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Old 5th Oct 2017, 2:58 pm   #61
canonman75
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Station X View Post
Some members seem to get annoyed when no one responds to their request for repair help, but maybe no one knows the answer?
I wouldn't say I was getting annoyed at the lack of responses, just a bit miffed with members who hoard spare parts but won't sell them to relative newbies like me. Presumably they think that as soon as I've completed a repair, it'll be listed for sale on eBay for silly money. That isn't how I operate, though.
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Old 5th Oct 2017, 3:02 pm   #62
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

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just a bit miffed with members who hoard spare parts but won't sell them
I wonder on what evidence you make that assumption?
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Old 5th Oct 2017, 3:37 pm   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by canonman75 View Post
just a bit miffed with members who hoard spare parts but won't sell them
I wonder on what evidence you make that assumption?
Absolutely none.

It wasn't like I was asking for anything out-of-the-ordinary like hen's teeth or rainbow paint though.

I'll shut up now. I've said enough already.
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Old 5th Oct 2017, 4:01 pm   #64
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Wanted and offered threads are closed when satisfied, or several months after the last response as part of general housekeeping, time allowing.

As private individuals, no one is ever under any obligation to part with anything unless they want to, but many do, often at some personal inconvenience. The giving of advice is similarly voluntary, and in good faith for the help and advancement of the hobby. Sometimes it's just that no one has anything useful to add.

We tend to feature highly on internet searches, so are a natural place for people to turn to when help or advice is needed. Abuse is not common though, and people tend to be judged on their actions, rather than any assumptions.
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Old 6th Oct 2017, 10:38 am   #65
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

I think a few comments are out of hand here, we would all I am sure sell our unneeded spares to whoever, whether "newbie" or not.

Also in a lot of cases are given away freely.

Pretty sure there is not much abuse if any as stated on this forum. General advice is always as far as I am aware given freely.
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Old 6th Oct 2017, 12:21 pm   #66
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

There are bad apples in all walks of life. Some people are always on the take. I've met plenty of them in the past. There are also plenty of people, and I would say the majority, who are willing, helpful and hard working. I think it's fairly obvious to any seasoned forum member which people are trying to take advantage. Don't lose heart. This forum has a lot of very knowledgeable members who are always willing to go the extra mile because they love the hobby and helping other people to do so. We will just have to tolerate the odd occasion where our patience is tested. I personally prefer to see something being put to use which has spent umpteen years loafing about in my shed. I rarely ask for money. I think the voluntary charity donation thing works well because it avoids the awkwardness of putting a price on something/haggling pointlessly and the true value of the item is decided by the recipient, via their donation. Win win.
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Old 7th Oct 2017, 7:52 am   #67
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Quote:
There are bad apples in all walks of life. Some people are always on the take.
They are as Black Holes.........self centred !
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Old 31st Jan 2018, 5:38 pm   #68
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Being at the end of a phone sometimes brings bizarre questions in a similar way to the newcomer forum member.
For example:

caller: hello, I wonder if you could sell me some spare parts for my CD player? The disc goes in but it won't play.

me: Possibly, what do you need exactly?

caller: well..I was hoping you'd tell me.
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Old 31st Jan 2018, 8:35 pm   #69
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

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Except when they're gutted after a failed attempt and replaced with blue-tooth modules.
Don't set me off about Blue Tooth bodged radios

I spend a lot of my time wandering around junk shops these days (you can still find them hidden amongst the charity shops) and if there is one thing that makes me grind my teeth it is this fad for 'distressing' furniture by painting it with emulsion and then scraping the paint half off. It should have its correct title of cowboys wrecking perfectly good antiques.
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Old 31st Jan 2018, 9:16 pm   #70
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Kevin,brilliant!
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Old 1st Feb 2018, 12:08 am   #71
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Arrow Re: Having a laugh?

Just to try to get this Thread back on track of Newcomers without the Knowledge.

Seems to me that such people are in a classic Catch-22 situation when they ask questions here. Their description of the (apparent) fault will be based on their limited knowledge and technical vocabulary - so they will phrase things in a way which we either don't understand - or think we understand - only later to find out we have been wasting our efforts. It's a Catch-22 because the newcomer needs to have adequate (not in-depth, specialist) knowledge to not only reasonably accurately describe the fault, but also to understand the help provided and then know how to implement it. If he / she had that Knowledge, etc., in the first place, he / she wouldn't have asked! Moreover, if his / her general knowledge of electronics / electrics at the fundamental level is seriously lacking, then things will get difficult for both 'sides'. (E.g.: "Just how far need I go 'back' to a level where I can 'connect' with this person so that I can move him / her forward to the point where he / she then understands what I am saying, but at the same time, not accidently to insult the enquirer's existing knowledge and ability?" )

So how to deal with 'fake beginners'? Possibly, in the early part of the Q. & A., by asking a couple of 'loaded questions'. Questions that appear elementary and basic in themselves, but are carefully chosen so as possibly to elicit a response which indicates that the enquirer has a knowledge (etc.) more that he / she is effectively claiming to have!
And I would just like to add to that last remark that I have seen very, very few 'enquirers' here that, to me, fit that description. Perhaps I'm just too trusting - or simply naive.

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Old 1st Feb 2018, 12:10 am   #72
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Wink Re: Having a laugh?

"Plug and Play", eh? In my experience, more like "Plug and Pray"!

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Old 1st Feb 2018, 3:35 am   #73
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Nice to see my old thread resurrected.
I am not as patient as most or tolerant of buffoons.
A cold chill goes down my spine when I read something along the lines of " Newby here, I've bought a record player, think it's about 50 years old, want to re purpose it, what do I need? Will it play stereo?"
I am refusing to help unless they make it clear to my satisfaction at the outset that they appreciate that working with mains can kill them.
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Old 1st Feb 2018, 1:14 pm   #74
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

On another forum, where the discussion can be more 'robust' than here, I have sometimes said "if you need to ask the question then you won't understand the answer". However, this is not said to a genuine newbie seeking knowledge but to someone who thinks that his years of experience somehow compensates for his lack of actually learning anything from that experience. Such folk can be hard to teach because their misconceptions are ingrained.
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Old 1st Feb 2018, 7:36 pm   #75
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Arrow Re: Having a laugh?

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I am refusing to help unless they make it clear to my satisfaction at the outset that they appreciate that working with mains can kill them.
That I readily understand. But it only takes a minute or two to simply ask of a Newbie:

"Are you aware that mains voltages can be lethal?"
"Do you take suitable precautions when working on equipment that is then connected to the a.c. mains?"
"Are you aware of the hazards of servicing AC / DC equipment?"

My earlier post referred to asking 'loaded questions': these three are examples of what I had in mind. However, depending on the original enquiry and the item described, sometimes only one of those will be adequate. The enquirer's response to those Qs. (or single Q.) can be quite revealing . . . . in many ways.

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Old 1st Feb 2018, 8:29 pm   #76
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Arrow Re: Having a laugh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by G8HQP Dave View Post
[Extract from]
This is not said to a genuine newbie seeking knowledge but to someone who thinks that his years of experience somehow compensates for his lack of actually learning anything from that experience. Such folk can be hard to teach because their misconceptions are ingrained.
I have met examples of that, not on this forum I hasten to add, but in real life person-person dialogue: your analysis of such is appropriate in many cases. However - and it gives me no pleasure to report this - there have also been examples when I have been faced with sheer arrogance and -minded stubbornness. At which point, I simply walk away. 'Horse and Water' springs to mind.

Al.
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Old 1st Feb 2018, 9:32 pm   #77
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

As many here I try to take a pragmatic approach.

Yes it is frustrating and there is a mountain to climb.

But we are all getting older and we need fresh young people to replace us.

Their's is a different world so we need to entice these young enthusiasts it might start with a Dansette today but its up to us to encourage newbies to look further.

Frankly I don't always have the patience but that doesn't mean to say I don't think I and others should not try. I personally admire Edward Huggins for his sheer tenacity and his good humour despite some members snipping at him.

Incidentally Edward who never seems to promote himself has been collecting and studying record players for best part of 30 years to my knowledge. It may well be considerably longer.

Controversial point here:

Many of the very best in vintage radio and TV had a commercial element.

Gerry Wells was in that category and I think few would question his credentials.

I donít see a commercial element in its own as a reason to exclude people this is domestic electronics the people who are best at it lived it it was their day job.

Users will appear in any walk of life , but what if they become the experts of tomorrow ?

Just a few thoughts

Prepared to be shot down

Cheers

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Old 1st Feb 2018, 10:04 pm   #78
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Despite having gained my qualification nearly 47 years ago, and having worked full time as an ICE (Car Radio) service engineer for half that time until 1995, then part-time self-employed since (I'm 10 years past retiring age, btw!), I certainly do not 'know it all' and hope none of my posts come across that way. I also hope I've been able to help at least a few fellow forum members over the last few years, and am also grateful for the help and advice I've received from other members,
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Old 2nd Feb 2018, 5:43 am   #79
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Unfortunately I find that advancing years can lead me to contempt, short temper, and lack of patience, but I am only human.
I try hard to be nice but sometimes its very difficult.
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Old 2nd Feb 2018, 12:33 pm   #80
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Default Re: Having a laugh?

Same here Sam, but often for a good reason:

A: Your depth gauge must be out of calibration
B: It has one moving part; how and where is the wear point that has caused this?

I am 'B'. (Did you guess?)

A quite fiddle with a pair of 2mm drill bits showed my old device is, of course, right on the bubble.
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