Cherry keyboard - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Herald1360 · 23rd Aug 2022, 10:55 pm

Seeing the thread about the ACER 286 keyboard prompted me to post a similar question about a Cherry keyboard of slightly later vintage.

It's a Modell MX 3000M, made in Germany, other details as per label. It has a "Windows" key and a 5-pin DIN connector.

ISTR it cost about £75 from RS back in the day. I bought it at work when the crappy OEM keyboard on my then 486 desktop failed, and hung on to it through several later machines until "persuaded" that I should stick to the newly introduced company policy regarding using only the keyboards supplied with the company's computers. Something to do with all computers now having the same maker's name on them as the company itself!

It hid in my office cupboard for many years and I eventually got it signed off as scrap and rehomed it.

SiriusHardware · 24th Aug 2022, 12:30 am

You can (or you could) get passive 5-pin DIN to PS/2 adaptors and intelligent PS/2 to USB adaptors to allow you to plug that keyboard into a current machine. I know this because my original Raspberry Pi is built into a keyboard very like that and the keyboard's cable and DIN plug are routed internally to just such an adaptor chain which in turn is plugged into the Pi.

So - you could potentially still use that nice keyboard with a modern machine.

majoconz · 24th Aug 2022, 4:13 am

SH said:

Quote:

You can (or you could) get passive 5-pin DIN to PS/2 adaptors and intelligent PS/2 to USB adaptors

Indeed - here's my keyboard (pre 'Windows' key) and it's PS/2 to USB adapter...

ScottishColin · 24th Aug 2022, 8:58 am

I have an IBM Model M - it only works with modern PCs with an active adaptor - the passive one would not work at all.

I bought an active connector (PERIPRO-401 PS2 To USB Adapter) which splits into mouse and keyboard connectors for when I get an IBM PS/2 mouse...

Colin.

McMurdo · 24th Aug 2022, 11:44 am

I think I bought a cherry keyboard from either RS or farnell. A the time they offered a lifetime warranty with it.

SiriusHardware · 24th Aug 2022, 11:55 am

The passive PS/2 to USB adaptors assume that the keyboard to be used with them is 'Bilingual' and can communicate either using PS/2 or USB signalling. When the PC starts up it sends a query signal out to the keyboard, 'Hello keyboard, are you there?' and a dual format keyboard will respond in whatever protocol the query from the PC comes in.

For a long time, PS/2 keyboards came with a passive PS/2 to USB converter in the box, but all that did was physically rewire the power and data lines to the physical layout of a USB connector.

Older AT keyboards, especially ones with 5-DIN plugs fitted, are not 'bilingual' and can only speak 'AT' protocol (which is the same protocol as PS/2 keyboards use) - so they will work fine with a passive 5-DIN to PS/2 adaptor as long as the PC still has a PS/2 socket for the adaptor to plug into.

To plug a 5-DIN AT keyboard into a USB port you need first a passive 5-DIN to PS/2 adaptor, and then that needs to go into an active / intelligent PS/2 to USB protocol converter like the one in Majoconz's 's photo.

Herald1360 · 28th Aug 2022, 2:09 pm

Well, that hasn't answered my original question but it has provided me with some interesting food for thought

.

Time for a rummage through my adaptors and a trawl round Ebay I reckon

Edit: Quick look on Ebay suggests that it might be worth about the same in £s as it cost initially

SiriusHardware · 28th Aug 2022, 10:47 pm

Sorry, but because of the rather indirect way in which you posed your question in the OP, I didn't actually realise you were asking about the value of the item. If I had realised, I would have told you to do exactly what you eventually did, to check closed / sold listings for the same item on auction sites.

23rd Aug 2022, 10:55 pm	#1
Herald1360 Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 16,535	Cherry keyboard Seeing the thread about the ACER 286 keyboard prompted me to post a similar question about a Cherry keyboard of slightly later vintage. It's a Modell MX 3000M, made in Germany, other details as per label. It has a "Windows" key and a 5-pin DIN connector. ISTR it cost about £75 from RS back in the day. I bought it at work when the crappy OEM keyboard on my then 486 desktop failed, and hung on to it through several later machines until "persuaded" that I should stick to the newly introduced company policy regarding using only the keyboards supplied with the company's computers. Something to do with all computers now having the same maker's name on them as the company itself! It hid in my office cupboard for many years and I eventually got it signed off as scrap and rehomed it. Attached Thumbnails __________________ ....__________ ....\|____\|\|__\|__\_____ .=.\| _---\__\|__\|_---_\|. .........O..Chris....O

24th Aug 2022, 12:30 am	#2
SiriusHardware Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Newcastle, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 11,556	Re: Cherry keyboard You can (or you could) get passive 5-pin DIN to PS/2 adaptors and intelligent PS/2 to USB adaptors to allow you to plug that keyboard into a current machine. I know this because my original Raspberry Pi is built into a keyboard very like that and the keyboard's cable and DIN plug are routed internally to just such an adaptor chain which in turn is plugged into the Pi. So - you could potentially still use that nice keyboard with a modern machine.

24th Aug 2022, 8:58 am	#4
ScottishColin Octode Join Date: May 2012 Location: Perth, Scotland Posts: 1,804	Re: Cherry keyboard I have an IBM Model M - it only works with modern PCs with an active adaptor - the passive one would not work at all. I bought an active connector (PERIPRO-401 PS2 To USB Adapter) which splits into mouse and keyboard connectors for when I get an IBM PS/2 mouse... Colin.

24th Aug 2022, 11:44 am	#5
McMurdo Dekatron Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Staffordshire Moorlands, UK. Posts: 5,271	Re: Cherry keyboard I think I bought a cherry keyboard from either RS or farnell. A the time they offered a lifetime warranty with it. __________________ Kevin

24th Aug 2022, 11:55 am	#6
SiriusHardware Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Newcastle, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 11,556	Re: Cherry keyboard The passive PS/2 to USB adaptors assume that the keyboard to be used with them is 'Bilingual' and can communicate either using PS/2 or USB signalling. When the PC starts up it sends a query signal out to the keyboard, 'Hello keyboard, are you there?' and a dual format keyboard will respond in whatever protocol the query from the PC comes in. For a long time, PS/2 keyboards came with a passive PS/2 to USB converter in the box, but all that did was physically rewire the power and data lines to the physical layout of a USB connector. Older AT keyboards, especially ones with 5-DIN plugs fitted, are not 'bilingual' and can only speak 'AT' protocol (which is the same protocol as PS/2 keyboards use) - so they will work fine with a passive 5-DIN to PS/2 adaptor as long as the PC still has a PS/2 socket for the adaptor to plug into. To plug a 5-DIN AT keyboard into a USB port you need first a passive 5-DIN to PS/2 adaptor, and then that needs to go into an active / intelligent PS/2 to USB protocol converter like the one in Majoconz's 's photo.

28th Aug 2022, 2:09 pm	#7
Herald1360 Dekatron Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Leominster, Herefordshire, UK. Posts: 16,535	Re: Cherry keyboard Well, that hasn't answered my original question but it has provided me with some interesting food for thought . Time for a rummage through my adaptors and a trawl round Ebay I reckon Edit: Quick look on Ebay suggests that it might be worth about the same in £s as it cost initially __________________ ....__________ ....\|____\|\|__\|__\_____ .=.\| _---\__\|__\|_---_\|. .........O..Chris....O

28th Aug 2022, 10:47 pm	#8
SiriusHardware Dekatron Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Newcastle, Tyne and Wear, UK. Posts: 11,556	Re: Cherry keyboard Sorry, but because of the rather indirect way in which you posed your question in the OP, I didn't actually realise you were asking about the value of the item. If I had realised, I would have told you to do exactly what you eventually did, to check closed / sold listings for the same item on auction sites.