I've just bought a record player!

[dave walsh]

The recent rather dramatic but effective "Death Sentence" thread was launched on the back of public spirited concerns about electrical safety and then having perhaps been high-jacked by dire warnings about culpability, seemed to be really about an increase in openly non technical individuals seeking help with retro items [as opposed perhaps to an ongoing interest in vintage restoration!] The discussion lasted from the 21st to the 23rd.

I wasn't quite sure whether there really was a problem, despite my comments at the time but they do seem to have kept coming in since regarding players/ radiograms/ radios and have met with courteous responses as usual. Several ideas about this "new" development were put forward. Is it really all on the increase or is it just me I wonder It's very interesting either way! This is a genuine enquiry and [rightly or wrongly] I hope it's clear that there may be a distinction between simple inexperience versus a complete lack of knowledge.
Dave W

[Radio Wrangler]

There seems to be a surge in interest in older things, possibly because Mr public is waking up to the fact that a lot (not all) of modern stuff is either obsolete before you've got it out of the box, or else breaks if you frown at it (or both) and it can't be repaired, anyway.

This is overlying a surge in interest in all things retro (all things except dentistry, I'll concede)

On the whole, this seems a good thing, though it's a bit of a shame that they are seeking the Dansettes of this world rather than the really good stuff.

We'll just have to educate them once they get hooked

Both inexperience and a complete lack of knowledge can be fixed. It's a complete lack of interest that would be a problem.


David

[Junk Box Nick]

A friend of mine bought his early 20s daughter a (new) turntable arrangement she desired as a birthday present. For youngsters of this age it seems to be the fascination with something visibly mechanical when all they've known is an MP3 player.

[dave walsh]

Yes the interest is, of course, great and there was a similar "spike" about ten years ago but it's the instant gratification/expectation of a quick fix that seems a bit surprising/worrying overall.
Dave

[paulsherwin]

The irritating thing about the new record player owners that come here is that they have no real interest in the underlying technology. It's all about style and image. They buy a 50 year old record player that has been 'serviced' (i.e. cleaned) then suddenly find that it doesn't work, or is distorted, or chews up their nice new stereo records. They then find this forum through Google and expect a magic fix that they can apply.

Members are mostly polite and supportive, but it's a headache for the mods because we have to monitor all the threads in case somebody loses patience and turns nasty.

The record player people aren't the same as normal vintage tech beginners, who are mostly eager to learn and often do sort out their problems with a little guidance.

[camallison]

It goes deeper than that, in "technology" terms. My neighbour, a civil engineer, was told in no uncertain terms by his wife that a trailing appliance lead was "getting in her way and forever tripping her up". So, his solution was to shorten the lead by cutting a section out of the middle of the lead. Luckily, he unplugged it before he did! When he plugged it back in and turned it on, the circuit breaker tripped. He came to me to see if I could help and, on inspecting the taped up joint he had made in the cable, I found he had twisted earth, neutral and live together and taped over the top!!!! Darwin was right all along.

Colin

[julie_m]

Unbelievable! If you're going to shorten a mains lead (and sure it's not a resistive one, like those imported car inspection lamps from years ago) why not just cut out a section from nearest the plug, and wire the cut end to the plug? Must be my street smarts showing through .....

[Radio Wrangler]

Ah, but it wasn't the bit of cable nearest the plug that people were tripping over !

Different people have a very different sort of logic. They keep doing things which transcend our ability to imagine, but they do it for reasons which make sense to them.

David

[Herald1360]

Moulded plug?

You used to be able to get a cable tidy - a sort of plastic hank holder that you could zigzag the wire round.

[IanBland]

At the risk of sounding like an old fart, the present day absence of basic knowledge that when I was young "every dad was expected to know" is thoroughly depressing. It seems to be a combination of the mantra of "leave it to a qualified person" and the plague of the moulded plug.

[ms660]

My dad didn't know how to wire a plug, however he could lay bricks like nothing else, each to their own maybe

Lawrence.

[AC/HL]

Each to their own definitely.
I can have a go at most practical things, and do the odd one passably. Any of our "record player beginners" could have any conceivable skill which you or I could only dream of, but weren't necessarily born with the practical Gene.
What you could criticize is their not having the nouse to know when to back off and leave it to someone who does have it.

[ms660]

Well, to quote what someone else once said "Nostalgia ain't what it used to be"

It's all relative anywhichways.

If someone wants info or wants to give stuff a go, good on 'em, we've all been there, the main difference is today it's forums, in days of old it was some magazine or other to try and get a handle on things.

Anyways, that's me lot.

Lawrence.

[camallison]

Originally Posted by pwdrive

My dad didn't know how to wire a plug, however he could lay bricks like nothing else, each to their own maybe

The results of this chap's civil engineering weren't much better either - he extended his bungalow and the Building Control Officer condemned the best part of what he had done. So, he reluctantly paid a local builder to put it right - ended up demolishing and a total rebuild, because it was quicker.

The plug on the aforementioned cable was the screw together type and so no excuse there.

Colin

[dave walsh]

Sounds like a personal pride issue as with people who are not safe to drive but won't admit it. Some individuals have a morbid anxiety about electricity but maybe feel they should be able to tackle the problem Having said that I don't know about Civil Engineering but I could look up the fundamentals. To be honest I wish some of the recent posters were a little less fearless and a bit more more aware. I can't really understand a lack of even basic research!
Dave W

A friend of mine was married to a DIY averse Lawyer who decided to fit a "dimmer" switch and cut the wires too short. He gave up and went to the pub. When he came back and reached for the light switch He couldn't even sue anybody [He's alive but they are not together any more].

[trickie_dickie]

I like the title of this thread. It certainly caught my attention. I thought,
OH, NO. NOT ANOTHER ONE.
Good comments.

[TonyDuell]

Am I one of the 'recent posters' that are referred to above?

FWIW I have absolutely no qualifications in electricity, electronics, engineering or computing But then I think I realised long ago that there is almost no correlation between 'paper qualifications' and actually being able to do the job. This is something of a sore point with me, I object to being told I can't do something because I don't have the right bit of paper.

Incidentally, I could wire a 13A BS1363 plug before I started at school -- my father taught me -- and get it right to the extent of right wires on right terminals, earth wire with more free play than the others, cable clamp fitted and tightened and correct fuse cartridge (at that age I learnt 'Allow 4A per kW and use the next largest fuse')

[dave walsh]

No Tony absolutely not and I've just looked at your other posts to confirm that. Most of the "posters" start threads. You've only done that once and your level of input/knowledge generally seems to be well above zero [certainly better than mine] so you don't fit the case at all. I can't see what made you think that! Nobody is trying to tell you anything-re your sore point. Qualifications have never been mentioned and aren't at all expected anyway. You seem to be a reasonable chap, genuinely interested in vintage restoration activity so-no problem Check out the other thread if you haven't read it yet. Welcome to the Forum if it's not been said already.
Dave W

[Nickthedentist]

Originally Posted by dave walsh

No Tony absolutely not and I've just looked at your other posts to confirm that.

Seconded!

A lot of the people we're talking about also have the infuriating habit of starting a thread, getting loads of helpful responses, posting again (revealing that they've not understood or even read all of the replies), then disappearing completely.

We mustn't tar everyone with the same brush though. I can think of one or two "clueless newbies" who started their time here with a rambling and convoluted , 10+ page thread about a broken record player or radio, who have gone on to become very proficient, and become valued members of the forum.

N.

[Phil G4SPZ]

Skills and knowledge are gained over four basic stages, defined as:

1) Unconscious incompetence
2) Conscious incompetence
3) Conscious competence
4) Unconscious competence

We hope that we can quickly encourage new 'Dansette owners' to recognise they're in stage 1 and help them move into stage 2 as quickly as possible! Hopefully, many will stop there and head for the 'Restoration Services Wanted' section. A few may be genuinely interested, in which case we can help them move towards stage 3.

No-one seems to have picked up on my suggestion in the "Death Sentence" thread that Forum registration might be made subject to answering correctly a few basic technical questions. Anyone not passing this 'test' would only be allowed to post requests for restoration services. Clearly I have no idea whether the Forum software would support this, but at least one other online forum includes a technical test as part of their registration process. It strikes me that this would eliminate the bulk of the posts on which this thread is based.