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Hints, Tips and Solutions (Do NOT post requests for help here) If you have any useful general hints and tips for vintage technology repair and restoration, please share them here. PLEASE DO NOT POST REQUESTS FOR HELP HERE!

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Old 16th May 2020, 1:11 pm   #21
WME_bill
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Fluxite.
I would add a word of caution to Kevin (McMurdo) comments.
"modern" Fluxite contains zinc chloride, which will corrode away your joint and board very quickly. Washing with a solvent (IPA or whatever) does not remove any ZnCl/HCl occluded in the joint itself.
Look at the tin. The one I have warns clearly. See picture 2 below.
But I also have original pre 1960? tins, which is non- corrosive. I still use it, and if anyone wants a bit, send me a PM.
See my posting of 26 July 2017.
Three pictures. The first two are of the "modern" corrosive version, with the red devil. The third is the non-corrosive one, with a green devil, except that Kevin has a green devil on a presumably corrosive tin. Maybe, single colour printing on the tin is now preferred.
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Old 16th May 2020, 1:17 pm   #22
TowerRadio
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Maybe this should be a new thread but what can one do to make a better joint inside a valve pin that has gone bad? If the electrode connection is tarnished inside the solder it will surely be worse further up. Your thoughts please. Les
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Old 16th May 2020, 1:30 pm   #23
McMurdo
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Quote:
Kevin has a green devil on a presumably corrosive tin
That's a picture off the Fernox-Fry's website, I have one of the flat tins, though I have also used the yellow powerflow acid flux for stubborn joints.
Sometimes in the repair trade it is either get a badly corroded board going or scrap it. I don't get paid for scrapping boards!
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Old 16th May 2020, 1:54 pm   #24
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

When I bought my first guitar (1968) I built a wah-wah pedal from a kit. It didn't work so I returned it to the seller who offered a 'get it going' service for a small charge. When he returned it to me, working, he added a note saying the board was corroded and had I used flux such as Baker's fluid...? I had
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Old 19th May 2020, 11:12 pm   #25
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

I have a small tin of Fluxite, only 60 years old. It seems to work quite well if the surfaces are clean.

More recently I bought a littlr pot of LA-CO regular soldering flux paste labelled non-acid, non-toxic. It seems to be a little better than Fluxite. I have e-mailed the makers (US) to see if is is suitable for electronic circuits but answer was there non. Does anyone know if this is corrosive?
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Old 20th May 2020, 8:53 am   #26
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

These two nasty quality colour slides are shots of the Fry's Metals foundry at Colliers Wood, the home of Fluxite in 1977. The original slides are very good quality taken early evening.
I scanned them with my flatbed scanner. I have a slide scanner, fantastic quality but I don't have a driver for Windows 10. [Silverline]it's such a pity.
The entrance was more like a church than a metal works. It was one of the last major manufacturing plants in Colliers Wood/Mitcham. John.
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Old 20th May 2020, 9:17 am   #27
David G4EBT
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorG3VLF View Post
I have a small tin of Fluxite, only 60 years old. It seems to work quite well if the surfaces are clean.

More recently I bought a little pot of LA-CO regular soldering flux paste labelled non-acid, non-toxic. It seems to be a little better than Fluxite. I have e-mailed the makers (US) to see if is is suitable for electronic circuits but answer was there non. Does anyone know if this is corrosive?
La-Co flux is described as:

"Self-cleaning flux for use on copper, brass, lead and zinc and on both water and gas installations. Acid-free, non-toxic and free of lead and zinc chloride".

Describing it as 'acid free' suggests that it is benign and innocuous, but that's not quite so.

It's been commonplace for some years now for all plumbing fluxes to be 'self cleaning' - in other words, you can apply it to tarnished copper capillary end-feed pipe fittings and pipe without first cleaning with steel wool. If it can remove oxide, if left on anything on which it's been used, whether it's copper pipe or electrical connections (valve-holder pins etc), then over time, it will be corrosive. If you look at copper plumbing pipes installed by lazy and inept installers who haven't removed the flux with a wet cloth while still warm, you'll see green corrosion on the pipes and fittings. Tue, it may not eat right through the pipes, but it's not desirable. See pic 1 below of green deposits on pipes under a sink unit.

Fortunately, as it's soluble in water, after a joint has been made, it can be removed with a wet cloth, cotton bud, whatever.

As to the ingredients, they're listed in Control of Substances Hazardous to Health (COSHH) Datasheet:

A) Ammonium Chloride 12125-02-9 7 – 13 235-186-4 Xn, Xi R22, R36
B) 2-hydroxyethylammonium chloride 2002-24-6 7 - 10 217-900-6 Not classified
C) Not classified Stearic Acid

Source:

https://www.colglo.co.uk/files/Lead_...lder_COSHH.pdf

It's been around a long time - toxicity tests were carried out in 1962:

The Acute Toxicity Data for the mixture showed that it did not irritate the skin of dead rabbits, which might be reassuring for live ones:

(Tested by Rosner-Hixson Laboratories; August 30, 1962)

Irritation: The product is essentially non-irritating to the eyes and skin. Application of the product to areas of intact and abraded rabbit skin produced no signs of skin irritation (Rosner-Hixson Laboratories; Aug 30, 1962).

Quote from Wiki:

Ammonium chloride is an inorganic compound with the formula NH4Cl and a white crystalline salt that is highly soluble in water. Solutions of ammonium chloride are mildly acidic. Sal ammoniac is a name of the natural, mineralogical form of ammonium chloride. The mineral is commonly formed on burning coal dumps from condensation of coal-derived gases. It is also found around some types of volcanic vents. It is mainly used as fertilizer and a flavouring agent in some types of liquorice. It is the product from the reaction of hydrochloric acid and ammonia.

(90% of it globally in in the production of fertiliser due to the nitrogen content).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonium_chloride


https://www.screwfix.com/p/la-co-flux-475g/32957

Hope that's of interest.

(No animals were harmed in the production of this post).
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Old 23rd May 2020, 8:57 am   #28
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

This must be one of the earliest adverts for FLUXITE. Amateur Wireless 22nd Sept. 1928. Most of their adverts appear to have a visual story theme!
It's hard to believe but that is the best part of 100 years ago. John.
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Old 23rd May 2020, 10:30 am   #29
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

I like the illustration of the wealthy repair man with his wing collar and tailed coat!

Peter
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Old 23rd May 2020, 11:49 am   #30
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Yes Peter how times have changed. When I was a small child there used to be a department store in Wimbledon called Kennards. They also had a massive branch in Croydon both noted for their radio departments.

My mother saw television for the first time at Kennards in 1937 at the Wimbledon branch. Apparently you had to line up out side a sort of darkened tent with a flap at each end and the official only let a few in at a time, rather like Tesco in the present situation!

They had at the main entrance a 'shop walker' that would direct you to the department if you didn't know your way around the store. He looked exactly like the guy you mention, almost identical to Capt. Peacock in that brilliant series, 'Are You Being Served'!

I wonder when FLUXITE first advertised in the electrical press and the year cored solder was introduced? Maybe someone will sort out an even earlier advert. John.
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Old 23rd May 2020, 12:30 pm   #31
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heatercathodeshort View Post
I wonder when FLUXITE first advertised in the electrical press and the year cored solder was introduced?
Multicore Solders Ltd started making rosin cored solder for electrical work in about 1939. The original product had three cores rather than the five now used. Not sure whether or not Multicore™ was the first but it was certainly an early example and the manufacturing process was patented at the time.

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Old 23rd May 2020, 3:10 pm   #32
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Probably produced to speed up war production Alan. How did they make it? I must admit I find the mass production of many items utterly amazing. John.
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Old 23rd May 2020, 4:13 pm   #33
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

I think the onset of war was something of a 'lucky break' for the company as it had been developing the manufacturing process for a couple of years prior to 1939. During the war years the product was in great demand especially in the US and that's really how the company became a market leader since there doesn't seem to have been any serious competition. There was of course a huge blanket of secrecy over the exact process used for making Multicore™ and it must have been a real technical challenge at the time. I've never been able to find out precisely how it was done but it's interesting that two more cores were added during the early 1950s by which time there must have been a significant R&D budget. I think the advertisements displayed here make entertaining reading for anyone who enjoys a bit of history relating to our interest:

https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Multicore_Solders

Alan
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Old 23rd May 2020, 6:29 pm   #34
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Although it doesn't go into great detail the attachment does give an overview of the process used in the manufacture of Multicore™ solder together with some information regarding the flux. To be honest I'd forgotten that I had this document when posting earlier.

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Old 23rd May 2020, 11:40 pm   #35
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heatercathodeshort View Post
This must be one of the earliest adverts for FLUXITE. Amateur Wireless 22nd Sept. 1928. Most of their adverts appear to have a visual story theme!
It's hard to believe but that is the best part of 100 years ago. John.
My tin looks like the little round one you can make out in this ad, right down to the 'ask for leaflet on improved methods'. Well, not found the leaflet yet!

If my tin makes it to 100 years old, perhaps I should stop using it and put it on display on a shelf
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Old 24th May 2020, 9:45 pm   #36
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

I've got a tin of Telux and a jar of LA-CO flux. Both great for joints, but on PCB, I tend to wash the boards with meths and when dry spray the copper with lacquer (choice of moment is car plan,as I've got an unused tin). It stops th board and joints going green.
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Old 25th May 2020, 5:19 pm   #37
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

The 'Proper' Fluxite was Rosin-based.

Rosin is also used by practicioners of bowed-string instruments. I wonder if the violinist's Rosin would be any good as a flux? (probably dissolved in some suitably-volatile solvent).
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Old 25th May 2020, 6:17 pm   #38
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Grandad always used a block of Rosin for electrical soldering when I was boy in WW11 and it was just the same as dad used on his violin bow. We also so had some "killed spirit" for soldering tin cans etc. I have some Rosin which I've used on a lathe leather clutch, so I'll give it a go and report back. Ted
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Old 25th May 2020, 7:38 pm   #39
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

I've been using a tin of Norwesco 'Chemically Corect' soldering paste that I found in my late Grandfather's shed. It works really well. It is mostly used for tinning wire etc.

It was made by the Pyrene Manufacturing Company of Toronto, Canada. Date unknown.

I have no idea if it is suitable for electronics but I have not any problems with it.
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Old 25th May 2020, 8:01 pm   #40
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Default Re: Extra flux anyone?

Fascinating to see it was made by "Pyrene Manufacturing Company".

Here in the UK the name 'Pyrene' would be familiar to people in the 40s/50s/60s for brass-cased 'syringe' fire-extinguishers, many of which contained Carbon Tetrachloride! Squirt that on to any hot metal and you created Phosgene gas! Which was probably more-likely to kill you than the fire you were trying to extinguish.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon...re_suppression
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