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Old 16th Jul 2017, 9:54 pm   #21
Philips210
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

Hi Steve.

I have not had a huge amount of experience servicing 405 line only sets and must admit to not seeing that type of tuner before so thanks for pointing what a fireball tuner actually is. The only VHF tuners that I came across were the Cyldon turret type.

Hopefully when I get the set repaired and working well then I will need to fabricate the LOPT screen from some galvanised sheet. When you get time, would you mind taking a few pics of your screen together with some important measurements?

Regards
Symon.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 1:07 am   #22
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

Excellent find Steve, You must have better quality skips up there Indeed it is pretty much the same chassis as the 'Spacemaker' although there are various minor circuit variations.
Yours does look a tad worse then Symons but it will be interesting to see what it's like after a good clean up. How rusty is the chassis metalwork??
It has quite a low valve count due to the circuit economies- for instance the reflex sound. Near the start of the 'Pilot PT650 Spacemaker thread' is a link to the trader service info & circuit although I prefer the one in the R&TV servicing book (which I can give you a copy of if you need it).
I hope you persevere with it but if you decide it isn't for you, I would be very glad to give it a home- it would go nicely with the Pilot and I do so love a basket case!!
By the way, the Pilot project is still very much ongoing, I've just got rather sidetracked with the GEC at the moment!
The circuit states that two different tuners were fitted although they don't give them names. Mine & Symons have Fireballs and Steve's has the other type- does that have a name?
I shall watch progress with interest and hopefully some more pictures once the cabinet is removed.
All the best
Nick
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 3:47 am   #23
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

Hi Steve

I love basket case sets like this, so much more of a challenge than the average resto. I may have a spare Mullard AW43-88 down in the cellar you are welcome too, will be a couple of weeks until I'm back in the uk to check but if your still in need when I return and I do indeed have one (pretty sure I do) your welcome to it.

Jay
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 8:17 am   #24
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

Well done for rescuing it, I am sure it can be restored once you find a suitable CRT.
I may possibly have a suitable tube lurking in the garage in a scrap Cossor set, (17" 110 deg) not sure what make it is, but tested ok before storage.

Mark
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 11:09 am   #25
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

Easiest method to clean that set up is just to use a pressure water hose on it to clear out all the unpleasant things that might lurk inside the cabinet.
The tuner looks like a Brayhead unit similar to the type of tuner used for ITV conversions. Seems that Ultra Electric had no loyalty any one tuner manufacturer. The most recent Ultra TV I've serviced was a very slim and compact 1960 Bemuda model which employed a huge Cyldon type C tuner.
I love these basket case restorations, in fact many of the recent sets seen on this forum would have even scared me off doing such tasks.

DFWB.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 12:22 pm   #26
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There is an American chap over on YouTube who goes by the YouTube name shango066 who gets old sets that have been abandoned in the desert for 40 odd years (many from abandond mining town dumps) and goes about resurrecting (his term) them. He has the plug it in and see what smokes approach. A very entertaining watch for nutters like us.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 1:29 pm   #27
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

I nice find, Steve.
I always have a look in skips when passing over the years I have had a few good finds, but nothing this vintage!
It looks saveable if a CRT can be found. I too think it's a good challenge to restore a basket case.
Your set seems to be the other way around to the Basket case A640 that Mick restored recently his was terrible outside but fairly good inside.
I saw the you tube video of the chap rescuing the sets from the abandoned town. There is another of a chap going through a huge stash of sets in an abandoned building.
A lot of American collectors seem to take the attitude that if the CRT is duff the set is not worth bothering with. They (IMHO) jump in test the tube, boost the tube and abandon in a lot of cases.
We Brits... Sterner stuff! we never say die!
Good luck with the restoration I shall follow with interest!

Rich.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 4:43 pm   #28
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

Thanks for all the encouragement chaps! I certainly intend to at least have a go at getting this one up and running again. What's to lose? I'm knocked out by the really kind offers of potential replacement crts. That makes the whole thing viable.

I shall remove the dead crt, strip the cabinet out and give everything a huge clean-up. May as well take advantage of the nice weather and do it all in the garden.

I'll keep you posted with progress and pictures. Oh and yes Symon, any measurements or details you need I'll gladly supply.

Steve
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 5:15 pm   #29
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

Lucky find and it's hardly a basket case! Appears to have been stored in dry conditions.

I think this will be an easy one. The tube has been replaced with a regun so let us hope it is a good one.

All the capacitors and probably some of the resistors in the frame timebase will require replacement. They are in a diabolical position, some mounted upside down but this chassis is capable of giving a good linear picture. The lin sleeve needs a bit of pushing and shoving to get the line linear.

For some reason these models were always filthy! I had to scrub layers of indescribable muck off this example, the 'portable' version VP17-72 but it turned out OK in the end.

FM radio models could not use the Fireball tuner. The little Ultra tuner was more commonly seen in the FM series with the sub panel mounted on the chassis bottom. The lugs can be seen that retained the P/C board on the bottom rail.

Good luck with it. The LOPT is a high grade component and should be fine.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 6:22 pm   #30
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

Looks good John. Symon's set further up the thread is certainly no basket case and should hopefully be nice and easy to get going.

As for my derelict example from the skip, I've got it in bits and you know what- it's not bad at all. I think it has been stored face down, hence the amazing amount of debris it has collected. I think water has also pooled in the plastic implosion guard at some point. Having said all that, with a brush-out, it looks pretty much like any other set of this age ripe for restoration. I was interested to find that the crt was not the Mazda original but a Mullard AW43-88, which was probably good prior to being necked.

The only slightly tricky part will be repairing the mask which has gone very brittle and has a small corner piece missing. That will require some thought.

Anyway, photos showing aspects of the set with the plaster, glass and filth removed (most of it anyway).

Steve
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 6:24 pm   #31
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And more...
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 6:24 pm   #32
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And the mask, showing damaged area
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 6:35 pm   #33
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Back it with very thin Fibreglass 'paper' and resin/hardener to hold it in place and reinforcement. When set, rub down and spray a suitable colour. Works very well.
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Old 18th Jul 2017, 12:02 am   #34
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Not much of a difference, but I think I spot a 1957 date code on the picture tube. Is the set a 1959 model or could it be 1 or 2 years older?
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Old 18th Jul 2017, 6:50 am   #35
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First year of the 110 degree tube in the UK. 1959/60. J.
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Old 18th Jul 2017, 10:09 pm   #36
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

That really looks to be in quite good order. It's hard to tell if that's rust or if the chassis has just discoloured. Nice to see the speaker looks in good order- any chance of some detailed pictures of it as mine is missing?
I see it's already had lots of work done on the frame timebase at the top in a former life. I guess it got so hot up there that the caps failed early on!!
The layout of the whole thing is pretty bizarre- you wouldn't believe that's the speaker transformer just near the line op valve! Half the sound output stage is on the IF pcb, the rest is on the line o/p board on the opposite side to the speaker & volume control. There is a mile of different bits of screened cable connecting it all together
The HT rails are pretty simple but they have used an amazing amount of wire to get it to different parts of the set! Not least, it goes via the frame scan coils!!
Because of all these quirky design aspects, I've found it very interesting to rebuild. All my sliders and most of the pots were open circuit or the legs had dropped off so I hope yours have fared better
What is the date on your smoothing cap? Mine was June '59 so would be interesting to compare.
Good luck with it and please post some more pictures soon!!
All the best
Nick
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Old 18th Jul 2017, 10:44 pm   #37
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Default Re: Skip find Ultra

I'm loving all these basket case restorations on the forum at the moment.

The cabinet looks quite good all things considered. I look forward to seeing it up and running.

Cheers
Andy
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Old 19th Jul 2017, 2:33 am   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heatercathodeshort View Post
First year of the 110 degree tube in the UK. 1959/60. J.
The stamp seems to read B7H which looks like a valid factory and date code for August 1957 but when I think about it, in those years the factory code was often stamped on the tube base. As I review this thread it is suggested that a Mazda tube would have been fitted originally. Putting those two together might suggest it could possibly be a 1967 replacement tube.

Colourstar, could you maybe have a look to see if there's another line of code stamped above the one that reads B7H? And maybe check out other date codes (the smoothing capacitor was suggested)?
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Old 19th Jul 2017, 8:08 am   #39
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1967 is possible. It does have the later label. In 1957 the Mullard MW43-69 a 70 degree tube magnetic focus was current production and we had to wait until 1958 to see the 90 degree types introduced into receivers followed in 1959 by the 110 degree.

The original tube in the Ultra/ Murphy/ Ekco etc was a Mazda CME1703. These tended to go flat after three years and it is very unusual to find an original 1703 that is any good. Such a shame as they have one of the best screen phosphors ever produced for monochrome television.

The Mullard AW43-88/89 are excellent and I have never seen one that shows signs of low emission. Regards, John.
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Old 19th Jul 2017, 7:41 pm   #40
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Especially for Maarten, here's the full code on the crt.

Nick- I'll certainly take some photos of the speaker for you (and any other details you need). I'll also check the date on the smoothing can, hopefully tomorrow.

Steve
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