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Old 16th Sep 2016, 3:52 pm   #1
PJL
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Default Old hobby lathe identity

Can anybody point me in a direction where I can identify this lathe and its age. I saved it from scrap for £10 but its in pretty terrible condition with missing handles, various bent bits, and a tailstock that is a right mess.

There are no markings and the bed is about 2' long in total. It was obviously multi-purpose as it came with a slide/tools and a rest.
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Old 16th Sep 2016, 4:09 pm   #2
G4XWDJim
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Default Re: Old hobby lathe identity

As a lad I remember using a South Bend lathe that was admittedly twice the size but looked of similar shape in its design.

Jim
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Old 16th Sep 2016, 7:55 pm   #3
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Default Re: Old hobby lathe identity

Hello,
These are similar http://www.lathes.co.uk/hayward/ , http://www.lathes.co.uk/holtzapffel/ but you might want to work through all the makes here http://www.lathes.co.uk/index.html and see if you can find anything closer.
Yours, Richard
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Old 16th Sep 2016, 8:24 pm   #4
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Default Re: Old hobby lathe identity

Searching lathes.uk may find it, bur I don't think it's a South Bend. South Bend was the name of a prolific maker, not a single model.I believe all their lathes that made it to these shores from Chicago were screwcutters, and that one doesn't seem to be. There's no end of a leadscrew showing at the tail end.

THe small South Bends were the inspiration for all manner of copies. My Myford 'M' (not 'ML7') shows a lot of South Bend influence in styling.

Even a simple turning lathe without a leadscrew can make a lot of bits for rebuilding radios and just plain making stuff. THe chuck looks like a Bernerd 3-jaw and seems later than the rest of the machine.

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Old 16th Sep 2016, 9:02 pm   #5
David G4EBT
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Default Re: Old hobby lathe identity

Given that lathes are intended to be used by skilled people who are able to work with precision to close tolerances, it never fails to amaze me just how badly abused many of them are. If you look at the cast iron tailstock on that lathe, you'll see that it's had a chunk smashed off it. Can't imagine how that can have happened. If you can see a name on any of the components such as the lathe bed, you may be able to identify it at the splendid website http://www.lathes.co.uk/

You could also e-mail some pics to Tony at that site - he's very clued up.

Yes, it has a woodturning tool-rest and tool-post so it's been used for both woodturning and metalworking, which is far from ideal as the speed at which a woodturning lathe is required to rotate - particularly for small diameter spindle work - is far higher than for metalwork. The rule of thumb for the speed at which to run a woodturning lathe is: D" x RPM = 6,000 to 9,000.

So for example, a 10 inch diameter bowl blank should be run at a speed of 600 – 900 RPM. With the lathe running at 600 RPM, a 10" blank will have about 30 inches of timber per rev passing the tool, which is 18,000 inches per minute – 1,500 feet.

But to take say a 1" diameter spindle, for each rev, just 3" of wood is passing the tool for each rev, so using the 'rule of thumb', (D" x RPM = 6,000 - 9,000) that would call for a theoretical speed of 6,000 to 9,000 RPM - way higher than would be safe, and far higher in any event than the maximum speed of a typical woodturning lathe, 3,500 RPM or so. Hence, the lathe would be run at its highest speed - on my woodturning lathe that would be 3,600 RPM. But my little vintage Lorch metalworking lathe only runs at 1,500RPM on top speed, so would be found wanting for small spindle woodturning. The result is that when turning a wooden spindle at a slower than ideal speed, the fibres of the wood tend to tear rather than be cleanly cut, so instead of finishing it by sanding the shape of the wood, you end up having to sand the wood to shape. Even so, what matters is the end result - not how it's achieved, and skill with a skew chisel, taking light cuts, can overcome the slow speed handicap.

But looking at the state of that lathe, I don't think such considerations will have troubled the mind of the guy who last turned a piece of timber on it!

I have a chum who uses an ancient metalworking lathe to turn excellent pens. Someone said he couldn't do it, so he went right ahead and did so.

Another shortcoming of the mystery lathe from a metalworking perspective is that it has a 3-jaw scroll chuck, which - especially when worn - aren't noted for accurate centring, for which a 4-jaw independent chuck is needed. 'Run out' isn't quite as important with large diameter work but it is on small diameter, where the stock would normally be 'clocked' with a dial test indicator. ('DTI').

Though it doesn't have much going for it, for all that, the lathe not beyond redemption, and if cleaned up, it would no doubt be capable of being used for non-precision work, which I guess has been its lot in life, which to date, hasn't been a happy life for it in 'lathedom'! It has to be said that for those of us of a certain age ('make do and mend' etc), in a world in which many people know the price of everything and the value of nothing, there's a special satisfaction to be derived from making something from nothing, even when it may amount to no more than trying to put lipstick on a pig!

I've rambled way off the topic of identifying the lathe, but I hope these ramblings have some relevance to the lathe itself.

Even if its identity remains a mystery, have fun with the lathe - I would.
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Old 16th Sep 2016, 9:33 pm   #6
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Default Re: Old hobby lathe identity

It's a shame it has been so ill treated as its quite a useful lilftable size. When we were looking for a house, one guy had a lathe in a shed in the garden. The lathe weighed several tons and had been craned in and the shed built around it and his only choice was to destroy the shed to get it out.

My plan for it at the moment is to knock together a way of attaching it to my wood lathe so I can use the wood lathe as a drive. It would be a step up from using an electric drill and the grinder which I used to make a part for a crystal set. On the other hand it might be best to auction it off and buy one that works!
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Old 21st Sep 2016, 4:49 pm   #7
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Default Re: Old hobby lathe identity

Due to the cost of lathes in the " old days" people with more time than money, would make their own from a kit, or just from castings. Often from a design in a model makers magazine....
If you can add a v belt pulley, you can power it from a second hand motor or whatever you can find cheaply.
Old lathes usually use imperial sized tools available new even now.
South bend published a series of booklets on " how to run a lathe" and how to make simple accessories which can be found on the net as pdf's. Hopefully this will give you a start.
Hope this helps,
Phil
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