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General Vintage Technology Discussions For general discussions about vintage radio and other vintage electronics etc. |
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23rd Feb 2019, 4:21 am | #1 |
Nonode
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Gloucester, Glos. UK.
Posts: 2,150
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NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Following on from the recent announcement that the NHS were to stop buying and using Fax machines , its been reported in the new that they have now been told to ditch Pagers.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-47332415 I still have my old Pager somewhere although I did throw out a couple sometimes ago but kept one for old times sake. |
23rd Feb 2019, 5:00 am | #2 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Oxfordshire, UK.
Posts: 4,935
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Some of them are already collectables. I had a one of the "Multitone" 27MHz pagers, that I think were around in the mid to late 60's, and sold it a couple of years back for £60. Think it consisted of an AF117 regen with a short ferrite rod aerial and then a couple of OC71's pushing AF tones through a filter.
B
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23rd Feb 2019, 1:48 pm | #3 |
Moderator
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Location: Ipswich, Suffolk, IP4, UK.
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Trouble is that the replacement ie text messages to mobile phones relies on infrastructure provided by someone else and shared with others ie the mobile phone networks.
Imagine the scenario, terrorist attack with lots of people killed and injured. Injured taken to a local hospital. Everyone in the vicinity tries to call their friends and family saying they're safe, overloading the networks. Hospital attempts to send a text message to doctors...………..
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23rd Feb 2019, 2:04 pm | #4 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lincolnshire, UK.
Posts: 5,000
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
I'm going to have a look to see if I've still got any of my old pagers from when I was at work - I'd completely forgotten about them. We'd stopped using them years ago!
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23rd Feb 2019, 2:22 pm | #5 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: London, UK.
Posts: 3,687
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
SMS is far more reliable than pagers. We killed them off years ago due to this.
Firstly the human factor is horrible with pagers. People always losing the damn things or turning them off. Then there's the fact that most pager systems don't have any delivery notification so if the pager doesn't receive it then the recipient never knows and neither does the sender. SMS has an SMSC with a queue so the message will be queued if the destination device in unavailable. The last scenario is handled because after the 2005 London attacks they changed the QoS policy of the major networks meaning greater priority for SS7 over calls. The only risk is total network outage which is far lower than pagers anyway due to the commercial pressure when it's down. Really it's all going IP. Our response/alert system is now Slack, which is basically an IRC platform over IP with mobile apps. Does the job and is even more reliable than SMS was! |
23rd Feb 2019, 2:23 pm | #6 |
Nonode
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Gloucester, Glos. UK.
Posts: 2,150
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
According to the news there is now only one provider of Pager services left so I guess when the NHS ditch them the provider will probably withdraw the service for good as I cant see any other big organisations using it
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23rd Feb 2019, 2:38 pm | #7 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK.
Posts: 5,349
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
In my area, SMS messages are not always delivered immediately. They can take a day to arrive. SMS messages use otherwise spare capacity in the channels used to place a call. Voice calls take priority, and if lots of calls are being placed, then SMS messages have to wait until capacity is available. At least, that was the situation with the original cell phone technology in the 1990's. I don't know what the present arrangements are with 4G, and we tend to use Watsapp rather than text for messages between the family. .
Last edited by emeritus; 23rd Feb 2019 at 2:55 pm. |
23rd Feb 2019, 2:41 pm | #8 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: London, UK.
Posts: 3,687
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
SMS are priority now so that shouldn't be the case. Delivery receipts are low priority though.
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23rd Feb 2019, 2:53 pm | #9 |
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Location: Ipswich, Suffolk, IP4, UK.
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Yes, but the hospitals' SMS Text Messages will be competing with everyone else's for processing power and bandwidth.
In the days of Strowger and crossbar exchanges we had preference keys which, in the event of an emergency, could be thrown so as to deny service to low priority customers. They worked by switching off the 50 VDC supply to selected lines. I don't recollect this facility ever being used, but it would have been very effective. With the advent of digital common control exchanges, this function was moved to software. Each line would have its preference status marked in a look up table. On receipt of a call attempt the software would have to identify the line, check its status and if necessary reject the call. Tests with high volumes of call attempts being generated artificially showed that this was nowhere near as effective as the analogue system.
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23rd Feb 2019, 2:55 pm | #10 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK.
Posts: 5,349
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Thanks for the update!
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23rd Feb 2019, 3:00 pm | #11 |
Octode
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Oban, Scotland, UK.
Posts: 1,129
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Every hospital I've seen/been in has signs saying "please switch off your mobile phone as it may interfere.....etc"
Why the sudden change in policy? Same with aircraft - can they REALLY do as they warn? |
23rd Feb 2019, 3:13 pm | #12 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Brentwood, Essex, UK.
Posts: 5,349
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
The usual reason is a politician needing a sound bite. In the present performance-related culture you get little credit for leaving things as they are.
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23rd Feb 2019, 3:22 pm | #13 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lincolnshire, UK.
Posts: 5,000
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
It's good that this has come up, as if I do still have my old ones somewhere, then they may still have batteries in them and they may be rotting by now! I can't remember what we used, but it may have been rechargeable types or it may have been industrial Duracel Procell either AA or AAA, I can't remember - I may even have handed them back in at the time, although it rings a bell that I've seen at least one of them around somewhere several years ago.
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23rd Feb 2019, 3:46 pm | #14 |
Dekatron
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Heckmondwike, West Yorkshire, UK.
Posts: 9,643
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Modern mobiles are extremely low powered, because of the density of base stations, and the need to conserve battery power. Interference is not the problem it once was.
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23rd Feb 2019, 3:47 pm | #15 |
Nonode
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Stockport, Cheshire, UK.
Posts: 2,004
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
I remember my Dad having a pager for work for a few years before his company could afford to issue staff with mobile phones to people at his level.
The more important travelling staff started using mobiles a few years before, & occasionally my Dad would borrow one if he needed to be away from the office for an extended time.
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23rd Feb 2019, 3:49 pm | #16 | |
Hexode
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Cheshire, UK.
Posts: 263
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Quote:
SMS blackspots included engineers homes, comms rooms, roads over the pennines, just ordinary offices in otherwise SMS happy buildings plus of course the ever increasing number of places where mobiles were not allowed or had to be switched off. Reminds me of a time I was on 24hr call. After arriving home about 7pm one Saturday I suggested to The Boss that we eat at the pub, she readily agreed but of course as I was still on call my phone and pager came too. This was back when mobile phones were quite new and were a struggle to get into even a jacket pocket especially with the extra large battery needed to make them last the all day. After making our choices from the menu I went to the bar to order the food taking my phone and pager with me. As I placed them on the bar the guy next to me said 'Wow, a pager and a phone, you must be important!' No, I replied, just stupid. Mike |
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23rd Feb 2019, 4:04 pm | #17 | |
Heptode
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Durham, County Durham, UK.
Posts: 826
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Quote:
The mobile network is part of the Critical National Infrastructure ensuring network is available when there is an ‘incident’ so should never be overloaded by the public, although it may seem that way to us in fact non-registered phones are not allowed access so the network is available to the emergency services. I have fond memories of pagers, being an on call engineer I always had one clipped to my belt. Before mobiles I remember going to a fault when my pager went off (before they had text) it took me a while to find a public phone box to call the fault desk only to be asked if I was there yet John |
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23rd Feb 2019, 4:10 pm | #18 | |
Dekatron
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Worksop, Nottinghamshire, UK.
Posts: 5,554
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Quote:
Medical equipment is far better screened than CE marked stuff. |
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23rd Feb 2019, 4:29 pm | #19 | |
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 27,970
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
Quote:
The prolonged ban on mobile phones is one reason that doctors still use pagers today (though apparently not for much longer). |
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23rd Feb 2019, 6:03 pm | #20 |
Octode
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Bristol, UK.
Posts: 1,042
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Re: NHS Now to ditch Pagers.
If they get rid of pagers and start using phones the thought occurs, whose phone would they use? The consultant's own private one or one supplied by the hospital? If hospital supplied which company would get the contract for supplying and servicing them?
A pager is simple and cheap admittedly it doesn't send an acknowledge of call received but its alert sound is distinctive compared to a phone ringtone. As with most government decisions I don't think the reasoning has been fully thought through. Malcolm |