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Old 1st Aug 2022, 6:33 am   #1
retailer
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Default Aumann WGM winder

I been gifted an Aumann WGM winding machine - not sure of it's capabilities or even if it is complete - there is a foot control - from what I can make out it has a gear drive to the cam operated traverse mechanism, while the motor is not running (yet) I can see the foot switch controls motor speed, clutches and possibly a brake. It was on a small metal bench and included some extra stuff that I'm not 100% certain belong to the Aumann, I've scoured the internet for a manual but apart from some photos here and there there seems to be nothing in the way of technical info or operating instructions - is any one aware of a web site that may sell user manuals and/or service manuals.
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Old 1st Aug 2022, 6:53 am   #2
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

Looks to be fairly complete-ish. It looks like a multi winder. By multi I mean makes half a dozen coils at once. Doesnt appear to be for transformers, more like RF chokes as the "traverse " doesnt look long enough. I had a "Glow " winding machine, made in the 30,s and 100 % aussie. It DID have Eclipse badges though, who I believe took them over. It made transformers or single bobbin coils only ( without a LOT of mucking about ). Glow also made multi former machines that wound three bobbins at once.

I wish I was there looking at it with you. It definatly has possibilities.

Joe
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Old 2nd Aug 2022, 3:41 am   #3
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

I feel you may be right about the type of coils it is meant to produce - however it may be a good candidate to convert to cnc for transformer winding, it wouldn't take much, a stepper driven ball screw, a rotary encoder driven by the spindle, all controlled by something like a raspberry pi pico - I was planning on making another winder, having used my home made winder for many transformers now for a number of years I feel I could make some improvements to make the winding job a little easier the only downsize to a conversion job is the size of the machine it is a bit bigger than I would like.

I only gave the thing a cursory look yesterday, since then I looked a bit closer, the foot pedal has a spdt microswitch and a good sized variac gear driven by the pedal - the 'head stock' has a number of wires going up into it - I'm hoping a forum member can come up with a web site where I can get a manual or circuit if not then I'll have to remove the headstock from the base to see what is inside so I can attempt to trace a circuit out, looking inside the control/switch box, trying to trace a circuit out is not something to look forward to.
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Old 2nd Aug 2022, 5:23 am   #4
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

I can't find anything about the winder other than the original company (Aumann) is still going and I doubt they will have any info.

On a related note, you mentioned modifying it for CNC or related control, you might want to have a look at https://www.theprojectasylum.com/ele...sprojects.html and scroll down a little to the Electronics Test & Project Creation section for some ideas (there's a few other sites around with similar ideas).
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Old 2nd Aug 2022, 8:43 am   #5
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

I've made some headway on the Aumann winder - I pulled the motor it is a brush type, a pulley one one end and a solenoid operated brake on the other, I refitted the motor and on trying the pedal I noticed the pulley give a slight jerk so I gave the pulley a flick and away went the motor but not as fast as thought it should have gone. Removing the end covers revealed the brushes, one was a very tight fit in it's holder I eventually managed to wiggle it free gave it light rub with emery and refitted, this time it was able to move up and down freely in it's holder, the other was better but still tight so I gave it the same treatment, refitted the motor and it ran as I thought it should, so looks like the motor problem is solved.
With the pedal in it's home position, the brake is applied, back slightly on the pedal and the brake is released so the coil formers can be setup, then forward on the pedal starts the motor, back to the home position and the motor is braked to a quick stop, to run the motor backwards the reverse button is held down while the motor is started - continuing to run in reverse until the motor is braked to a stop, reverse is then automatically deselected - a good idea to accidently prevent the motor being started backwards.
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Old 2nd Aug 2022, 11:37 pm   #6
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

A further hint that it will be for small coils. To pull up a bobin for a transformer quickly means huge greif!!! Just ask any transformer winder. A large bobbin has significant enertia and will do all sorts of horrible things to your windings if stopped too fast, including breaking the wire. Not to mention 10 or 15 metres of wire spiralling out of control, all over the winding machine, your feet, the floor and getting tangled in the origional bobbin. I have done it many times. "Most " transformer winders have a record of this happening, Just ask Ed Dinning.

A small "RF type " coil weighs next to nothing, and the largest normal diameter I have seen is maybe 30mm. ( there are much larger as well ).

So does your series motor have a wattage ? or power rating? My old glow winder uses a 1/3 HP squirrel cage motor, with a clutch and brake from an industrial "Singer " type sewing machine. NO reverse!!.

Joe
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Old 3rd Aug 2022, 7:38 am   #7
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

A bit more headway on the Aumann winder, the motor fix was short lived, next day I tried it and the motor refused to start without a flick of the pulley, I pulled it out again and decided to have a go at skimming the commutator I had previously given it a bit of a rub with some 400 emery and I could now see there were areas where there was very little brush contact - I watched a few youtube videos on skimming commutators - while there were not quite any conflicting ideas it seems that each person has their own way of doing things, with the commutator end in the chuck I took very small cuts 2-3 thou at a time, I estimate total removed was around 8-10 thou, there was very little burring of the copper and it took only a few mins to clean up ready for reassembly. The brake consists of circular cork pad similar to a motor cycle clutch friction plate (as I remember), motor now starts and runs very smoothly.
The motor is (I think) 550w it has a belt drive compound reduction to the spindle each one looks to be around 4 or 5 to 1 so the overall drive ratio is probably somewhere between 16 and 20:1. The drive from the spindle to the traverse is via a small chain 1:1 ratio, from there a compound gear train drives a heart shaped cam - an adjustable contact point between a pair of levers gives a range of adjustment for traverse travel (bobbin width) and the gear train ratio sets the winding pitch ( turns per inch) - this winder may have originally been supplied with a full set of gears for different winding pitch - however I don't have them.
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Old 3rd Aug 2022, 2:40 pm   #8
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

I was interested in how the worked so I assembled the bits of the winder, the metal rods that I initially assumed were from something else are in fact part of the winder, axles to hold the bobbins, they are quickly removed/swapped via the cam lock tail stock, I initially thought the 'lumpy' bits were some sort of decomposed rubber - they are/were wax protective coatings that look to have been there since new. I jury rigged a spool of scrap copper wire 0.2mm diam. and gave it a go - I couldn't really see if it was wave wound or not but the wire was wound with very little tension and seems to stay there without falling off the sides, I managed to get a 10 sec video - see it here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZ7z7sTDiiU
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Old 3rd Aug 2022, 3:10 pm   #9
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

A interesting bit of kit should prove very useful.
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Old 3rd Aug 2022, 10:16 pm   #10
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

OK looks like a definite keeper!!!. Its not wave winding in your vid!!. Thats because you havent set the traverse speed to diameter. There should have been a book of tables that will give you those numbers/combinations.
I would think if its not on an attached plate on the machine its most likely gone walkabout. It looks to work very nicely in the vid!!, no stuttering or clonky operation.
Just as an aside, if you "extend " the traverse distance to say 1/2" or so, and leave the same speed setting you should get wave winding. I am only assuming that by guessing the coil diameter you wound was about 3/4".

Joe
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Old 4th Aug 2022, 1:53 am   #11
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

It is nice to see the winder going, I have no documentation and it looks like very little chance of getting any, I tried to set the turns counter - it appears to count down rather than up, it's electrically coupled to the motor circuit and I'm assuming once correctly set it counts down to zero and then stops the motor. Under lid of the counter are some intructions that say to set the digits follow the instructions in the manual - not very helpful if one doesn't have a manual.

I'm a bit surprised that apart from some old for sale ads I have found nothing on the internet in the way of info, not even a web site profiting from selling old user manuals - the for sale pics I've seen have told a bit of a story and I gather that the basic variable speed spindle (main body) is common to Aumann winders - from there the type of traverse mechanism that is attached determines the use, the traverse mechanism I have is most probably for RF coils as you say, so as it stands it isn't a great deal of use to me, I'll get it cleaned up and looking nice and them make decision on what to do with it, one option as I mentioned earlier is to make a cnc linear traverse mechanism so I can use it as a transformer winder.

One things that has surprised me is that the winder shows evidence that it wasn't part of a production line but rather of being hand built.
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Old 14th Aug 2022, 8:56 pm   #12
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

Quote:
Originally Posted by retailer View Post
It is nice to see the winder going, I have no documentation and it looks like very little chance of getting any.
I contacted a friend who - some years ago - had an Aumann winder, to see if he had a copy of the manual, as indeed he does and has kindly emailed it to me. It runs to 91 pages, but don't get too excited as it's in four languages (including English). It's a 4.12 MB PDF.

If you'd like it, please PM me your email address and I'll wing it down to you.
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 12:47 am   #13
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

The forum, and David come to the rescue again!!!.
Very nice David!!.

Joe
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 1:23 am   #14
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

Thank you David for the kind offer - it is much appreciated I have replied to the PM.
I need to make a correction regarding the turns counter, my not so great eye sight and bad light caused me to misread ( at least that is my excuse) the instructions on setting the counter - instructions (printed on the inside of the turns counter cover ) say 'using the supplied hook' - I read this as 'using the supplied book' and assumed I needed to refer to a book, that is not the case.
The turns counter does count down and to set it start at the 1000's end and work back towards the units by turning the serrated top of each digit in turn, the supplied hook refers to a piece of wire bent into a hook - it sits under a clip on top of the counter and is used to set the cams that operate the contacts that will eventually (if correctly set) stop the spindle motor once the turns count down to zero. There is a set of contacts for each digit and I can see that the contacts at the units digit are white and possibly burnt from arcing, something else to possibly repair.
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 5:57 am   #15
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

Long shot - but you could try Johnny Johnson at Ace Coil Winding for a manual and spares, here.
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Old 15th Aug 2022, 8:34 am   #16
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

Quote:
Originally Posted by retailer View Post
Thank you David for the kind offer - it is much appreciated I have replied to the PM.
Just to confirm that I've emailed the manual to you, so you should have it by now.

If it doesn't arrive, please let me know in this thread.

If you do now have it, I hope it proves useful for you.

Good luck with the winder!
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Old 17th Aug 2022, 1:36 am   #17
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

Many thanks for the manual it is much appreciated. I was planning on rebuilding my home made transformer winder - it has and continues to serve me well, but over the years I have thought of some improvements I could make and now that I have the Aumann I 'll investigate the possibility of adding a stepper motor traverse to it for winding audio and power transformers for this the manual will be helpful. The traverse/wire feed currently fitted to the Aumann is for RF/IF type coils the max winding width is approx 12mm - extra gear sets to vary the winding pitch are missing, so in it's present form it is not particularly useful to me.
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Old 17th Aug 2022, 8:38 am   #18
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

retailer,
you dont know anybody with even a cheap milling machine ?.
It should be very easy to mill a few spur gears to make that machine into something VERY viable.

Joe
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Old 19th Aug 2022, 3:08 am   #19
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

I've got a vertical mill and have made gears before but that won't change the purpose of the winder and that is to wind RF type coils, the long bed with room for a dozen or so wire guides gives it away that it was used in a production situation winding perhaps 10 or more coils at one time, for now it is on the back burner, while I digest the manual and decide if I'm going to embark on a conversion project.
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Old 19th Aug 2022, 3:20 am   #20
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Default Re: Aumann WGM winder

OK, point taken.
I do note the bed is about 8" long and can "probably " swing around 4". Thats a pretty big mean bobbin for electronic work!!. As it is I wonder if that smallish motor will even wind the larger guages of wire.
Having said that it still has many possiblities.

Just me thinking

Joe
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