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Old 16th Jan 2013, 7:05 pm   #1
Electricdreams
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Default Smith Sectric Clocks

I've been asked to look out for a Smiths Sectric Clock for the Projection Box.
Looking on the eBay I was in disbelief of the prices, but there are some in need of repair at a lower price.

So I'm asking you guys, would it be better to get one needing repairs?
Are spares easy to obtain?
Is it easy to maintain and repair?

It would need to be a sensible Bakelite wall clock (not kitchen style) that is seen in offices and schools.
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Old 16th Jan 2013, 8:32 pm   #2
Mike Phelan
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

The "Sectric" name was used on many different models of synchronous electric clocks over the decades and prices vary from £0 to three figures!

New spares are unobtainable apart from obvious things like cable.

The most common fault is the stator winding being O/C because of the clock living in a garden shed or attic; 47 SWG wire and verdigris do not mix!
I've not done this yet, but there are some who put a low voltage winding fed from a wall wart (AC of course).

This will be of interest.

Next thing (even if it's reported as running OK) is that the movement will never have been serviced so will need a complete stripdown and lubrication with the correct oils.

A lot of these have rotors that have lost some or all of their magnetism so either will not self-start or won't run at all.
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Old 16th Jan 2013, 10:15 pm   #3
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Have you considered the modern replicas of the classic Smiths wall clocks, e.g. by Newgate?

http://www.newgateclocks.com/store/W...l44k.asp?sn=2&

http://www.newgateclocks.com/store/W...d42k.asp?sn=2&

Our local village hall has just put one up, and it really looks just the ticket.


N.

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Old 16th Jan 2013, 10:26 pm   #4
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Given what the OP said about prices, I'd think £66 for what is in reality a modern quartz clock with a plastic case would be too much.
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Old 16th Jan 2013, 10:30 pm   #5
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Fair point, but they do turn up on eBay secondhand and there are other similar accurate replicas available from several High Street shops at much more realistic prices.
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Old 17th Jan 2013, 11:18 am   #6
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Thanks Mike for that very useful information, I have printed it out.

Nick, thanks for the link, but I don't think they had quartz clocks in 1932. It will need to be more authentic as it's a English Heritage site.

I was looking on the eBay and the prices were ranging from 80-250 for a fully working model!

I'll keep looking, perhaps one will turn up.

Please do NOT keep referring to eBay in derogatory terms. Check the forum rules.
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Old 17th Jan 2013, 8:35 pm   #7
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

If it is of any help I have just rewound the coil in the clock of a Goblin Timespot S25 radio to run on low voltage AC from an adapted wall wart as Mike suggested above. I used 28swg enameled copper wire and made a very simple coil winder from meccano which allowed me to do it as neatly as possible by hand. I also used what I believed are Mike's instructions to dismantle, clean and re-lubricate the mechanism. If you could get a clock with an o/c coil cheaply enough I would certainly consider trying this.

Regards,

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Old 17th Jan 2013, 9:11 pm   #8
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

That's good to hear, Ken. Did you take any pictures?

The trouble with non workers is that these command nearly as high a price in some cases as there are plenty of punters who'd rather have a nice modern quartz movement and don't care about authenticity in the slightest.

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Old 17th Jan 2013, 10:19 pm   #9
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Hello Nick

I'm sorry but I am afraid I did not take any pictures. I still the have chassis out of its case but the clock is inside its cylinder and mounted in its position on the chassis. As I used the method of winding as many turns onto the existing former as possible I did have to do some experimentation with the lowest voltage that the clock would both start on and continue to run. This was aided by using a cheap switchable DC wall wart (3V,6V,7.5V,9V and 12V) as the "donor".

I also had to spend some time in setting up the "auto switch on" mechanism. I did not realise that these clocks could be expensive even as non-workers. If the mechanisms are being replaced with quartz movements then presumably the originals are being thrown away. A bit of a shame really. Do people sell the non-working mechanisms? The actual cost of doing the rewind is low. I bought the wire from my local Maplin. I bought 250g at a cost of £8.99. The wall wart was £2.99 and I already had this.

Regards,

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Old 17th Jan 2013, 10:39 pm   #10
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Thanks, Ken.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken View Post
I did not realize that these clocks could be expensive even as non-workers. If the mechanisms are being replaced with quartz movements then presumably the originals are being thrown away. A bit of a shame really.
As for the original movements, yes, a few turn up on eBay, especially slave movements. But the cheapest way of getting a replacement movement is usually by buying a whole new clock; the pig-ugly and very battered ones rarely go for more than a fiver.

N.

P.S. when searching form Smiths clocks, don't just use the term Sectric as that was only coined later on. Also search for SEC, GEC (which it's often mis-read as), and Genalex.

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Old 21st Jan 2013, 12:08 am   #11
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Further to what Nick wrote, also search for Smith, no S. They used the Smiths name before 1936 and after 1948, Smith appeared on there between times.
I have many of these things now, I blame that chap Mike Phelan for getting me hooked!

Don't despair if some examples that appear on eBay and in other venues seem expensive, the dealers have to make their keep somehow but I've had many perfectly decent examples for under a tenner including the cost of delivery.

The point about the way in which they can become hard to start is a good one. Not every seller is aware of just how easy these can be to start but the walnut Bakelite example that came from one Mr Phelan of this parish, seen in the attached picture, never requires more than the intended push and release of the setting knob to make it run. An ostensibly similar Genalex example that I gave to Dad as an 80th birthday present requires the skill of Australia's fastest spin bowler to make it run, such is the wrist flicking that's needed, preferably without the letting go part. Fortunately, my parents have far fewer power cuts up at their place than I have here so it rarely needs to be started.

This picture:
Left - the walnut one as supplied by Mike
Right - my green alarm clock. This one is self-starting and naturally both keep perfect average time over the course of a day.

(And no, they're not eight minutes slow, that was how long it took to upload to flickR then resize the picture for use here).
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Old 1st May 2013, 5:22 pm   #12
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken View Post
I also used what I believed are Mike's instructions to dismantle, clean and re-lubricate the mechanism.
Hello Ken,

Where did you get the dismantling/cleaning/lubricating instructions? I've got one of these clocks myself that I'd like to get running again.

Cheers,

Rob
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Old 1st May 2013, 6:58 pm   #13
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Mike Phelan's (Moderator) guide is mentioned here:

https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/...0&postcount=11

but sadly the link seems dead now. Maybe he can tell us where it's hosted now.

Nick.
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Old 1st May 2013, 7:29 pm   #14
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

I've edited the post that Nick refers to - the link no longer exists.

However, I still have the relevant .DOC and pics so PM me your email address if you want copies of this.

Also, this might be of use.
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Old 6th May 2013, 9:53 pm   #15
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Hello All,

I've recently got a Smith Sectric Clock. It's a wooden case (not brilliant condition) and what I think is a bakelite central unit (see photo of back).

I guess it's a cord/mains powered clock, but there was no cord with it. I'm also concerned about using on mains power - jamming the positive and negative wires into the back of the clock sounds like a fire waiting to happen!

I love the clock, and I realise it might well be collectable, but I'd also like to use it... Any tips on how to replace the mechanism with a battery-powered one? The screws on the back seem very strange - they look like a flathead screw, but with something sticking up through the middle?

Any light anyone can shed is very much appreciated.

D
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Old 7th May 2013, 12:47 pm   #16
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

If you want a battery clock, buy a battery clock. This is a mains clock. It gets its timekeeping directly from the reversals of the mains.

The clock would originally have had a connector on its power lead to match the pins on the motor. If you have not got this, you may well have to fabricate something yourself, possibly using contact inserts liberated from other connectors. As long as your connections to the coil are sound, you will have nothing to worry about. The current flowing through the coil is minuscule, so the fire risk is next to non-existent.
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Old 7th May 2013, 2:33 pm   #17
Mike Phelan
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Replacing the clock isn't keeping it but scrapping it and using the case.
What's left will be zero collectable and will wear out in a few years!

There must be many mains-powered in existence in the world, all working quite well; we've a few in the house here.

Yours will obviously need the mains lead replacing and probably the movement overhauling. They are slotted nuts on the back, not screws, and need a screwdriver with a slot on the centre.
This originally had a female plug to connect it, but as AJS said, replacing the lead directly isn't a problem.

Yours looks like the Smiths "Darwin" ca 1935/36 with the "Bijou" movement.
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Old 12th Jul 2016, 5:19 pm   #18
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Hello,

I'm new and thought I'd bring back this thread which I found when searching for information on Smith Sectric clocks.

About a year ago I bought the following example, which as run flawlessly until today, when it stopped for no apparent reason, as there was no power outage in my home that I'm aware of.

Pushing and releasing the knob on the back was enough to start the clock again, so I suspect there must be something wrong with the makeshift power cord it came with. It's fitted with a standard electrical connector and the wiring is a bit aged.

What can I do to check whether the cord is the problem if it stops again?

Thanks!
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Old 12th Jul 2016, 9:42 pm   #19
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

Hello and welcome.

That's a handsome clock, and dates from the immediate pre-war years, at a guess.

I have a very similar one, though mine is fitted with a slightly later, smaller, "Bijou" movement. I think mine's called the "Cambria".

One of the commonest causes of stopping is indeed an intermittent mains connection, and the 2-pin connector is rather poor in that respect. This is easily checked if you have a multimeter. Set it to measure resistance, disconnect the clock from the mains, and connect it across the two pins of your mains plug. It should read a few thousand ohms and the reading should be steady. If it varies as you flex the lead or connectors, you have a poor connection which needs attending to.

N.
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Old 12th Jul 2016, 9:47 pm   #20
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Default Re: Smith Sectric Clocks

I'd suggest first doing a mechanical check that the cord connections are sound at both ends. Then, with the clock running, bend and stress the cord at each end to see if that stops the clock. If so, you've found the dodgy connection.

Sectric clocks are very long-lived, but sometimes bearings (pivots in clock language) do wear and allow the gears to disengage. I have one that will only work upside down!

Is your clock running sweetly, or is it noisy? If the latter, a drop of light oil on the rotor bearings will have a magical effect.

Or the stoppage might be just one of those things, such as a momentary mains interruption which would require the clock to be manually restarted.

Martin
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