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Old 21st May 2022, 5:37 pm   #1
Lloyd 1985
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Default Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

I have been running a thread about this set over on VRAT, and got a request to run the same here, so here it is! Mostly copied directly, with a few edits, so if you think you have read this before somewhere, you probably have!

Some of you may have seen the very manky TV22 chassis I picked up from RetroTech, very dirty, very rusty! I thought I’d turn my attention to this, just because I wanted to know if the tube was any good.

The base on the tube is knackered, it’s one of the ones with the metal tubular bit between the glass and the Bakelite base with the pins, and it’s the metal bit that’s split and fallen off, leaving the base dangling on its lead out wires. I was mostly worried about the evacuation pip, as you can’t see it, so I had no idea if it was intact or not. Luckily it’s all in good order, vacuum is intact, heater is also, and all the connections to the electrodes.

To begin with I wanted to try the good old ‘cathode imaging’ with a Megger on 1KV, the results were promising! For those of you that haven’t heard of this, basically you run the heater at it’s normal 6.3V, connect the Megger positive to the anode of the CRT, and also the A1, connect the negative lead to the cathode and the grid, set it to 1000V, and press test. You should then be presented with a blob on the screen, which can be varied with the ion trap and focus assembly.

This tube produced some interesting patterns, and was also nice and bright, a good indicator the tube is going to produce a picture when the set is finally running.

The chassis looked untouched, every waxy in place, I guess it was just retired working many years ago, sadly it was stored in a very damp place, probably a leaky shed, so I didn’t expect much from it. The Lopty is present, and covered in cracked up pitch, and I have another set that the lopty packed up on ages ago, which I would like to get going again, so I thought it’d be an idea to see if I could get any life from this set. Rather than plug it into 240V AC, even through a lamp or variac, I decided to try a different approach, give it some DC from the bench power supplies! I set the dropper to its lowest DC settings, and connected them up, I can just about manage 135V with them all.

As the heaters began to light and the HT started to climb there were clouds of smoke coming from the RF deck, caused by a shorted cap on one of the IF transformers, so it got the snip, it had cooked up a resistor downstream, next power up, more smoke! Another resistor toasted in the RF deck… At this point I said stuff it, and ditched the RF deck! A link on the socket restored heater continuity. Now I was able to get more heater volts, and things were starting to come alive, the line whistle could be heard, and crackles from the speaker, also a nice buzz when touching the input to the audio amp, which surprised me, the speaker is in an awful state! There was no EHT present on the anode cap, but sparks could be drawn from the input to the rectifier, turned out the EY51 had lost its legs, totally rusted off! I guess the heater end had filled with water during storage, and just sat there like that for some time. I haven’t got another, well, not one that’s easily accessible, so time for terrible bodge no.1, fit a DY86! That done, I could now just about manage 1KV, and nothing on screen. First cap to get the chop was the grid coupling cap to the line output valve, replacing this livened things up a bit and got me all of 2.5KV EHT, still nothing on screen. The A1 volts were all of 1.2V, so the cap after the metrosil got snipped and a new one tacked in on croc clips. Now things were happening on screen! A fuzzy line could be seen, but only with the brightness on full, the control seemed more like a switch, only working near the top end, a dab of conductive paint restored proper operation, and now the control needs to be on zero to stop the EHT dropping.
With the line stage mostly working I turned attention to the frame stage, wiggling the controls would make the line jiggle up and down, so there was life there! I just went for a blanket snipping of the caps on the tag strip down the side, tacked in some new ones and that got the frame stage running, with a nice raster on screen, albeit out of focus and small, almost certainly because of the low HT volts.

So it looks like a viable set! I now have to decide what to do with it, I was going to rob it for spares, but I have another option, I have a cabinet with a Thorn solid state portable stuffed in it, which was the very first Bush TV22 I bought about a million years ago (2002..) and it’s been lying around getting filthy looks, hidden in cupboards, just because I was ashamed of it (damn thing cost me a fortune, and wasn’t a proper set!!) so I could bung this chassis in that and make it a proper set! Might make it worth something closer to what I paid for it too.. I also have another chassis tucked away, missing it’s Lopty and a few other bits, so I could even use that as a base to refit all the good bits onto. I also have another RF deck, complete with band 3 tuner, which could replace ‘Smoky mcsmokeface’.. the possibilities are endless, almost!

Picture 1: the exhumed corpse
Picture 2: cathode imaging results
Picture 3: raster!

Part 2 to follow
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Old 21st May 2022, 5:40 pm   #2
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Part 2…

since things were going so well, I thought it’d be an idea to dig a working RF chassis out of another set and see if I could get a signal through it. The bench power supplies weren’t enough for it any more, so I had to bring the variac and isolating transformer into play, and also set the dropper taps for AC operation (230V setting, as that’s what it was last used on). Wound it up slowly, and at 130V smoke came from one of the 2 green resistors on the tag board, not sure which one, but I guessed that the big fat waxy on top of the chassis was to blame, so snipped it, no more smoke! Line stage running, no picture, EHT was up, 5KV! Undoing the video lead made the screen light up, turned out the Aurora had gone into standby.. with that sorted out, and a quick tune of the RF, the screen lit up, and there was a rough looking test card, fair bit of cogging, and struggling to sync. The line sync then went off completely, and the control was right up one end. I changed the sync coupling cap, and another nearby that looked iffy, no change. Then I ran out of time, so that’s as far as I’ve got! It’s looking pretty good now though!

Part 3 coming..
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Old 21st May 2022, 5:43 pm   #3
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

Part 3…

Well, some progress! One more cap change C14 on the manufacturers data, and now we have sync! We’re now on full mains too, 6KV EHT (checked with brightness down, but still slightly visible pic) focus looks ok, bit blurry at the edges, it’s very difficult to set the focus and the ion trap, I think this is an early chassis that should have had an MW22-18, as the focus assembly gets in the way of the trap.

I’m using the Hedghog today, so I can play something with sound through the set, at first I could get sound, but it was a bit hummy, and quiet, sounded like duff smoothers, but I’ve since found it to be a dodgy valve base on the RF deck for one of the sound IF valves, giving it a damn good wiggle bought back sound, and very loud too! The speaker rattles a bit, and the voice coil is rubbing, but otherwise it’s ok. I’m watching a bit of ‘Insomnium’ playing a live set from during lockdown on it!
Looks like this little telly is going to live, so I’ll have to find spares for the other one elsewhere… I think a lopt rewind will be in order for the one that died, and a new CRT for the PYE LV30 will need to be sourced.

Regards
Lloyd.
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Old 21st May 2022, 10:20 pm   #4
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

This is very impressive Llloyd. Thanks for sharing.
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Old 22nd May 2022, 8:58 am   #5
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

Great thread. Out of interest I'm poised to begin restoration of a TV22 that's in very good, 'stored indoors', clean condition that I've owned 'as is' for 35 years. Having read various restoration stories and repairs on here, the general consensus or even rule is that the LOPT should be stripped and revarnished before anything else. I notice you didn't do this Lloyd, was there a particular reason for this or was it more a case of fingers crossed?! Just interested as it's not a simple job and one that I'd rather not undertake unless it's really necessary. Some say it's not a case of if the LOPT will fail, but when if not stripped, dried out and revarnished. Here's hoping to see 'watch with mother' on your TV22 soon.
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Old 22nd May 2022, 12:19 pm   #6
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

Hi Steve,

Your set sounds like a nice one! I have also seen a lot about stripping the Lopty, I have 2 other sets (I honestly didn’t set out to buy another TV22!!), one that I’ve had since 2003 which I have been working on ‘on and off’ ever since, I left the lopty well alone in that one and it’s been working very well, the second set I got in 2010, I stripped the lopt in that one, got rid of the pitch, and cleaned the rust off the laminations, it ran beautifully, I even took it to a vintage festival at York racecourse in 2011, where it ran happily for over 8 hours non stop, but then in 2014 it packed up, shorted primary to secondary! I do remember that the insulation on the inner windings looked awful on that one, you could see it flaking off, leaving bare copper, I gave it a dose of varnish, but clearly there was more damage buried deep in the windings. So because of this I’m tempted to leave it well alone on this set, it has been damp, there is rust everywhere! Most notable where the legs fell off the EY51, which I have now managed to ‘bodge’ some new lead outs onto. At least it can be rewound if needs be, and I will be doing that with the one that died, it’d be a shame not to get that set back up and running, it was really good when it worked!

I’m hopefully going to have a go at reattaching the CRT base today, got some Araldite, and I’ve managed to stick the metal bit of the base back together, and it just about fits through the scan coils! I borrowed a capacitor clamp from a scrap Ekco A22 chassis to hold the base together while soldering it, it’s just the right size

Regards
Lloyd
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Old 22nd May 2022, 1:22 pm   #7
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

Nice one. If you need an EY51 I'm sure I've got a few kicking about.
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Old 22nd May 2022, 2:39 pm   #8
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lloyd 1985 View Post
Hi Steve,

Your set sounds like a nice one! I have also seen a lot about stripping the Lopty, I have 2 other sets (I honestly didn’t set out to buy another TV22!!), one that I’ve had since 2003 which I have been working on ‘on and off’ ever since, I left the lopty well alone in that one and it’s been working very well, the second set I got in 2010, I stripped the lopt in that one, got rid of the pitch, and cleaned the rust off the laminations, it ran beautifully, I even took it to a vintage festival at York racecourse in 2011, where it ran happily for over 8 hours non stop, but then in 2014 it packed up, shorted primary to secondary! I do remember that the insulation on the inner windings looked awful on that one, you could see it flaking off, leaving bare copper, I gave it a dose of varnish, but clearly there was more damage buried deep in the windings. So because of this I’m tempted to leave it well alone on this set, it has been damp, there is rust everywhere! Most notable where the legs fell off the EY51, which I have now managed to ‘bodge’ some new lead outs onto. At least it can be rewound if needs be, and I will be doing that with the one that died, it’d be a shame not to get that set back up and running, it was really good when it worked!

I’m hopefully going to have a go at reattaching the CRT base today, got some Araldite, and I’ve managed to stick the metal bit of the base back together, and it just about fits through the scan coils! I borrowed a capacitor clamp from a scrap Ekco A22 chassis to hold the base together while soldering it, it’s just the right size

Regards
Lloyd
Hi Lloyd,

i have TV12/22/32/62 & TV24.

My TV22 was recapped before I bought it and it works. The LOPT still needs the pitch removing and varnishing.

I have added fly back suppression - per Bush TV56.

The TV12 - still on roundtuit pile has the metal CRT base the pins are as per EF50s - which it is full of.

It looks like a very low use set, in beautiful condition. Even the waxies look good with no sticky melting wax!

Good luck with your TV22.

I have the TV 32 in bits for cleaning and replacement caps resistors etc.

It has the additional Bush two channel tuner added and also a rebuilt CRT.

The tube tested good on my CRT tester so it is looking good.

I wish you well with your renovation.

Bon courage!

Andy
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Old 22nd May 2022, 11:36 pm   #9
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

Hi Lloyd on the pic of the CRT base the leads look very short ,must have been a struggle to resolder them?

Graham.
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Old 23rd May 2022, 10:21 am   #10
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Hi Graham,

I haven’t actually got to putting the base back on yet, I hope they are long enough! I have seen a trick on YouTube to help get the leads in the right place when trying to reassemble it, just solder on some long lengths of wire that have already been fed through the base pins, that’s tonight’s job

Hi Andy,

Sounds like you have a good shrubbery! I have a TV12, 3 TV22’s, and a TV62. Oh, does a bush TV125 count as well? the TV62 wins for best picture. I’m going to try adding the fly back blanking on this TV22, it looks simple enough, got to be worth a try!

Regards
Lloyd
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Old 23rd May 2022, 2:39 pm   #11
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Hi Graham,

I haven’t actually got to putting the base back on yet, I hope they are long enough! I have seen a trick on YouTube to help get the leads in the right place when trying to reassemble it, just solder on some long lengths of wire that have already been fed through the base pins, that’s tonight’s job

Hi Andy,

Sounds like you have a good shrubbery! I have a TV12, 3 TV22’s, and a TV62. Oh, does a bush TV125 count as well? the TV62 wins for best picture. I’m going to try adding the fly back blanking on this TV22, it looks simple enough, got to be worth a try!

Regards
Lloyd
Hi Lloyd,thats what i did last time soldered long wires to the leads fed them thru the base to locate them.I had to file the pins down a bit so i could see them to solder them. Graham.
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Old 23rd May 2022, 4:54 pm   #12
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

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Originally Posted by Lloyd 1985 View Post
Hi Graham,

I haven’t actually got to putting the base back on yet, I hope they are long enough! I have seen a trick on YouTube to help get the leads in the right place when trying to reassemble it, just solder on some long lengths of wire that have already been fed through the base pins, that’s tonight’s job

Hi Andy,

Sounds like you have a good shrubbery! I have a TV12, 3 TV22’s, and a TV62. Oh, does a bush TV125 count as well? the TV62 wins for best picture. I’m going to try adding the fly back blanking on this TV22, it looks simple enough, got to be worth a try!

Regards
Lloyd
Hi Lloyd,

I recently restored my TV62 (not the best picture) - that accolade goes to my TV22 which gives a smashing picture.

The TV62 has a partially shorted CRT heater (seems to be quite a common occurrence). I have bought a small 6V transformer and will supply the CRT heater from that.

Also the alignment could be out so I need to give that a check out.

The picture is bright but lacks contrast - all associated resistors in the RF/IF deck have been checked and those out of tolerance have been changed.

The TV22 is awaiting removal of its LOPT and dunked in white spirit for a week to remove the old pitch.

I have some yacht varnish ready to seal the windings when it is ready. I'm also replacing the high voltage cap connected to the LOPT. I managed to get one from Mouser in the USA.

The flyback suppression I have fitted seems to work fine.

I have done that to my TV32 as well - which is still part way through renovation..

The shrubbery also includes two DAC90s, two DAC10s, and two TV24s!

Good luck with your restoration

Andy
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Old 23rd May 2022, 9:35 pm   #13
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

I wish you good luck with re-mounting the CRT base, I have had to do a few over the years, the most nerve wracking was a donor CRT for my TV12B, the base got ripped off whilst removing the scan coils

A steady hand and good light is essential, I managed to refit mine with 100% success, I would recommend using contact adhesive, as it stays a bit soft which allows for expansion & contraction of the neck glass.

I have experienced a few LOPT failures, some within an hour of use.
While some appeared to have been stored in damp conditions (rusty lams) I had a couple of failures that looked mint as well!

The last TV22 I restored had a very sad looking LOPT, pitch on the secondary
very cracked & shedding, rusty lams & the pitch on the primary had melted out and covered the RF deck!

I left it hooked up to my bench PSU for a couple of days to dry out any damp, gave it a thorough cleaning with IPA, fitted a new EY51 and bunged it back in the set and it works well, EHT is spot on and has had a fair bit of use since with no issues.


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Old 24th May 2022, 3:10 pm   #14
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Hi Lloyd - 'dogged determination and tenacity of purpose' ... as usual!

Full marks Mate!
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Old 24th May 2022, 5:49 pm   #15
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

Hi Lloyd,
Hats off to you for taking that set on. I was tempted by the Murphy V114 chassis that was at Retrotech. I didn't buy it though.

One can get caught out with Bakelite sets where a nice cabinet hides a very rusty chassis within. However, when you know you have a very rusty chassis and have paid a price for it that reflects this, it can be fun, as long as you start off with low expectations.
One thing that can be a problem on corroded TV22s is the valve socket for the local oscillator in the RF deck which can become very temperamental. I have found though that the alignment of the valve pins with respect to the mounting holes for the socket is different to the more common types, but they can be found or sometimes you can prize open the aluminium skirt of the socket and rotate the Bakelite part to the correct position (some sockets have a second locating pip for the Bakelite part to accommodate this).

Oh dear, I've waffled rather.

Anyway, I'm all in favour of you building it up into the cabinet that you had put the later chassis in to.

Keep up the good work

Cheers
Andy
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Old 25th May 2022, 10:21 am   #16
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

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Hi Graham,
I’m going to try adding the fly back blanking on this TV22, it looks simple enough, got to be worth a try!
The mod seems quite simple to do, but I actually like having the flyback lines. Not only are they a part of the set's original MO but also they are actually a good guide for properly adjusting contrast and brightness, as they become practically invisible with the right settings.
- Helder
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Old 25th May 2022, 2:55 pm   #17
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

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I’m going to try adding the fly back blanking on this TV22, it looks simple enough, got to be worth a try!
Hi Lloyd. Great write-up. You were lucky with the tube!

Can you remind me of the TV22/24 fly-back blanking mod please? If you (or anyone else) tried it how much difference does it make?

Cheers,

Ian
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Old 25th May 2022, 4:45 pm   #18
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

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Hi Lloyd,
Hats off to you for taking that set on. I was tempted by the Murphy V114 chassis that was at Retrotech. I didn't buy it though.
I had a look at that! I think it was a V180C. The V114 has mains EHT with an additional transformer with the U22 mounted horizontally. Was it a 12"?
Lloyd, Well done with that wreck TV22. John.
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Old 26th May 2022, 8:15 am   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lloyd 1985 View Post
I’m going to try adding the fly back blanking on this TV22, it looks simple enough, got to be worth a try!
Hi Lloyd. Great write-up. You were lucky with the tube!

Can you remind me of the TV22/24 fly-back blanking mod please? If you (or anyone else) tried it how much difference does it make?

Cheers,

Ian
Found something on the forum here. Post 11 and 12 give two different suggestions. I wonder which is most effective?

Ian
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Old 26th May 2022, 11:16 am   #20
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Default Re: Reviving a dead Bush (TV22!)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lloyd 1985 View Post
Hi Graham,
I’m going to try adding the fly back blanking on this TV22, it looks simple enough, got to be worth a try!
The mod seems quite simple to do, but I actually like having the flyback lines. Not only are they a part of the set's original MO but also they are actually a good guide for properly adjusting contrast and brightness, as they become practically invisible with the right settings.
- Helder
Back in the late late 70s and 80s in my heyday of vintage TV collecting and restoration, that's exactly what I found too. Good point.
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