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Old 8th May 2016, 7:41 am   #1
G4YVM David
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Default 1154/1155 pair

Well my childhood dream has been realised... I've been offered a 1155/1154 pair. This pair was working a year or two ago but was allowed to get damp by being left in a shed shack. When switched on the main rx PA valves blew. These have been replaced but the set not yet reactivated, pending sale and being thoroughly dried and tested.

The thing is the seller is asking top dollar at almost 1300 quid so I'm a bit hesitant as although it WAS working it technically isn't now.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Any advice?

David

Last edited by G4YVM David; 8th May 2016 at 7:43 am. Reason: Clarify why damp
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Old 8th May 2016, 8:27 am   #2
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

Cosmetic condition, completeness, and a good bundle of the hard to find bits would be essential at this sort of price.

I dont think you mean rx PA valves - perhaps the Transmitter? if so the PT15 output valves are quite rugged - possible that some of the large wirewound resistors in the back of the set are suffering?

Of course, it could just be a problem in the power unit - are they the correct ones for the pair, or is it a home brew thing?
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Old 8th May 2016, 8:33 am   #3
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

Sorry, yes I meant tx. The new pair were bought for 250 quid, not by me.

The psu is home brew: it all worked beautifully two years ago! Cosmetically the whole thing is rather good and the chap who did the original restoration reckons that the two sets are good examples of type.


D
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Old 8th May 2016, 8:48 am   #4
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

There's a lot of old rubber insulated wiring in those things which will have gone brittle and crazed simply through time. This leaves them very susceptible to moisture, and with 1200v HT for the PT15s, it can be a bit dramatic. It will take a lot longer to dry out than intuition and impatience suggest.

If you want to use any 1155/1154 set, then even without a high-voltage 'event', I think you'd be needing to re-wire it.

Top dollar is for complete sets with all the DF stuff intact. Most that were used in amateur shacks had this stripped out to stick a mains PSU in and an output stage for a speaker. When they were sold off after the war, the cables and connectors were largely treated as scrap copper, so the connectors and sundries fetch rather high prices. Especially the 'J' switch.

Whether you buy this one or A N Other one, my crystal ball sees a lot of re-wiring in your future. Everybody and their granny now know that R1155s and especially T1154s fetch a lot of money, so there aren't many bargains to be had, though there are lots of hopeful people.

David GM4ZNX

Edit: Ah, you hadn't said they'd been restored in the first post. How much got done?
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Old 8th May 2016, 8:53 am   #5
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

David

That's very true. And when does a fully rewired set with replaced caps etc become a trio kenwood in a vintage case!??!

I think I may pass this one. I just don't have time to spend rewiring and retirement is still 12 years away!

D.
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Old 8th May 2016, 9:54 am   #6
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

A fair point - one I rescued from the skip needed complete re-wiring, no other choice. The point is though, that in many cases the allegedly unreliable valves will still work well and the inductors are usually OK after a bit of drying so it is still a restoration in that you can get back to the point where not only does it look good but you have a working example of the performance that could be expected in the day.
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Old 8th May 2016, 11:00 am   #7
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

I agree with Les, you'd have to make significant circuit changes before it stopped being an 1155/1154 pair. Yaesu and Trio only got involved when radio technology had moved on significantly from this era.

The trouble with vintage gear is that when the big money moves in, a lot of the fun moves out.

While the 1155/1154 setup is of definite historical interest, they are a bit of a pain to use, though they create interest on the bands or at special event stations. There were nicer receivers to drive of that era (HRO and AR88, or to stick to aircraft radios, BC348. Then there's the Collins TCS) And you can find them at affordable prices. Later Lancs sported American radios.

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Old 8th May 2016, 11:53 am   #8
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

"Later Lancs sported American radios" - I don't agree. Certainly the Canadian-built Lancasters were fitted with American radio equipment, but I don't think they can be described as 'later'. The UK-built aircraft were fitted with the T1154/R1155, as was its successor the Lincoln, and early Shackletons.

For £1300 I would expect the Tx and Rx to be pristine, accompanied by peripherals such as the Intercom amplifier, J-switch etc, and all interconnecting leads using the correct connectors such as C-backshell Jones connectors.

Andy
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Old 8th May 2016, 12:25 pm   #9
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

Maybe the one I had a go in was a Canadian one? It was a long time ago, and I thought I was told that BC348s had become a common fit.

David
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Old 8th May 2016, 12:33 pm   #10
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

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Originally Posted by M0FYA Andy View Post
For £1300 I would expect the Tx and Rx to be pristine, accompanied by peripherals such as the Intercom amplifier, J-switch etc, and all interconnecting leads using the correct connectors such as C-backshell Jones connectors.
Well, it's all there for sure: a fully "operational" 1155/1154 station. Unfortunately of course, it is also a thing of great beauty - modern designers in Japan might learn a thing or two.

I'll see it and let you know.

Oh the temptations.

D
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Old 8th May 2016, 12:55 pm   #11
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

"The valves blew" is one of those phrases that instantly arouses alarm and suspicion, and primes the "walk away" reflex. It's sufficiently vague as to cast doubt on the extent of understanding of the person making the diagnosis- and something needs to be very wrong to make valves (plural) "blow".
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Old 8th May 2016, 1:17 pm   #12
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

Indeed, and it seems £250 for new pair of PT15s has been staked on that diagnosis.

I'd want to get quite a lot more specific before buying replacements at that price.

David
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Old 8th May 2016, 1:51 pm   #13
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

I would be wary of the description "a fully "operational" 1155/1154 station" until I knew exactly what it comprised.

It would be quite feasible to get a Tx and Rx working on the amateur bands with very little else in the way of the other genuine items used in, say, a Lancaster installation or the cabinet used in a marine-craft installation.

On the other hand, if it does have all the other items to recreate an original installation it could indeed be a thing to go for.

The story of the valves is a bit worrying, though...

Andy
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Old 8th May 2016, 7:55 pm   #14
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

£250 for PT15s? Really? I am suprised.

I would stick with Andy's valuation I think, if it is just the TX and |RX without the correct connectors and accessories then £800 would be closer to the mark I think - we aren't into internet auction prices here.....
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Old 8th May 2016, 9:37 pm   #15
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

Thanks guys.

By "blew" I was simply using the vernacular expression for something that caused the valves to fail: I didn't diagnose the fault nor remove the old valves. As I say, when I last used the installation it was all fully functional and we were on air using cw.

Anyway, I'm going to see it this week.

David
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Old 8th May 2016, 10:38 pm   #16
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radio Wrangler View Post
If you want to use any 1155/1154 set, then even without a high-voltage 'event', I think you'd be needing to re-wire it.
As a regular user of a virtually untouched T1154 I beg to differ. Unless you're unlucky with this particular example I suspect you'll find the wiring not to be a problem, most of the rubber insulation being in good condition due to its cloth covering. The only component replacement required in mine was the re-stuffing of a dual paper capacitor can(C8/C21). http://www.tibblestone.com/oldradios...adio/T1154.htm

These iconic transmitters can frequently be heard on the VMARS Saturday morning AM net and, despite a tendency to drift, usually give a good account of themselves http://www.vmars.org.uk/Regular_NETS_Details
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Old 9th May 2016, 8:14 am   #17
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

Thanks Keith
If I do buy it...and it's looking increasingly likely let's be honest, can I pick your brains about renovation?

D
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Old 9th May 2016, 8:53 am   #18
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

I see that Colomor have NOS tested Marconi PT15's for sale at £65 each. I've always been very satisfied with any purchases from Colomor.

David, I hope you post some pictures when you buy it.

Andy
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Old 9th May 2016, 11:42 am   #19
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

Quote:
Originally Posted by G4YVM David View Post
Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Any advice?
The "going rate" for a T1154 in unrestored and non-working condition is about £500. That's based on seeing a number of sales at private auctions and on ebay. That does of course have to be complete, with no obvious breakages internally and fair to good cosmetic condition externally.

For the R1155 in a similar condition, around £200 would be the figure I would offer.

The only way I would pay the sum being asked is if the system were fully operational and could be demonstrated to be such. Clearly your seller cannot do this, and the amount of work to restore it to that condition is unknown, based on the information you have provided. You may call it "technically" not working - I would call it non-operational, simply because it can't be demonstrated to be anything else. Neither you - nor the seller - know what has to be done to get it working again.

So my estimate of a fair price for what you describe is £700. Maybe £800 if you want to be really nice to the seller.

Richard
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Old 9th May 2016, 11:53 am   #20
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Default Re: 1154/1155 pair

David,

I might add that if peripherals such as J-switch, DF loop, plugs/leads, morse key, microphone/headset, aerial current meter and intercom amp are all thrown in, plus a power supply that actually provides 1200V DC @ 200mA, 210V DC @ 110mA and 7V DC @ 13A are all thrown in... then £1300 may be a fair price, given that it will save you years of effort in rounding up all the hard to find bits.

Personally I would still want to satisfy myself as to the extent of any claimed restoration and also determine exactly what has failed that is stopping it working now.

Richard
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