Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? - Page 4 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

Patrick Dixon · 1st Apr 2011, 3:22 pm

I can't give you any useful suggestions for mid-range drivers (although there's a massive thread on diy audio about 66 mid ranges ... and tweeters), but I'm about to buy some OW1s to replace the HF2000 tweeters in a pair of Ditton 66s. I think the mid range is going to be tricky to replace with something different because it works from around 500Hz to 4KHz+. I'm currently running the 66s with 1 dead tweeter and 1 sick one, and it still sounds OK on TV sound.

Benditton · 9th Apr 2011, 3:34 am

Vifa D25 tweeters are too big to fit in the original cutouts, I will keep looking for a "no cut" replacement with 19mm domes.

My new midrange looks like a re-coned original, it does sound different when I put my ear close.

Next job will be to have the crossover caps tested and replaced as required. I have looked into new caps and the cost could be as much as $200 to replace everything (some odd values require 2 caps). Are these speakers worth spending that much on?

photos:
1. Left = original midrange, Right = replaced (reconed?) midrange
2. side view
3. They do look good.

ratafiot · 10th May 2011, 7:31 am

hi all
i leave in france and have been lucky to get a pair of ditton 44 in really good physical condition.
I got a restitution problem. I have the feeling that one speaker is less "powerfull" with poor resolution that the other.
So i got a look at the crossovers.
I dont have capacimeter to test the capacitors but i already identify a strnge thing. On the schematic you give C4 is 24mfd whereas on my pair of 44 it is 24+4 on the first and 24+6 on the second...
Is it normal ? All the components look like they are original...
Is ditton has made several versions of crossover for ditton 44 ?
What do you think i should do to "restaure" my ditton 44 ?
thanks for your help

Diabolical Artificer · 10th May 2011, 3:24 pm

To my eye the crossover in picture two looks got at;a not very neat bodge,A

reddish75 · 10th May 2011, 4:19 pm

All the information including crossover schematics is on diyaudio.

ratafiot · 10th May 2011, 5:44 pm

Thank you reddish for this information. I found the thread on diyaudio refering to the differences of capacitors in midrange.
But the strange thing on mine is that I have 24+4 on one and 24+6 on the other. If I understand well the 4 most common "versions" are either 24 or 25 or 24+6 or 24+8 but not 24+4.

Is it possible that this difference between the two crossovers can explain the difference I hear when I listen my loudspeakers?

@magnetic I did not understand what you said to me

(sorry for my poor English...

)

Station X · 10th May 2011, 7:45 pm

magnetic means that the crossover has been modified (got at) and it is a poor job (not a very neat bodge).

dave cox · 11th May 2011, 12:02 pm

Its possible the capacitors are selected for actual measured value. Typical capacitor tolerance is a bit wide for crossover purposes ...

reddish75 · 11th May 2011, 11:56 pm

Here's how I did mine, I first took lots and lots of photos for reference then replaced the binding posts with some nice shiny new ones you will have to drill the hole bigger to accommodate these, don't worry about the plastic it won't crack and do this with the plastic in situ. Then cut the wires that go to the speakers and take the crossover board out, take lots and lots of photos for reference. Replace the capacitors with cross caps from here http://www.audio-components.co.uk/st...CategoryID=105, you will find for most values you will be able to buy just one capacitor such as 33uf for the mids (which is what I would replace those made up with two capacitors with) The 72uf for the woofers I would try and split the value as evenly as possible i.e 33uf and 39uf and the tweeter, 3.9uf for the 4uf and 6.2uf for the 6uf the difference is so small it will not be heard. Rewire with 6A lamp cord, get some new sealing tape and done!

To secure the new capacitors and resistors use a glue gun and cable ties (which may require new holes drilling).

You will also need to install ESR simulating resistors, the Welwyn W22/23 series is a good choice. See drawing for details.

I will draw a schematic and post it later.

Chris.

Patrick Dixon · 12th May 2011, 4:03 pm

There are lots of Capacitor options - for my 66s, I've gone for Supersounds (Wilmslow or Cricklewood) for all the smaller values and 2 x 36uf AXION from PartsConnexion in Canada (easy to deal with and not too bad for shipping costs) for the 72uFs on the bass section.

Internal cable will be Mogami 2972.

I've just got to fit them now.

ratafiot · 15th May 2011, 4:14 pm

hello
i come back to you regarding the sound problem of my ditton 44.

I identifies something strange with the woofers
I tested them directly plugged on my amp reading cd with "low frequencies sound" write on it.
On of the woofer seems to be more powerfull with more vibration and "less bass sound" that the other.
They both in good physical conditions (cone, magnet, foam) with both 4.6-4.7 ohms.

When i hear "normal music" with it plussged directly on my amp i can make the difference buts that more hard that with low frequencies sounds.

Can you help ?

thanks a lot

1st Apr 2011, 3:22 pm	#61
Patrick Dixon Hexode Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 480	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? I can't give you any useful suggestions for mid-range drivers (although there's a massive thread on diy audio about 66 mid ranges ... and tweeters), but I'm about to buy some OW1s to replace the HF2000 tweeters in a pair of Ditton 66s. I think the mid range is going to be tricky to replace with something different because it works from around 500Hz to 4KHz+. I'm currently running the 66s with 1 dead tweeter and 1 sick one, and it still sounds OK on TV sound.

9th Apr 2011, 3:34 am	#62
Benditton Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Adelaide, Australia Posts: 5	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? Vifa D25 tweeters are too big to fit in the original cutouts, I will keep looking for a "no cut" replacement with 19mm domes. My new midrange looks like a re-coned original, it does sound different when I put my ear close. Next job will be to have the crossover caps tested and replaced as required. I have looked into new caps and the cost could be as much as $200 to replace everything (some odd values require 2 caps). Are these speakers worth spending that much on? photos: 1. Left = original midrange, Right = replaced (reconed?) midrange 2. side view 3. They do look good. Attached Thumbnails

10th May 2011, 7:31 am	#63
ratafiot Retired Dormant Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Rouen, France. Posts: 3	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? hi all i leave in france and have been lucky to get a pair of ditton 44 in really good physical condition. I got a restitution problem. I have the feeling that one speaker is less "powerfull" with poor resolution that the other. So i got a look at the crossovers. I dont have capacimeter to test the capacitors but i already identify a strnge thing. On the schematic you give C4 is 24mfd whereas on my pair of 44 it is 24+4 on the first and 24+6 on the second... Is it normal ? All the components look like they are original... Is ditton has made several versions of crossover for ditton 44 ? What do you think i should do to "restaure" my ditton 44 ? thanks for your help Attached Thumbnails

10th May 2011, 3:24 pm	#64
Diabolical Artificer Dekatron Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Sleaford, Lincs. UK. Posts: 7,658	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? To my eye the crossover in picture two looks got at;a not very neat bodge,A __________________ Curiosity hasn't killed this cat...so far.

10th May 2011, 4:19 pm	#65
reddish75 Hexode Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Manchester, UK. Posts: 251	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? All the information including crossover schematics is on diyaudio.

10th May 2011, 5:44 pm	#66
ratafiot Retired Dormant Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Rouen, France. Posts: 3	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? Thank you reddish for this information. I found the thread on diyaudio refering to the differences of capacitors in midrange. But the strange thing on mine is that I have 24+4 on one and 24+6 on the other. If I understand well the 4 most common "versions" are either 24 or 25 or 24+6 or 24+8 but not 24+4. Is it possible that this difference between the two crossovers can explain the difference I hear when I listen my loudspeakers? @magnetic I did not understand what you said to me (sorry for my poor English... )

10th May 2011, 7:45 pm	#67
Station X Moderator Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ipswich, Suffolk, IP4, UK. Posts: 21,288	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? magnetic means that the crossover has been modified (got at) and it is a poor job (not a very neat bodge). __________________ Graham. Forum Moderator Reach for your meter before you reach for your soldering iron.

11th May 2011, 12:02 pm	#68
dave cox Nonode Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 2,062	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? Its possible the capacitors are selected for actual measured value. Typical capacitor tolerance is a bit wide for crossover purposes ...

11th May 2011, 11:56 pm	#69
reddish75 Hexode Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Manchester, UK. Posts: 251	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? Here's how I did mine, I first took lots and lots of photos for reference then replaced the binding posts with some nice shiny new ones you will have to drill the hole bigger to accommodate these, don't worry about the plastic it won't crack and do this with the plastic in situ. Then cut the wires that go to the speakers and take the crossover board out, take lots and lots of photos for reference. Replace the capacitors with cross caps from here http://www.audio-components.co.uk/st...CategoryID=105, you will find for most values you will be able to buy just one capacitor such as 33uf for the mids (which is what I would replace those made up with two capacitors with) The 72uf for the woofers I would try and split the value as evenly as possible i.e 33uf and 39uf and the tweeter, 3.9uf for the 4uf and 6.2uf for the 6uf the difference is so small it will not be heard. Rewire with 6A lamp cord, get some new sealing tape and done! To secure the new capacitors and resistors use a glue gun and cable ties (which may require new holes drilling). You will also need to install ESR simulating resistors, the Welwyn W22/23 series is a good choice. See drawing for details. I will draw a schematic and post it later. Chris. Attached Thumbnails

12th May 2011, 4:03 pm	#70
Patrick Dixon Hexode Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Bristol, UK. Posts: 480	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? There are lots of Capacitor options - for my 66s, I've gone for Supersounds (Wilmslow or Cricklewood) for all the smaller values and 2 x 36uf AXION from PartsConnexion in Canada (easy to deal with and not too bad for shipping costs) for the 72uFs on the bass section. Internal cable will be Mogami 2972. I've just got to fit them now.

15th May 2011, 4:14 pm	#71
ratafiot Retired Dormant Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Rouen, France. Posts: 3	Re: Celestion Ditton 44 - HF 2000 tweeter replacement? hello i come back to you regarding the sound problem of my ditton 44. I identifies something strange with the woofers I tested them directly plugged on my amp reading cd with "low frequencies sound" write on it. On of the woofer seems to be more powerfull with more vibration and "less bass sound" that the other. They both in good physical conditions (cone, magnet, foam) with both 4.6-4.7 ohms. When i hear "normal music" with it plussged directly on my amp i can make the difference buts that more hard that with low frequencies sounds. Can you help ? thanks a lot