Garrard 301/401 - Page 3 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

ajgriff · 27th Mar 2019, 12:40 am

Prompted by mention of Goldring Lenco decks I got to thinking about other alternatives to the 301/401 when my old Sugden Connoisseur Craftsman sprang to mind. The Craftsman II and III originate from the same era and were well engineered idler driven turntables just like the Garrards in many ways. Mine performed very well with an SME 3009 arm and Shure cartridge as I recall. A quick look at the current market place would suggest that a Craftsman can be had for quite sensible money when compared with the Garrards. For anyone interested in actual performance rather than iconic status AR Sugden's products generally might be worthy of consideration.

Alan

RojDW48 · 27th Mar 2019, 1:34 am

Yes - old Lencos are eminently restorable as they were clearly built to last millennia. I have had several over the years and they give very good service. But I would still counsel looking out for the old Collaro AT100 or 200 for an exceptional value vintage TT.

ajgriff · 27th Mar 2019, 10:33 am

I'm intrigued by the Collaro AT100/200. Never come across one and can't find anything useful on the Internet. Can you provide a link to any information/details? Thanks.

Alan

Edward Huggins · 27th Mar 2019, 11:12 am

There is quite o lot of useful info and photos of this highly regarded transcription deck. Search it out as Collaro 4T 200. There were also earlier 3 speed versions of it.
Collaro also made a lower price single-player deck which is extremely rare, the Collaro 459 unit with a die-cast turntable and which performed very well, to Garrard SP25 standards at the very least. As a former Collaro dealer, I have the original Collaro data sheets, templates, specifications, frequency plots and sales leaflets on all the 1950s Collaro range, but at the moment I cannot access these as they are in storage.

wd40addict · 27th Mar 2019, 11:27 am

I think he means 4T200. Mine gives lower wow & flutter than my 301!

ajgriff · 27th Mar 2019, 11:40 am

Ah, the fog has cleared a little. Thank you both.

Alan

RojDW48 · 27th Mar 2019, 11:48 am

I must be getting dyslexic in my dotage - yes - 4T100 and 200

Here's one in my old Decca Stereo Decola. Fitted with the FFSS arm and Mk 1 cartridge - an excellent combination, but it would be perfectly happy with more up to date tonearms etc.

parlourtw73vs · 28th Mar 2019, 8:55 pm

I've got to admit that I love these posts which consist of the various opinions and comparisons of older audio components. Turntables in particular seem to arouse a great degree of passion and rightly so as there are at least 3 distinct drive systems and much diverse discussion about the material which comprises the "Ultimate" plinth. Perhaps in our calmer moments we realise that it's all subjective and all that really matters is whether or not we're happy with the sound we hear. I'm as guilty as anyone as my particular foible is finding equipment at almost giveaway prices and getting them to produce acceptable results. At the moment I've got a Collaro 2010 turntable allied to a Sugden SAU2 pickup arm and a [I think] superb AT 440 MLb cartridge. The resulting sound I find very easy to listen to, but, I've often wondered how my idler drive Collaro would compare to a belt drive turntable so, to this end I bought a Sugden Connoisseur BD 2 turntable a couple of years ago. It came in its factory spec. plinth which is quite lightweight and flimsy so I've obtained 2 slabs of solid oak which I'm presently allowing to season in my shed before constructing a new plinth. When I finally defeat inertia and assemble this I'm looking forward to being able to compare the two side by side and as the BD 2 has the same arm as that fitted to the Collaro I'll be able to swap the cartridge easily and quickly to hopefully get a definitive answer. Of course, this will only prove that my A is superior/inferior to my B, it won't be of any use to any of you who will be using turntables C through Z. In fact, looking back over this post I can only conclude that it's completely worthless as a guide to the OP as, unfortunately, most of these posts are. But it's fun to air your own particular likes and opinions and at the end of all surely that's why we indulge in all these speculations and long may the discussion go on.

27th Mar 2019, 12:40 am	#41
ajgriff Nonode Join Date: May 2004 Location: Halifax, West Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 2,587	Re: Garrard 301/401 Prompted by mention of Goldring Lenco decks I got to thinking about other alternatives to the 301/401 when my old Sugden Connoisseur Craftsman sprang to mind. The Craftsman II and III originate from the same era and were well engineered idler driven turntables just like the Garrards in many ways. Mine performed very well with an SME 3009 arm and Shure cartridge as I recall. A quick look at the current market place would suggest that a Craftsman can be had for quite sensible money when compared with the Garrards. For anyone interested in actual performance rather than iconic status AR Sugden's products generally might be worthy of consideration. Alan

27th Mar 2019, 1:34 am	#42
RojDW48 Nonode Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 2,074	Re: Garrard 301/401 Yes - old Lencos are eminently restorable as they were clearly built to last millennia. I have had several over the years and they give very good service. But I would still counsel looking out for the old Collaro AT100 or 200 for an exceptional value vintage TT. __________________ '....don't go mistaking Paradise for that home across the road!' (Bob Dylan)

27th Mar 2019, 10:33 am	#43
ajgriff Nonode Join Date: May 2004 Location: Halifax, West Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 2,587	Re: Garrard 301/401 I'm intrigued by the Collaro AT100/200. Never come across one and can't find anything useful on the Internet. Can you provide a link to any information/details? Thanks. Alan

27th Mar 2019, 11:12 am	#44
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 8,328	Re: Garrard 301/401 There is quite o lot of useful info and photos of this highly regarded transcription deck. Search it out as Collaro 4T 200. There were also earlier 3 speed versions of it. Collaro also made a lower price single-player deck which is extremely rare, the Collaro 459 unit with a die-cast turntable and which performed very well, to Garrard SP25 standards at the very least. As a former Collaro dealer, I have the original Collaro data sheets, templates, specifications, frequency plots and sales leaflets on all the 1950s Collaro range, but at the moment I cannot access these as they are in storage. __________________ Edward.

27th Mar 2019, 11:27 am	#45
wd40addict Octode Join Date: May 2009 Location: Stevenage, Herts. UK. Posts: 1,518	Re: Garrard 301/401 I think he means 4T200. Mine gives lower wow & flutter than my 301!

27th Mar 2019, 11:40 am	#46
ajgriff Nonode Join Date: May 2004 Location: Halifax, West Yorkshire, UK. Posts: 2,587	Re: Garrard 301/401 Ah, the fog has cleared a little. Thank you both. Alan

27th Mar 2019, 11:48 am	#47
RojDW48 Nonode Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 2,074	Re: Garrard 301/401 I must be getting dyslexic in my dotage - yes - 4T100 and 200 Here's one in my old Decca Stereo Decola. Fitted with the FFSS arm and Mk 1 cartridge - an excellent combination, but it would be perfectly happy with more up to date tonearms etc. Attached Thumbnails __________________ '....don't go mistaking Paradise for that home across the road!' (Bob Dylan)

28th Mar 2019, 8:55 pm	#48
parlourtw73vs Pentode Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Bolton, Lancashire, UK. Posts: 186	Re: Garrard 301/401 I've got to admit that I love these posts which consist of the various opinions and comparisons of older audio components. Turntables in particular seem to arouse a great degree of passion and rightly so as there are at least 3 distinct drive systems and much diverse discussion about the material which comprises the "Ultimate" plinth. Perhaps in our calmer moments we realise that it's all subjective and all that really matters is whether or not we're happy with the sound we hear. I'm as guilty as anyone as my particular foible is finding equipment at almost giveaway prices and getting them to produce acceptable results. At the moment I've got a Collaro 2010 turntable allied to a Sugden SAU2 pickup arm and a [I think] superb AT 440 MLb cartridge. The resulting sound I find very easy to listen to, but, I've often wondered how my idler drive Collaro would compare to a belt drive turntable so, to this end I bought a Sugden Connoisseur BD 2 turntable a couple of years ago. It came in its factory spec. plinth which is quite lightweight and flimsy so I've obtained 2 slabs of solid oak which I'm presently allowing to season in my shed before constructing a new plinth. When I finally defeat inertia and assemble this I'm looking forward to being able to compare the two side by side and as the BD 2 has the same arm as that fitted to the Collaro I'll be able to swap the cartridge easily and quickly to hopefully get a definitive answer. Of course, this will only prove that my A is superior/inferior to my B, it won't be of any use to any of you who will be using turntables C through Z. In fact, looking back over this post I can only conclude that it's completely worthless as a guide to the OP as, unfortunately, most of these posts are. But it's fun to air your own particular likes and opinions and at the end of all surely that's why we indulge in all these speculations and long may the discussion go on.