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Vintage Tape (Audio), Cassette, Wire and Magnetic Disc Recorders and Players Open-reel tape recorders, cassette recorders, 8-track players etc.

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Old 29th Jul 2006, 9:56 pm   #1
tis your junk
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Question Ferrograph lubrication

Hi folks welcome to my first tread !https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...milies/eek.gif
I seem to have accumulated a few ferrographs over the past year rangeing from a series 2 to a series 6 (and would love to get my hands on a model D). Some are in quite a bad way but half the fun I find is putting them back together again. And so to my problem, what do you lubricate them with? Thus far I have been using sewing machine oil which seems ok but what to use to grease the bearings? https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...ilies2/huh.gif

The handbooks say they should be packed with high viscocty grease so can anyone recomend a modern one?

Thanks in advance for your help.

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Old 29th Jul 2006, 10:57 pm   #2
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Default Re: Ferrograph lubrication

Hello and welcome, I hope you find this site as interesting as I have. I have used Molygrease on my machines, it’s modern grease but I don’t know if anyone else has a better solution? As for the Ferrograph Series D, they are great machines; I have one myself which can be seen Here.
Good luck finding one and look forward to hear more about your collection.
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Old 29th Jul 2006, 11:25 pm   #3
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Default Re: Ferrograph lubrication

Hi Reel-to-reel man
Thanks for your reply, I have to say I've lurked on this site for a while but have not had the time to spend with the machines that have come my way. However the series 6 I have just got needed urgent help, mainly from being stored in the damp. The main motor had seized up, great, but I have cleared that and now need to re-assemble, hence the grease question.
I have some black Molyslip grease this that the type you mean? and do you use that on the sliding bars under the deck or just oil?

Thanks again

tis your junk

PS sorry about the spelling errors I get so use to auto correction, it make you lazy!
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Old 29th Jul 2006, 11:33 pm   #4
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Default Re: Ferrograph lubrication

Moly Grease from Multispec Lubricants, I must admit I don’t know where it came from, it was given to me by a friend and I don't know where he brought it from

For the bars and sliders, I used a little grease, when the recorders needed it, the only ones I had put it on where still working when I sold it and have had no complaints so I would have thought that would do the job
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Old 30th Jul 2006, 2:37 am   #5
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Default Re: Ferrograph lubrication

I think the only stipulation with moly grease is not to use it in roller bearings.

When I bought my series 5 in 1979 its capstan motor was also seizing. Some sewing machine oil in the felt pads fixed it and it's gone along happily ever since.
Good luck with fixing the old Ferro's. Tim
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Old 30th Jul 2006, 9:08 am   #6
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Default Re: Ferrograph lubrication

TYJ
Moly or other grease is fine for the sliding bars and the like.
Clean the brake drums, bands, capstan, idlers, motor pulley, pressure pads with IPA or meths. Grease detents on rotary switch.

The motors (and pinch roller) should not be greased, or you will have future problems.
This is the correct way to do it: ( up to Series 6 - know nowt about 7)
  • Dismantle the motor and remove the screws.
  • Clean the felts and bushes in solvent (petrol, lighter fuel, IPA) Dry thoroughly.
  • Warm oil (sewing machine or thin engine oil but not clock oil or 3-in-1) in a pan of boiling water and leave bushes and felts overnight.
  • Clean spindles and reassemble motor.
HTH
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Old 30th Jul 2006, 8:55 pm   #7
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Question Re: Ferrograph lubrication

Mike, and all.

Thanks very much for your responces and these have given me some food for thought.

I think I should have made myself clearer at the beginning, I am talking about the main capstan motor not the reel motors As I to know newt about series 7s I refer to the series 6 handbook which quotes that the bearings are "grease packed ball races" that "require no regular attention" however the lower one on the motor was seized solid. A Renault valve spring compressor was pressed into service (sorry about the pun) to get it off and after a good clean it seems serviceable, and is a ball race made by Hoffmann

So the question still remains what to pack it with?

Thanks again for your help

Tis your junk
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Old 31st Jul 2006, 7:52 am   #8
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Default Re: Ferrograph lubrication

TYJ
Hmmm...I was sure that the S6 capstan motor had the same construction as the reel motors, except for the rotor and stator - can anyone confirm or disprove that? Maybe thay changed the motor after the S5?

I know that the actual capstan spindle has a pair of ball races in it, in which case, they need light grease. It has been proved that a ball or roller bearing should only have the minimum of grease applied to it.

I would use any "normal" grease that you would get from a motor factor.
Oh - just remembered - your cars probably don't need greasing, like ours do!

Something like Castrolease LM or Total Multis.
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Old 31st Jul 2006, 9:38 pm   #9
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Question Re: Ferrograph lubrication

MP
You are right! having looked at my "collection" and my brothers machines ( he is a real Ferro nut, I wouldn't talk about leaving ferro's on tips with him around) it would appear that up to series 5 they had felt pads on series 6 machines this has been replaced with an enclosed ball race, so good call.

I note you say it should it be LM (low melting point?) but would high melting point molyslip be better?

Careful, for someone brought up on a 1934 Austin 12/4 light tourer I know exactly how to use a grease gun but - true the car I drive now does not need greasing for precisely that reason.

Thanks again for all your advice

TYJ
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Old 5th Aug 2006, 10:37 am   #10
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Default Re: Ferrograph lubrication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Phelan
TYJ
I know that the actual capstan spindle has a pair of ball races in it, in which case, they need light grease. It has been proved that a ball or roller bearing should only have the minimum of grease applied to it. I would use any "normal" grease that you would get from a motor factor.
I have a service manual for the MOD version of the Series 6 decks which gives advice on lubrication and greasing. The actual lubricants quoted are now obsolete, but for both capstan motor and capstan bearings, as for the amount of grease to use, it recommends "two spots the size of a match head", which seems to follow the minimum amount principle.

For sliding parts I use a moderately thick, yellowish zinc-based "anti-seize" grease available from Halfords (or at least it was a few years ago). For reel motors and other bearings I use Electrolube light mechanical oil.

For ball races I use a cream-coloured, light grease with added teflon I bought in a small tub from a cycle shop about 5 years ago. It seems to do the job nicely. But I've still to master the best way to remove the bottom bearing of the S-6 capstan motor, which is usually fitted with bearing retaining adhesive. Dismantling the capstan bearing is similarly hampered, and in both cases the utmost care must be taken not to deform the spindle.
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Old 6th Aug 2006, 8:40 pm   #11
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Question Re: Ferrograph lubrication

Flywheel,

Thanks very much for your information I'm sure I would have over greased those bearings otherwise.
Could I ask you to quote what grease is recommended in the MOD manual as I can look for modern equivalents or at least compare specs.

Could you also tell me more about the bearing retaining adhesive used on the spindle is that also quoted in the MOD manual? or somewhere else? or bitter experience!.

I am no expert, but to remove the bottom ball race you need some sort of extractor/puller and as I stated in my original e-mail I used a motor car valve compressor which seemed to do the job nicely. On that subject how do you remove the top bearing? is that stuck in as well? ( this is my next task)

Many thanks to you all for your help

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Old 30th Aug 2006, 10:37 am   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tis your junk View Post

Could I ask you to quote what grease is recommended in the MOD manual as I can look for modern equivalents or at least compare specs.

Could you also tell me more about the bearing retaining adhesive used on the spindle is that also quoted in the MOD manual? or somewhere else? or bitter experience! On that subject how do you remove the top bearing? is that stuck in as well? (this is my next task)

Tis your junk
Sorry for the delay getting back. The grease the manual recommends is 'Rocol MT380', and lubricating oil 'OM33 (Def. 2007)'. The manual for the domestic version of the Series 5 also specifies 'Aeroshell fluid no. 3' as a lubricating oil.

I don't know what bearing retaining adhesive was used, as although the manual discusses dismantling and regreasing both capstan and cap. motor bearings, nowhere is this mentioned, which must have been confusing for service personnel. However, on the cap. motor, only the bottom bearing ever seems to have this.

I've cleaned and re-greased a couple of these Series 6 capstan and cap. motor bearings (possibly unnecessarily!), and each time I refitted the ball races with Locktite 641 bearing adhesive (excluding the top motor bearing). I should think, though, that as the purpose of it is to prevent 'fretting', due to any slight slack between the parts, any slowish acting cyanoacrylate-type glue might do the job.
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