tubes & parts.
OTOH, 6AL7's are really easy to find here.

G4XWDJim · 26th Nov 2018, 10:21 am

Are there any other differently numbered local based magic eye valves. Apologies if I’m slightly off topic.

I ask the question because I have just delivered a box of loctal valves, 25 or so for sale in a forthcoming BVWS auction and noticed there were some magic eyes but didn’t pay them any attention and so didn’t look at their numbers.

Jim

tri-comp · 26th Nov 2018, 8:03 pm

There is the EM72 which is very much the same as EM71 except for the eye pattern.
Same pinout and most likely the same data.
I have never actually seen an EM72 or specific data for that valve, but I know some valve-testers show the setup to be the exact same for the EM71 & EM72.
Therefore it should be added to my list here showing the same setup as EM71(A).

EM72: (Not confirmed with actual specimen)
EYE Closed:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BDE, Bottom = FGH
EYE Open:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BD, Bottom = EFGH
Triode:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 22, TOP = FE, Bottom = GH

tri-comp · 26th Nov 2018, 10:07 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrankB

Those are pretty much unobtainium here in the U.S. I envy your trip there to find tubes & parts.
OTOH, 6AL7's are really easy to find here.

I do know the 6AL7 as I have 4 NOS Sylvanias on hand.
They were bought a long time ago in the US because I want to explore what use they are for stereo peak volume indicators.
Since it's only possible to use half of the indicator-travel for this purpose, as the sections are not symmetrical, I think this specific use is limited.
Perhaps instead they can be used as bias-indicators when balancing push-pull output stages and if anyone has more/better suggestions I'll be all ears.
No so interested in their very well documented original purposes.

Still, I believe they were $1,-/ea so no real harm done

tri-comp · 27th Nov 2018, 8:11 pm

Here's the setup-data for EFM11.
This is a valve with an 8-pin socket type G8A known from German steel valves like EF12.
The insert this valve into the Heathkit tester you'll need to make an adapter G8A Female to IO (International Octal) Male according to the attached picture.

A note:
This adapter may obviously be used for testing ANY GG8A-socket valve in the Heathkit testers if you have the correct setup data.
I'm not planning to publish data for other than eye valves here but as I also have a few B&K valve testers types 607 & 667, this adapter was constructed for testing G8A valves on these testers.
I have already compiled 80+ A4 pages of setup data, not only G8A types, for the B&K's not found in any B&K setup chart.
At some point in the future, possibly when I finish gathering Loctal valva data, I'll post all B&K setup data on the forum.

EFM11:
EYE Closed:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = AD, Bottom = GH
EYE Open:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = A, Bottom = DGH
Tetrode:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 22, TOP = F, Bottom = DGH

tri-comp · 29th Nov 2018, 10:05 pm

Telefunken EMM801 dual indicator eye.
For compairing levels according to Telefunken.
No reason it can't be used as stereo audio-signal indicator imo.

EMM801:
EYE Closed, both sections:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BFH, BOTTOM = CEGJ
EYE Open, Section a:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BH, BOTTOM = CEFGJ
EYE Open, Section b:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BF, BOTTOM = BCEGJ
Triode, Section a:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 27, TOP = G, BOTTOM = CE
Triode, Section b:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 27, TOP = J, BOTTOM = CE

tri-comp · 2nd Dec 2018, 4:11 pm

Here's the setup-data for EAM86.
Widely used in R-to-R tape recorders as Record Level Indicators.

EAM86:
EYE Closed, both sections:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = FG, BOTTOM = CE
EYE Open:
Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = G, BOTTOM = CEF
Triode:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 20, TOP = H, BOTTOM = AEJ
Diode:
Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 40, TOP = B, BOTTOM = AEJ

25th Nov 2018, 7:32 pm	#1
tri-comp Heptode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aalborg, Denmark Posts: 903	Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. I've recently come into possession of a lot of NOS Lorenz EM71A magic eye valves with Loctal sockets. You will not find a lot of valve-testers with setup data for testing these. Possibly AVO CT/VT/VCM-testers have but an AVO is quite out of my league (says my wife ) What I do have are emission-testers (Heathkit TC-1 & TC-2) and they're fine for testing eye-valves imho. They'll easily show what's left of the magic green glow (if any) and even do an emission test of the amplifying element (triode) inside. What's missing is of course the setup data for any European valve other than EM80 (=6BR5), EM81 (=6DA5) and EM84 (=6FG6). In this thread I'll publish whatever setup data I manage to get working for NOS eye-valves on the Heathkit TC-tester line. EM4 / EM34 with appropriate socket-adapters are planned. EM71A: EYE Closed: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BDE, Bottom = FGH EYE Open: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BD, Bottom = EFGH Triode: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 22, TOP = FE, Bottom = GH

25th Nov 2018, 8:22 pm	#2
tri-comp Heptode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aalborg, Denmark Posts: 903	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. I got a few Russian 6E5C (6E5S in Latin) and a single 6E5 a month ago when I went to Kiev, UA. The major technical market is located about 1Km away from our apartment there. Quite a place for finding vintage valves and passive components from the Soviet era. Vintage valve data books are in another place; the "Petrovka" book market. I homed in on that place too The setup data for 6E5C/6E5 is here: 6E5C/6E5: EYE Closed: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = CF, BOTTOM = EGH EYE Open: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = F, BOTTOM = CEGH Triode: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 30, TOP = CE, BOTTOM = GH

25th Nov 2018, 8:52 pm	#3
tri-comp Heptode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aalborg, Denmark Posts: 903	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. Setup for EM34: EM34: EYE Closed, both sections: TYPE = 4, Fil.= 6.3V, Plate = 0, TOP = CEF, BOTTOM = DGH EYE Open, Section a: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3V, Plate = 0, TOP = EF, BOTTOM = DGH EYE Open, Section b: Type = 4, Fil.= 6,3V, Plate = 0, TOP = CE, BOTTOM = DGH Triode: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 22, TOP = CDF, BOTTOM = GH

25th Nov 2018, 9:08 pm	#4
turretslug Dekatron Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Surrey, UK. Posts: 4,394	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. You lucky fellow! The EM71 (and -A) must be one of the nicest magic eyes around.

26th Nov 2018, 12:16 am	#5
tri-comp Heptode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aalborg, Denmark Posts: 903	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. Yes, that was quite a bit of luck. I got 22 NOS in one fell swoop. And you are of course right; the EM71(A) is one of the nicest eye-valves ever developed. Even when it's turned-off it has an appealing look. My camera doesn't work well for taking pictures of bright objects but here's what I got. Attached Thumbnails

26th Nov 2018, 12:59 am	#6
FrankB Heptode Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Olympia, Washington, USA. Posts: 664	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. Those are pretty much unobtainium here in the U.S. I envy your trip there to find tubes & parts. OTOH, 6AL7's are really easy to find here.

26th Nov 2018, 10:21 am	#7
G4XWDJim Octode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Littlehampton, West Sussex, UK. Posts: 1,465	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. Are there any other differently numbered local based magic eye valves. Apologies if I’m slightly off topic. I ask the question because I have just delivered a box of loctal valves, 25 or so for sale in a forthcoming BVWS auction and noticed there were some magic eyes but didn’t pay them any attention and so didn’t look at their numbers. Jim

26th Nov 2018, 8:03 pm	#8
tri-comp Heptode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aalborg, Denmark Posts: 903	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. There is the EM72 which is very much the same as EM71 except for the eye pattern. Same pinout and most likely the same data. I have never actually seen an EM72 or specific data for that valve, but I know some valve-testers show the setup to be the exact same for the EM71 & EM72. Therefore it should be added to my list here showing the same setup as EM71(A). EM72: (Not confirmed with actual specimen) EYE Closed: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BDE, Bottom = FGH EYE Open: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BD, Bottom = EFGH Triode: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 22, TOP = FE, Bottom = GH

27th Nov 2018, 8:11 pm	#10
tri-comp Heptode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aalborg, Denmark Posts: 903	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. Here's the setup-data for EFM11. This is a valve with an 8-pin socket type G8A known from German steel valves like EF12. The insert this valve into the Heathkit tester you'll need to make an adapter G8A Female to IO (International Octal) Male according to the attached picture. A note: This adapter may obviously be used for testing ANY GG8A-socket valve in the Heathkit testers if you have the correct setup data. I'm not planning to publish data for other than eye valves here but as I also have a few B&K valve testers types 607 & 667, this adapter was constructed for testing G8A valves on these testers. I have already compiled 80+ A4 pages of setup data, not only G8A types, for the B&K's not found in any B&K setup chart. At some point in the future, possibly when I finish gathering Loctal valva data, I'll post all B&K setup data on the forum. EFM11: EYE Closed: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = AD, Bottom = GH EYE Open: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = A, Bottom = DGH Tetrode: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 22, TOP = F, Bottom = DGH Attached Thumbnails

29th Nov 2018, 10:05 pm	#11
tri-comp Heptode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aalborg, Denmark Posts: 903	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. Telefunken EMM801 dual indicator eye. For compairing levels according to Telefunken. No reason it can't be used as stereo audio-signal indicator imo. EMM801: EYE Closed, both sections: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BFH, BOTTOM = CEGJ EYE Open, Section a: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BH, BOTTOM = CEFGJ EYE Open, Section b: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = BF, BOTTOM = BCEGJ Triode, Section a: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 27, TOP = G, BOTTOM = CE Triode, Section b: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 27, TOP = J, BOTTOM = CE

2nd Dec 2018, 4:11 pm	#12
tri-comp Heptode Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Aalborg, Denmark Posts: 903	Re: Heathkit TC-1, TC-2 and TC-3 setup for eye-valves. Here's the setup-data for EAM86. Widely used in R-to-R tape recorders as Record Level Indicators. EAM86: EYE Closed, both sections: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = FG, BOTTOM = CE EYE Open: Type = 4, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 0, TOP = G, BOTTOM = CEF Triode: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 20, TOP = H, BOTTOM = AEJ Diode: Type = 1, Fil.= 6.3, Plate = 40, TOP = B, BOTTOM = AEJ