Am I going about this in the wrong way!!

[BrianAllen]

I have a few radios that will need a lot of loving attention (Bush PB.12 Pye 18A and a Pye Fen Man 1); cabinet repairs and French polishing no problems there as I have some experience.

Now to replacement components. I have just been looking online at scale display bulbs and capacitors; £20 for a couple of bulbs and a capacitor (not yet looked at the cost of the valves). I have a feeling that I may be best buying a fully functioning radio rather than spending out £100's on components.

Feeling a little despondent as was really looking forward to something different to Philips tape recorders.

[paulsherwin]

You shouldn't need to pay that much, but it's true that you're not going to get rich restoring old radios.

[Gabe001]

Valve prices vary widely and you may get away with a replacement that's not exactly like for like but significantly cheaper. Helps to do some research. Also post here in the wanted section for components, lots of people pleased to see items (including valves) going to good homes for cost of postage only.

[kestrelmusic]

All of these sets have readily available valves. Langrex in Billingshurst have stock of pretty well anything you might want, though they are on the pricey side - on the other hand, they are also guaranteed good.

But you are unlikely to have to do much in the way of valve replacement, most of the big octal bottles in the Bush and the Pye 18A are pretty well immortal. I've just finished restoring an Invicta set which is a clone of the FenMan 1 (the chassis for all the Invicta sets were bought from Pye) and only the ECC85 and the EF89 needed replacing - the latter because it was cracked!

Shop around for the other components - there's very little in the way of dial lamps and capacitors that can't be picked up very reasonably.

[Sideband]

Depends where you look for parts as well. RS, CPC/Farnell can be expensive but polyester caps are dirt cheap and pilot bulbs should be available for very little outlay. eBay is a good starting point....lots of new polyesters available for a few pounds. Don't worry about valves yet. As has been said, it's a fallacy that valves always need replacing. I have many radios of 50 years plus that still have most, if not all their original valves.

[slidertogrid]

If you Join the BVWS you can buy capacitors for very reasonable prices. All of the commonly used values and voltage ratings are available. Or if you search on ebay for the value and voltage you need (I.E .047 Mfd 400V) you should be able to pick up the ones you need without paying too much.
If you buy "kits" of parts where the seller supplies all of the capacitors, dial lamps and a length of mains lead for a specific model you will pay more as a rule...
Rich
Crossed with above post...

[HamishBoxer]

Caps and dial lamps should be well under a tenner on Ebay.

[McMurdo]

For what its worth, I get dial lamps from Rapid Electronics. A typical 6.5V MES lamp is about 13p

[Sideband]

Here's a good one to start with. I've bought lots of
capacitors from them in the past. https://www.cricklewoodelectronics.com/

Specifically https://www.cricklewoodelectronics.c...-to-1000V.html

[high_vacuum_house]

As a member of the BVWS I find the capacitor service second to none. They are all 630 volt axial capacitors type MKT1813 and are very high quality and ideal replacements for almost all circuitry in radio, television, audio and test equipment. They also do a decent range of high voltage electrolytic capacitors that again are ideal replacements for above. They are not cheap but they are very high quality, long life types. Dial lamps can be found relatively cheaply if a bit of searching is done or you could be lucky at a radio fair.

Christopher Capener

[Horris]

Brian, as you are in Gt Dunmow you are not to far from Rapid Electronics in Colchester. They do a range of 400vw & 630vw capacitors and a range of dial bulbs as well as resistors etc.

Dave

[BrianAllen]

Thank you for all of your comments/help; it was just the encouragement that I needed.

Thanks again.

Brian

[Catkins]

Originally Posted by BrianAllen

I have a few radios that will need a lot of loving attention (Bush PB.12 Pye 18A and a Pye Fen Man 1); cabinet repairs and French polishing no problems there as I have some experience.

Now to replacement components. I have just been looking online at scale display bulbs and capacitors; £20 for a couple of bulbs and a capacitor (not yet looked at the cost of the valves). I have a feeling that I may be best buying a fully functioning radio rather than spending out £100's on components.

Feeling a little despondent as was really looking forward to something different to Philips tape recorders.

Yes in some ways you are going about this in the wrong way, you're first looking at the potential cost of replacing many components (including valves), rather than first discovering what has gone wrong with the set!

As others have implied in this thread, typically you can get a old radio up and running for a couple of pounds, and that rarely involves replacing expensive valves.

The valve fallacy which others have mentioned, is a case in point which brings up the elephant in room, the amount of expertise you have. Sorry to bring it up, but it has a definite effect on how you go about fixing or solving problems, and the expense you will incur. Most people start off with little electronics experience, and the easiest thing to do with a non-working set is to swap valves, with the hope it starts working. They get some sets working that way, and conveniently forget about their failures (as is human nature). In other words, those which lack expertise have only one trick available, replacing valves, and of course every fault they then fix is due to a failed valve.

The truth is most radios don't fail due to a valve, and that should become obvious after this paragraph. Here it gets slightly complicated by why that radio "got put away in the cupboard/attic". I would guess most radios are put away perfectly working, they just got a new radio. In that case the reason why that radio won't work now is due to deterioration of components over time. But, valves in their vacuum are almost the last things to deteriorate. There is a well known list of things which do deteriorate over time, which is always the first things to check. If you're unlucky to get a radio that got put away because it broke, it is more than likely it broke due to wear and tear and the failure of mechanical parts, e.g. the on/off switch broke. So the probabilty your radio doesn't work due to a valve is pretty low, although it obviously does happen.

To summarise, your radio may well work out of the box. If it doesn't work, you then have to consider there may be a mechanical fault, which is why it got put away. Then you have consider component deterioration. By far the most likely components that are faulty are the electrolytics (reservoir and smoothing capacitors), then switches/potentiometers etc.

At this point the majority of radios will be "fixed" (say 90%).

If the replacement of electroytics doesn't fix the problem (and you've dealt with mechanical failures, and mechanical parts do deteriorate over time), or the output is distorted or unstable after replacement, that is when you have to start doing more "sophisticated" checking.

Total failure then (after the above is ruled out), or distortion is likely due to a failure in a descrete component (a resistor or capacitor), in a particular stage. A combination of signal tracing and/or voltage tests should find the faulty stage.

But, you're only likely to have to replace the electrolytics and the odd descrete component. A valve or switch/potentiometer if you're relatively unlucky.

[donutty]

If you want to do the capacitors for free just save up some old power supplies (phone chargers, computer PSUs, anything with a mains input pretty much from the last 20 years) and harvest the electrolytics (400V+ are used in switch-mode supplies) and the X and sometimes Y caps, and also if you are lucky some dipped polyester caps. A good source of these are LED replacement light bulbs where they use them in the mains dropper circuit. I'm not saying buy them to harvest the caps, although this is a possibility as they are available in pound shops now.

Of course, if you take any of the routes above you should test the caps especially if they were from faulty equipment. Take a good look at the electrolytics for any sign of leakage, bulging or crustiness around the seals and top X-shaped vent. Check the ESR and if you can, check for electrical leakage.

Naturally, really nice vintage radios etc should be treated to new capacitors but this penny-pinching method can get a fair number of sets up and running, if only temporarily while you buy new replacements.

[AC/HL]

We have two (or more!) distinct memberships here. If you're doing commercial work, of course you source new components from reputable sources, but then such questions don't arise in the first place. Same considerations apply with upmarket test gear and soldering equipment.
If you're a hobbyist, on a limited budget and happy to revisit for future enjoyment, redundant or scrapped equipment can be a good resource. Good for the environment too!

[cathoderay57]

Hi Brian, not wishing to patronise but you could do a lot worse than looking at the following link for tips. Even for an experienced restorer there is always something to learn.https://www.vintage-radio.com/repair...e-information/ Cheers, Jerry

[Graham G3ZVT]

Originally Posted by BrianAllen

£20 for a couple of bulbs and a capacitor...

I'll take a guess that the capacitor was the large cylindrical, usually dual value "smoothing block" of a particular rating.

I never replace these, I much prefer to retain the original can, which often has the month/year of manufacture stamped on it, and "re-stuff" it with modern 400v wire ended electrolytic capacitors.

[BrianAllen]

Thank you, I take on board all that you are saying.

Needn't worry about patronising or explaining in simple terms, as I did say in one of my very first posts that I will not be offended.

I am keen and here to learn and your messages are of great support.

Thank you.

Brian

[TonyDuell]

I'll start by stating that I am a hobbyist. I fix old radios (and tape recorders, telephones, computers....) because I enjoy doing it. I enjoy getting something to work again. I enjoy solving the puzzle of diagnosing the fault.

A hooby does not normally make financial sense. Somebody said to me years ago that you do the 'day job' in part to have money to spend on hobbies. I know full well I will spend hundreds or thousands of hours sorting out an obscure computer. I'll spend £100+ on replacement ICs, etc. And the result will have less processing power than an RPi. But I enjoy doing it.

And it was also said to me that a hobby has to meet 2 requirements. Firstly you enjoy doing it. If you didn't you wouldn't do it. Secondly it doesn't harm people unconnected with the hobby. Repairing vintage radios, etc (at least in my case) satisfies both of those.

So if you just want the end result it may be cheaper to buy a restored radio. If you enjoy fixing things then there is no point in doing that.

[Sideband]

If you want to look at your radio's, I'd leave the Fenman 1 until last. Great radio but it has VHF (FM) as well. You don't want to start with a more complex set than necessary. Get some experience first.