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Clubs, Groups and Societies For discussions about various clubs, groups and societies relating to our hobbies, such as the BVWS (incl NVCF), BATC, RSGB, APTS, CLPGS, THG, TCC etc. This is NOT an official forum for any of these organisations.

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Old 17th Sep 2018, 12:10 pm   #1
Cobaltblue
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Default Changing the BVWS

In the Autumn BVWS Bulletin there was a very interesting letter from Steve concerning the future of the BVWS.

This is a topic that has been discussed before on many occasions and one of the key points is the name of the Society and the other is the aims of the society.

Like Steve I joined in the 80's whilst still in my 20's even then though the majority of members were much older.

I am not wed to the name but if it needs to be changed it will need to be inclusive to fossils like myself as well as the new blood we wish to attract.

Making Television and Audio appear in the title is fine as well as other non domestic technology such as Radar and industrial electronics.

However there will need to be come reduction in the title or it will be unwieldy.

Does it need to have British in the title?

There are already other society's that cater for most countries that were mass manufacturers so I think it should.

British Radio Audio Television and Technology Society? BRATTS

British Old Technology Society? BOTS

I am sure better minds than mine are considering this but I do accept something has to change even though I fear it

What would encourage fresh members, how do we or even should we try to maintain this manufacturing heritage.

I would interested in the views of members and non members alike.

Maybe be should be the BURPAS as Monty used to call the BVWS in the Radiophile ISTR
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 12:43 pm   #2
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

I think the British Vintage Electronics Society BVES or The British Vintage Technology Society would be suitable. Maybe we need to vote on firstly whether a name change is wanted by the membership, and secondly if there is, perhaps there could be a list of suggested names drawn up to vote on.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 12:59 pm   #3
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

I'd be happy with the name staying as it is!

Admittedly, it is a little ambiguous - it is a British Society for Vintage Wireless interests - as opposed to a society for British Vintage Wireless - but it is difficult to do better.

Swap Wireless with Radio? Still misleading as it caters for TV anyway - and record players and tape recorders.

Swap Wireless for Electronics? Well, that doesn't indicate that there are frequently good articles in the Bulletin about vintage electrical measuring equipment - which are non-electronic.

It needs to have 'British' in its title (so that at least people know where the AGM will be held!) and also 'Society,' so people know it is a not-for-profit, non-commercial organisation; and 'Vintage,' for obvious reasons, so in the interests of brevity and restricting to a 4-word title there's not much choice left!
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 1:25 pm   #4
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

I would vote for it to remain as is.

The fact that the word 'Wireless' has been usurped in modern usage is irrelevant in my view.

Anyone who muddles the two uses probably isn't interested in vintage technology anyway.

The Avro Lancaster had a Wireless Operator and tanks were fitted with the Wireless Set No.19, so no need to change!

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Old 17th Sep 2018, 1:32 pm   #5
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

If it HAS to be changed I'd go for British Vintage Electronics Society.

Whatever it's called I can't see myself joining.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 2:05 pm   #6
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

Leave as is, it is an old society with an old name.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 2:25 pm   #7
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

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Maybe we need to vote on firstly whether a name change is wanted by the membership, and secondly if there is, perhaps there could be a list of suggested names drawn up to vote on.
I agree a vote is needed before any changes are made and I would be pretty much certain the committee would not dream of doing otherwise.

In the meantime it does no harm to explore the questions so that at least some of those voting have thought about the issues.

My biggest concern is that in the next 20 years unless there is a large influx of new members the membership will dwindle to virtually nothing.

There will be thousands of sets looking for new homes.

What sort of changes would encourage new members?

Incidentally amongst my radio collecting friends who are BVWS members most are either not members of this forum (majority) or not active members of this forum (that is they post only very occasionally).

So I will be talking to my friends "offline" as well.

Cheers

Mike T
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 2:26 pm   #8
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

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I think the British Vintage Electronics Society BVES or The British Vintage Technology Society would be suitable.
Not the British Vintage Technology Society in my opinion! It's a wee TOO broad, would cover steam engines, windmills, clocks and watches, compasses and sextants, etc - which would dilute the current core activities.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 2:39 pm   #9
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

Leave it as it is.

If you go down the auction listings and see the immense rnge of different things they cover, then you'd need a very long name indeed. So don't bother trying. A name is a tag, just a tag, it doesn't need to be a description nor does it need to be an entire listing.

BVWS as a name has settled in. People have got comfortable with it. You could argue that they cover wireless of the early period, and all the things that grew out of wireless.

I was rather upset when Wireless World changed its name. It seemed to be a huge mistake. WW meant them. people knew what it covered and the name served as a reminder that it had been involved from the beginning.

The only bit about the BVWS name I'd consider inappropriate is the first letter. They seem to do a lot, but it's all concentrated in the South East corner of England. The peoples of Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland could question its Britishness with some justification. For this reason, I remain not a member. If it is argued that the auctions and meetings are just a small aspect, then as a magazine and discussion group, geography becomes irrelevant and that 'B' is redundant for a different reason.

David (a Yorkshireman)
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 2:50 pm   #10
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

If its not broke don't fix it.
I would vote to leave it as it is.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 2:54 pm   #11
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

I'm not a member, but I can't see that changing the name will make the slightest difference to recruitment.

There seem to be two reasons why few young people are joining the BVWS.

Firstly, we may not like it, but there are just fewer people interested in the nuts and bolts of vintage tech in that age group - it is not a living technology for them, and they are just as likely to develop an interest in archaeology or historical re-enactment.

Secondly, the development of the internet has meant there is simply no need for centralised societies like the BVWS with their newsletters, AGMs etc. Most people under 50 are completely accustomed to organising their social lives and interests through social media and forums like UKVRR. Why would they pay money to join the BVWS?

I think the vintage tech hobby will inevitably decline over the next couple of decades, and there's nothing we can do about it.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 3:01 pm   #12
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

Speaking for myself and not as a BVWS committee member, I agree with Paul Sherwin.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 3:17 pm   #13
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

I prefer to keep BVWS,only at a push do I think it should be changed if it really must to say British Vintage Radio Society.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 3:24 pm   #14
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

I quite agree with David and Paul Sherwin.

To my mind you join a society for either the selfish motive of getting something out of it or to support a cause in which you believe, hopefully there’s a bit of both.

PERSONALLY the BVWS satisfies neither or these. The things I want are available elsewhere, chiefly Paul’s sites: this Forum, the Data Service and main site with historical information and advice for would-be repairers.

The BVWS doesn’t appear do much in the way of active preservation, beyond working with the Dulwich museum which is a separate entity.

All it does — again from my personal perspective, which could be wrong — is organise events too far away for me to attend, produce a magazine I don’t want and sell a very restricted number of parts.

I have been to the Golborne swap-meet but it is so small that you can be in and out in ten minutes and even if it were held in Sheffield I’d think at least twice about my ’bus fare and admission charge.

Certainly when I was starting out the BVWS provided me with no assistance at all and therefore no urge to join it. As I’ve learnt more about it since that view has not been challenged.

Obviously there are people who like it and I’m not picking a fight with them. It’s difficult to think how a voluntary organisation could provide a worthwhile service to it’s members.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 3:45 pm   #15
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

I think to change it to British Vintage Radio Society would be silly. Whist 'Wireless' could be construed to exclude TV, Audio etc, the society has been around long enough for folk to know that it does cover those activities. A change to 'Radio' could easily give the impression that it now only covers radio to the exclusion of all else.

If membership is static or falling the reasons lie elsewhere, not in the title.

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Old 17th Sep 2018, 4:02 pm   #16
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

I've just searched for BVWS on youtube for some how too stuff....So....you've bought an old radio and want to know the basics of what to do in order to get it working properly and at the same time you might be thinking of taking a more longer term interest in the subject, what a meter is, what current is, what voltage is, basic radio layout etc etc for would be new recruits, don't worry, here at the BVWS (or whatever it may end up being called) we have an excellent series of videos to help you, here are some free samples to wet your "I want to know more" neurons....zilch that I could find (maybe I missed them in my search)....I don't think getting a few sheets of paper through the post or whatever is sufficient enough these days.

Some plonk on utube with a wasp up his bum = lots of hits, news travels fast, far and wide, he's established (amongst other things) a presence (no, not the wasp)

If they don't know your there, they ain't going to be lookin' in.

That's my observation as an outsider to the society, as for an opinion I think its time to do some kick *ss

Lawrence.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 4:59 pm   #17
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

That would be one and possibly the only, way of gaining new interest Lawrence.

And exactly what I've been thinking the BVWS should do for a while now, whether actual repairs or a look at someones collection etc etc. There is a BVWS YT channel already.

I guess the question then is more who is going to set themselves up for a couple of hours at least to script, film, edit, upload and caption 15 minutes of video and then engage with all the new interest regularly?

Andrew
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 5:09 pm   #18
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

As Mike says, we are just a subset of the membership, representing the internet aware wing. How much influence we will have remains to be seen, although the internet is the future (for better or for worse!)
If you draw the vintage line at 25 years, kit is getting less and less repairable/restorable at home, as well as less and less interesting. When you've seen one box full of unfathomable components, you've seen them all. Same as with amateur radio black boxes.
Maybe the vastly better standard of living, which is allowing us to buy and restore things that we only dreamt about in the magazines of our youth, is allowing future generations to find alternative routes to enjoyment. You can't restore a computer game.
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Old 17th Sep 2018, 5:25 pm   #19
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

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That would be one and possibly the only, way of gaining new interest Lawrence.

And exactly what I've been thinking the BVWS should do for a while now, whether actual repairs or a look at someones collection etc etc. There is a BVWS YT channel already.

I guess the question then is more who is going to set themselves up for a couple of hours at least to script, film, edit, upload and caption 15 minutes of video and then engage with all the new interest regularly?

Andrew
Yes, perhaps start off with the basic record player, plenty of young ones interested in them at the moment, use that for the hook.

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Old 17th Sep 2018, 5:41 pm   #20
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Default Re: Changing the BVWS

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Quote:
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Maybe we need to vote on firstly whether a name change is wanted by the membership, and secondly if there is, perhaps there could be a list of suggested names drawn up to vote on.
...My biggest concern is that in the next 20 years unless there is a large influx of new members the membership will dwindle to virtually nothing....

Cheers

Mike T
I don't think it's worth discussing a name change as this alone will not attract any new blood. And playing devils advocate .... although the web site says sharing a common interest in the preservation and communication of technical and historical data, and the preservation and restoration of Vintage radio and related equipment and Our Society relies on new membership, new Bulletin articles and new ideas to enable it to flourish and secure its future for generations to come. If you have an interest in collecting and restoring old equipment, or just looking at or listening to old radios, televisions or Hi-Fi, then why not consider becoming a BVWS member. I don't see much in the bulletins covering 'vintage' equipment from the 70's and 80's such as ghetto blasters and music centres etc that would attract those interested in equipment from this era and as can be seen from the UKVRR Facebook site there is an interest and maybe the skills to write informed articles.

Just to declare my position I am a BVWS member, I'm only interested in valve radios and I have have no interest in TVs but happy to have them included in the Wireless Society as I would be with other later 'vintage' technology rather than see it die. Hopefully the new members would then pick up an interest for the older equipment too and keep the society going when we've finally 'gone to air'.

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