Decca Decola information please? - Page 2 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Radio Wrangler · 28th Apr 2018, 7:48 pm

I thought the only way to be fair to the original poster was to have the situation out in the clear so that he could know what sort of thing he had, and also be forewarned of the attention it might attract.

I'm rather looking forwards to the gang guiding him through getting it going and want to see his reaction to the result.

David

Michael Maurice · 28th Apr 2018, 8:20 pm

A couple of years ago, I refurbished a Beau Decca which also uses these or similar valves. I told the owner that they were valuable and for her security, I removed the valves and put them in a safe place, whilst taking the chassis back to the workshop for refurbishment

Station X · 28th Apr 2018, 8:26 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Techman

but the Moderators have already had to delete one post that went on about the supposed value of these valves and also edit another (that I know of).

As far as I know the OP has never askedd about the value of this item. I tried to keep the lid on this, but the cat is now well and truly out of the bag for all the world to see. I did it because I've seen these beautiful radiograms dumped in skips outside auction houses (minus the amplifier of course) or even fly tipped in lay-bys near to auction houses.

Might I suggest that if the OP decides to realise the monetary value of his asset he sells the valves and radiogram as separate items. Then there's a possibility that the radiogram will be bought by a genuine enthusiast who'll restore it using alternative valves.

RojDW48 · 28th Apr 2018, 8:43 pm

It is something of a quandary for the OP isn't it? Once the potential value of something like this is understood the risk of 'something going wrong' if you try to get it going is going to make you rather nervous.....as is the responsibility for the restoration of an audio icon. He hasn't taken up my offer of popping down the road with my little variac by the way.

GrimJosef · 28th Apr 2018, 10:01 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Station X

... Might I suggest that if the OP decides to realise the monetary value of his asset he sells the valves and radiogram as separate items. Then there's a possibility that the radiogram will be bought by a genuine enthusiast who'll restore it using alternative valves.

That would be the best outcome. In a perfect world the radiogram would go on sale first so a purchaser would have the option of making an offer on the valves too.

If folks do fancy substituting KT66s then they'll need to find a couple of volts extra for the heaters of course. Perhaps KT44s would be a better choice http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aad0021.htm ?

Cheers,

GJ

PJL · 28th Apr 2018, 10:18 pm

Sorry! I thought it best to get the value out in the open as it has an impact on the restoration and the model is already in the title.

Mark Barber · 1st May 2018, 7:02 pm

Gosh, I seem to have opened quite a hornet's nest here! Thanks David, and everyone for all the information. I didn't realise quite how valuble some of these parts are. What do these unscrupulous people do with these (I won't mention which) valves - do they actually use them?
This leaves me in a bit of a predicament because I was thinking of selling (for various reasons, need for money and downsizing mainly) but I don't like the thought of it being broken up. And then if I do sell, how do I know if I'm selling to a genuine collector?
I must say, I wasn't expecting any of this. What to do?

Edward Huggins · 1st May 2018, 7:14 pm

I don't recommend you break this up for parts. Assuming by now you have a good idea what a serious collector would pay for this as a whole intact unit?

Mark Barber · 1st May 2018, 7:22 pm

I've just read a few more posts which I didn't see before...
GrimJoseph - yes that may well be the way to go, and RojDW48 I haven't declined your kind offer at all - I would love you to come and look at it, I've been away so not been able to give it my attention. I shall PM you

Oh and Graham Station X - thanks for the suggestion. I shall try to do the right thing.

GrimJosef · 1st May 2018, 10:51 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Barber

... What do these unscrupulous people do with these (I won't mention which) valves - do they actually use them? ...

They sell them to people who fit them into hi-fi (depending on exactly what you mean by 'hi-fi') audio amplifiers. In general they do get used - given what they've been charged the new owners really aren't likely to put them on a shelf and just admire the view

.

Cheers,

GJ

RojDW48 · 5th May 2018, 12:31 am

I am going to take a look at Mark's Decola later today. I can see that the output from the PS is via a 12 pin Jones socket and I have the expected voltages to hand. Is the pin numbering likely to be nice and logical and/or helpfully in relief on the plug moulding (in the happy, if rather unlikely event that the PS warms up and works after 30 odd years of inactivity)?

PJL · 5th May 2018, 9:54 am

As said before, a variac will be high risk due to the series electrolytics and a very small choke for the current it passes. My choke and output transformer were o/c, the output transformer probably from blue-spot. It does not have grid coupling capacitors, but if the output valves have slightly gone to air there is enough power from the mains transformer to wreck stuff.

GrimJosef · 5th May 2018, 10:05 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by RojDW48

... in the happy, if rather unlikely event that the PS warms up and works after 30 odd years of inactivity ...

If you take this slowly and systematically and reform the electrolytics first before applying mains then there is every chance that the PS can be made to work perfectly well. As PJL says, a Variac will be high risk, not least because at low settings the rectifier heater/filament will be too cold for any HT current to flow. I do understand the wish to 'just get it going', but honestly haste is not your friend here.

Cheers,

GJ

RojDW48 · 5th May 2018, 4:27 pm

Having spent a pleasant hour or so with Mark and his Decola I can see why the fanatics get a bit excited - 4 stage amplification - all push pull - strong stuff! There were enough issues, however, to make me err on the side of caution. Some of the insulation looks a bit tired, some Rs look like they've been getting a bit too warm. Nevertheless it all seems to be there and there is not much evidence of repairs. This is a long term project for someone who knows what they are doing so, for fear of doing more harm than good, I didn't deploy my little variac. But I did take a few photos of the PS, amp and a homebrew box which appears to be associated with extension speakers.

GrimJosef · 5th May 2018, 5:02 pm

Interesting. The middle picture has a yellow-and-blue poly capacitor in it and some Mullard 'mustards' which I suspect might not be original.

Cheers,

GJ

Radio Wrangler · 5th May 2018, 6:40 pm

It looks very clean and tidy. It's obviously been stored in a good environment. Given the value, there's a lot to check and reform before daring to apply any power. I think it's best left as it is to leave the field clear for someone to do the full job. There have been a couple of repairs that look like from the late sixties, but not badly done.

David

Mark Barber · 18th May 2018, 9:15 am

A few people have been asking so I thought I'd update... Yes I sold it. It was too much of a project for me. But hopefully it is in good hands - a collector in Staffs who will hopefully be restoring it to it's full glory.
Thanks for the support everyone.
Oh the price? It went for £1500 in the end

28th Apr 2018, 7:48 pm	#21
Radio Wrangler Moderator Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Fife, Scotland, UK. Posts: 22,876	Re: Decca Decola information please? I thought the only way to be fair to the original poster was to have the situation out in the clear so that he could know what sort of thing he had, and also be forewarned of the attention it might attract. I'm rather looking forwards to the gang guiding him through getting it going and want to see his reaction to the result. David __________________ Can't afford the volcanic island yet, but the plans for my monorail and the goons' uniforms are done

28th Apr 2018, 8:20 pm	#22
Michael Maurice Moderator Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Wembley, Middlesex Posts: 7,224	Re: Decca Decola information please? A couple of years ago, I refurbished a Beau Decca which also uses these or similar valves. I told the owner that they were valuable and for her security, I removed the valves and put them in a safe place, whilst taking the chassis back to the workshop for refurbishment __________________ Forum Moderator http://www.michaelmauricerepairs.co.uk/

28th Apr 2018, 8:43 pm	#24
RojDW48 Nonode Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 2,074	Re: Decca Decola information please? It is something of a quandary for the OP isn't it? Once the potential value of something like this is understood the risk of 'something going wrong' if you try to get it going is going to make you rather nervous.....as is the responsibility for the restoration of an audio icon. He hasn't taken up my offer of popping down the road with my little variac by the way. __________________ '....don't go mistaking Paradise for that home across the road!' (Bob Dylan)

28th Apr 2018, 10:18 pm	#26
PJL Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Seaford, East Sussex, UK. Posts: 5,997	Re: Decca Decola information please? Sorry! I thought it best to get the value out in the open as it has an impact on the restoration and the model is already in the title.

1st May 2018, 7:02 pm	#27
Mark Barber Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 8	Re: Decca Decola information please? Gosh, I seem to have opened quite a hornet's nest here! Thanks David, and everyone for all the information. I didn't realise quite how valuble some of these parts are. What do these unscrupulous people do with these (I won't mention which) valves - do they actually use them? This leaves me in a bit of a predicament because I was thinking of selling (for various reasons, need for money and downsizing mainly) but I don't like the thought of it being broken up. And then if I do sell, how do I know if I'm selling to a genuine collector? I must say, I wasn't expecting any of this. What to do?

1st May 2018, 7:14 pm	#28
Edward Huggins Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Southwold, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 8,328	Re: Decca Decola information please? I don't recommend you break this up for parts. Assuming by now you have a good idea what a serious collector would pay for this as a whole intact unit? __________________ Edward.

1st May 2018, 7:22 pm	#29
Mark Barber Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 8	Re: Decca Decola information please? I've just read a few more posts which I didn't see before... GrimJoseph - yes that may well be the way to go, and RojDW48 I haven't declined your kind offer at all - I would love you to come and look at it, I've been away so not been able to give it my attention. I shall PM you Oh and Graham Station X - thanks for the suggestion. I shall try to do the right thing.

5th May 2018, 12:31 am	#31
RojDW48 Nonode Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 2,074	Re: Decca Decola information please? I am going to take a look at Mark's Decola later today. I can see that the output from the PS is via a 12 pin Jones socket and I have the expected voltages to hand. Is the pin numbering likely to be nice and logical and/or helpfully in relief on the plug moulding (in the happy, if rather unlikely event that the PS warms up and works after 30 odd years of inactivity)? __________________ '....don't go mistaking Paradise for that home across the road!' (Bob Dylan)

5th May 2018, 9:54 am	#32
PJL Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Seaford, East Sussex, UK. Posts: 5,997	Re: Decca Decola information please? As said before, a variac will be high risk due to the series electrolytics and a very small choke for the current it passes. My choke and output transformer were o/c, the output transformer probably from blue-spot. It does not have grid coupling capacitors, but if the output valves have slightly gone to air there is enough power from the mains transformer to wreck stuff.

5th May 2018, 4:27 pm	#34
RojDW48 Nonode Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 2,074	Re: Decca Decola information please? Having spent a pleasant hour or so with Mark and his Decola I can see why the fanatics get a bit excited - 4 stage amplification - all push pull - strong stuff! There were enough issues, however, to make me err on the side of caution. Some of the insulation looks a bit tired, some Rs look like they've been getting a bit too warm. Nevertheless it all seems to be there and there is not much evidence of repairs. This is a long term project for someone who knows what they are doing so, for fear of doing more harm than good, I didn't deploy my little variac. But I did take a few photos of the PS, amp and a homebrew box which appears to be associated with extension speakers. Attached Thumbnails __________________ '....don't go mistaking Paradise for that home across the road!' (Bob Dylan)

5th May 2018, 5:02 pm	#35
GrimJosef Dekatron Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Oxfordshire, UK. Posts: 4,311	Re: Decca Decola information please? Interesting. The middle picture has a yellow-and-blue poly capacitor in it and some Mullard 'mustards' which I suspect might not be original. Cheers, GJ __________________ http://www.ampregen.com

5th May 2018, 6:40 pm	#36
Radio Wrangler Moderator Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Fife, Scotland, UK. Posts: 22,876	Re: Decca Decola information please? It looks very clean and tidy. It's obviously been stored in a good environment. Given the value, there's a lot to check and reform before daring to apply any power. I think it's best left as it is to leave the field clear for someone to do the full job. There have been a couple of repairs that look like from the late sixties, but not badly done. David __________________ Can't afford the volcanic island yet, but the plans for my monorail and the goons' uniforms are done

18th May 2018, 9:15 am	#37
Mark Barber Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 8	Re: Decca Decola information please? A few people have been asking so I thought I'd update... Yes I sold it. It was too much of a project for me. But hopefully it is in good hands - a collector in Staffs who will hopefully be restoring it to it's full glory. Thanks for the support everyone. Oh the price? It went for £1500 in the end