Akai Cams. - Page 3 - UK Vintage Radio Repair and Restoration Discussion Forum

dave walsh · 23rd Jun 2010, 10:10 pm

Don't despair Roger-you did want the input

and mysteries are being resolved-sort of! Unless the final price is really high, I think I'd like a cam on a "just in case" basis [or maybe "just in case it fits something it shouldn't"]. You never know, they might become collectors items

.
Dave W

DOFFERY · 24th Jun 2010, 8:16 am

So we now have "two different cams" fitted to the GX 210D . I think your idea of SOR is the obvious solution Roger as the whole situation is becoming confused by the day. I will check my GX 210D again today to determine the type of cam, which was the same as your cam (ie 4000D etc.) last time I checked.

Any news on the other cam a member was in the process of manufacturing?

Colin.

Roger13 · 24th Jun 2010, 11:29 am

Hi Colin.

No news of the other cam. Who knows - if he's having the same experience as me/us he may be found swinging gently in the breeze, on the end of a length of twin flex....

Seriously though, perhaps we'll get an update soon?

Cheers,
Roger.

DOFFERY · 24th Jun 2010, 9:30 pm

Just to confirm Roger my GX 210D has the 4000D cam, ie,. your cam.!!!

Colin.

askhim8 · 25th Jun 2010, 8:01 pm

.......just to show i`m not kidding or exagerating, this picture is further away so you can see the three motors, you can still see the cam and it`s angle especially the locking screw.....same as GX-4000D...

DOFFERY · 25th Jun 2010, 11:38 pm

Quite agree Askhim 8, what is the serial number of the machine, mine is
k-20206 01266.

Seems we have the same problem as with the DS Mk1 & Mk11

Colin.

Roger13 · 26th Jun 2010, 10:11 am

Beam me up Scotty!

Roger.

Roger13 · 26th Jun 2010, 10:17 am

So, here we go again. Updated compatibility:

The new cam will fit the following:

4000D.
4000DS Mk 1.
SOME GX210D's............... (similar problem as with the 4000DS Mk1 & 2).
1721. (Thanks to 'askhim8' for confirmation).

The new cam may fit the 1720L with some minor adjustment, and according to Akai's part list it may suit the X201D, but this can't be guaranteed.

The new cam WILL NOT suit:

4000DS Mk2.
4000DB.
GX4000DS.
Still waiting on the engineer for the finished article and price.

In view of the confusion over 'what fits what', caused in part by incorrect official parts listings, I will be offering these on a sort of 'sale or return' basis to forum members where there may be doubts about compatibility.

Cheers,
Roger.

askhim8 · 26th Jun 2010, 12:05 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by DOFFERY

Quite agree Askhim 8, what is the serial number of the machine, mine is
k-20206 01266.

Seems we have the same problem as with the DS Mk1 & Mk11

Colin.

...the serial number on the GX-210D is k- 00435-00966

...and as per pictures of a DS Mk11 i have in pieces the cam is as GX-4000D...

DOFFERY · 26th Jun 2010, 1:21 pm

Not denying your picture Askhim , just trying to work some logic out on the model. By the way your cam looks a bit worn, is it catching on the bracket , or just a pic/blurb?

Bet you wish you had never started Roger!

Colin.

AlanBeckett · 27th Jun 2010, 1:01 am

Can I comment on a broader front? I know nothing about Akai Cams, or indeed the machines themselves, but I do know a lot about long life industrial equipment. From the Manufacturer's point of view he wants to keep supplying his Customers with Product that appears to be the same as always. This may not always be possible, hence the various 'fiddles' that happen. If you send the equipment back to the Manufacturer for repair, which often happens with Industrial euipment, there's no problem as they have all the Drawings and history, so they simply bring it up to date. However, once the product becomes obsolete, or the Manufacturer disappears, you're in trouble simply because the backup information isn't available. Put simply, you may never know which cams were fitted to which models over which periods.

Alan

Michael Maurice · 27th Jun 2010, 9:25 am

I would say just by checking and cross referencing the part numbers.

Though with one manufacturer, they used different part numbers for the same part!

askhim8 · 27th Jun 2010, 11:14 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by DOFFERY

Not denying your picture Askhim , just trying to work some logic out on the model. By the way your cam looks a bit worn, is it catching on the bracket , or just a pic/blurb?

Bet you wish you had never started Roger!

Colin.

......no, no, no offence meant, i am not that type of person, just putting up references to cams as it was asked for....i never noticed that the cam is actualy touching the side of the bracket, it all works smoothly so it was as is!!.....i may be getting a different model this week and it may prove even more interesting as we haven`t seen into this one just yet!....i think i may agree with others here as when a machine goes for a service or when other models appear they are not going to throw away all the spare parts they will do as they do for cars and have a 1.5 model, it is neither Mk1 or Mk11....there are many mistakes in the manufacturers service sheets...my own RtoR is a TEAC and the service manual is really disgraceful for such a reputable marque.........just my opinion.....

Roger13 · 28th Jun 2010, 11:26 am

Hello again.

Progress. I have heard from the engineer and the delay has apparently been due to the fact that the cam has to be machined twice to obtain the correct thickness. I have no idea what he means but it all sounded very convincing!

Anyway, he is talking in terms of around £9 - £10 per unit, due to the work involved. I have no intention of profiting from this project so that should be the price to you folks, plus postage of course.

I am awaiting a response from him regarding the numbers he is prepared to produce. When I get that information I will be in a position to post full details.

As previously stated I will offer them as a straight sale to those who know it will be compatible (see previous posts) and on a sort of 'sale or return' basis to those who are not sure. That will involve payment up front with a refund if it's not suitable.

I am hopeful that we will have some real movement on this very shortly.

Cheers,
Roger.

askhim8 · 28th Jun 2010, 4:29 pm

.....this one will make sure !!!!......just opened up this Akai X-1800D 1973 circa and the cam on this is in absolutely pristine condition, so what does make these cams deteriorate?.... this one seems a mix between the GX-4000D with the same position of the high part of the cam and the screw position and the 4000D which has the roundish rear part of the cam.....

Roger13 · 29th Jun 2010, 1:20 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by askhim8

.....this one will make sure !!!!......just opened up this Akai X-1800D 1973 circa and the cam on this is in absolutely pristine condition, so what does make these cams deteriorate?.... this one seems a mix between the GX-4000D with the same position of the high part of the cam and the screw position and the 4000D which has the roundish rear part of the cam.....

Hi.

Looks like it might be interchangeable with the 4000DS Mk2 cam?

Roger.

DOFFERY · 29th Jun 2010, 1:32 pm

Identical Roger.

Colin

Roger13 · 30th Jun 2010, 1:59 pm

Hi.

Right, progress! I have received the finished/updated prototype from the engineer. I shall be fitting it on my 4000D to make absolutely sure, but comparing it with my 'adjusted' original prototype it looks perfect. Further, the quality of the unit is outstanding, so no complaints on that front.

When I have confirmed the fit and price I shall be taking orders. Initial run will be #20 so first come first served.

Watch this space.

Cheers,
Roger.

Roger13 · 30th Jun 2010, 3:42 pm

OK.

All being well the cams should be available at the end of July. The run will be 20 initially and the price will be £10 each, plus p&p which should be minimal.

Considering the amount of work the engineer has put into this I consider that very reasonable indeed. I am making no profit from this project so you will be getting them at cost + postage.

I'm assuming that the moderators would prefer not to have the forum cluttered up with ordering details so I would suggest that if you are in the market for one of these you send me a PM and I'll get back to you with details. For now though, here is the most up to date compatibility list:

The new cam will fit the following:

4000D.
4000DS Mk 1.
SOME GX210D's............... (similar problem as with the 4000DS Mk1 & 2) - thanks Colin.
1721. (Thanks to 'askhim8' for confirmation).

The new cam may fit the 1720L with some minor adjustment, and according to Akai's part list it may suit the X201D, but this can't be guaranteed.

The new cam WILL NOT suit:

4000DS Mk2.
4000DB.
GX4000DS.
X-1800D.

As already stated, in view of the confusion regarding compatibility, if you are unsure whether it'll fit I will supply on a trial basis - you buy it and if it's not right I will refund less postage. I think that's fair?

Cheers,
Roger.

Station X · 30th Jun 2010, 4:47 pm

As suggested by Roger please conduct all negotiations by PM.

23rd Jun 2010, 10:10 pm	#41
dave walsh Dekatron Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Ramsbottom (Nr Bury) Lancs or Bexhill (Nr Hastings) Sussex. Posts: 5,817	Re: Akai Cams. Don't despair Roger-you did want the input and mysteries are being resolved-sort of! Unless the final price is really high, I think I'd like a cam on a "just in case" basis [or maybe "just in case it fits something it shouldn't"]. You never know, they might become collectors items. Dave W

24th Jun 2010, 8:16 am	#42
DOFFERY Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Blackpool, Lancashire, UK. Posts: 1,488	Re: Akai Cams. So we now have "two different cams" fitted to the GX 210D . I think your idea of SOR is the obvious solution Roger as the whole situation is becoming confused by the day. I will check my GX 210D again today to determine the type of cam, which was the same as your cam (ie 4000D etc.) last time I checked. Any news on the other cam a member was in the process of manufacturing? Colin.

24th Jun 2010, 11:29 am	#43
Roger13 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Wrentham, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 508	Re: Akai Cams. Hi Colin. No news of the other cam. Who knows - if he's having the same experience as me/us he may be found swinging gently in the breeze, on the end of a length of twin flex.... Seriously though, perhaps we'll get an update soon? Cheers, Roger.

24th Jun 2010, 9:30 pm	#44
DOFFERY Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Blackpool, Lancashire, UK. Posts: 1,488	Re: Akai Cams. Just to confirm Roger my GX 210D has the 4000D cam, ie,. your cam.!!! Colin.

25th Jun 2010, 8:01 pm	#45
askhim8 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Kent, UK. Posts: 25	Re: Akai Cams. .......just to show i`m not kidding or exagerating, this picture is further away so you can see the three motors, you can still see the cam and it`s angle especially the locking screw.....same as GX-4000D... Attached Thumbnails

25th Jun 2010, 11:38 pm	#46
DOFFERY Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Blackpool, Lancashire, UK. Posts: 1,488	Re: Akai Cams. Quite agree Askhim 8, what is the serial number of the machine, mine is k-20206 01266. Seems we have the same problem as with the DS Mk1 & Mk11 Colin.

26th Jun 2010, 10:11 am	#47
Roger13 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Wrentham, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 508	Re: Akai Cams. Beam me up Scotty! Roger.

26th Jun 2010, 10:17 am	#48
Roger13 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Wrentham, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 508	Re: Akai Cams. So, here we go again. Updated compatibility: The new cam will fit the following: 4000D. 4000DS Mk 1. SOME GX210D's............... (similar problem as with the 4000DS Mk1 & 2). 1721. (Thanks to 'askhim8' for confirmation). The new cam may fit the 1720L with some minor adjustment, and according to Akai's part list it may suit the X201D, but this can't be guaranteed. The new cam WILL NOT suit: 4000DS Mk2. 4000DB. GX4000DS. Still waiting on the engineer for the finished article and price. In view of the confusion over 'what fits what', caused in part by incorrect official parts listings, I will be offering these on a sort of 'sale or return' basis to forum members where there may be doubts about compatibility. Cheers, Roger.

26th Jun 2010, 1:21 pm	#50
DOFFERY Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Blackpool, Lancashire, UK. Posts: 1,488	Re: Akai Cams. Not denying your picture Askhim , just trying to work some logic out on the model. By the way your cam looks a bit worn, is it catching on the bracket , or just a pic/blurb? Bet you wish you had never started Roger! Colin.

27th Jun 2010, 1:01 am	#51
AlanBeckett Rest in Peace Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Burton upon Trent, East Staffordshire, UK. Posts: 1,686	Re: Akai Cams. Can I comment on a broader front? I know nothing about Akai Cams, or indeed the machines themselves, but I do know a lot about long life industrial equipment. From the Manufacturer's point of view he wants to keep supplying his Customers with Product that appears to be the same as always. This may not always be possible, hence the various 'fiddles' that happen. If you send the equipment back to the Manufacturer for repair, which often happens with Industrial euipment, there's no problem as they have all the Drawings and history, so they simply bring it up to date. However, once the product becomes obsolete, or the Manufacturer disappears, you're in trouble simply because the backup information isn't available. Put simply, you may never know which cams were fitted to which models over which periods. Alan

27th Jun 2010, 9:25 am	#52
Michael Maurice Moderator Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Wembley, Middlesex Posts: 7,225	Re: Akai Cams. I would say just by checking and cross referencing the part numbers. Though with one manufacturer, they used different part numbers for the same part!

28th Jun 2010, 11:26 am	#54
Roger13 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Wrentham, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 508	Re: Akai Cams. Hello again. Progress. I have heard from the engineer and the delay has apparently been due to the fact that the cam has to be machined twice to obtain the correct thickness. I have no idea what he means but it all sounded very convincing! Anyway, he is talking in terms of around £9 - £10 per unit, due to the work involved. I have no intention of profiting from this project so that should be the price to you folks, plus postage of course. I am awaiting a response from him regarding the numbers he is prepared to produce. When I get that information I will be in a position to post full details. As previously stated I will offer them as a straight sale to those who know it will be compatible (see previous posts) and on a sort of 'sale or return' basis to those who are not sure. That will involve payment up front with a refund if it's not suitable. I am hopeful that we will have some real movement on this very shortly. Cheers, Roger.

28th Jun 2010, 4:29 pm	#55
askhim8 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Kent, UK. Posts: 25	Re: Akai Cams. .....this one will make sure !!!!......just opened up this Akai X-1800D 1973 circa and the cam on this is in absolutely pristine condition, so what does make these cams deteriorate?.... this one seems a mix between the GX-4000D with the same position of the high part of the cam and the screw position and the 4000D which has the roundish rear part of the cam..... Attached Thumbnails

29th Jun 2010, 1:32 pm	#57
DOFFERY Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Blackpool, Lancashire, UK. Posts: 1,488	Re: Akai Cams. Identical Roger. Colin

30th Jun 2010, 1:59 pm	#58
Roger13 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Wrentham, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 508	Re: Akai Cams. Hi. Right, progress! I have received the finished/updated prototype from the engineer. I shall be fitting it on my 4000D to make absolutely sure, but comparing it with my 'adjusted' original prototype it looks perfect. Further, the quality of the unit is outstanding, so no complaints on that front. When I have confirmed the fit and price I shall be taking orders. Initial run will be #20 so first come first served. Watch this space. Cheers, Roger.

30th Jun 2010, 3:42 pm	#59
Roger13 Retired Dormant Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Wrentham, Suffolk, UK. Posts: 508	Re: Akai Cams. OK. All being well the cams should be available at the end of July. The run will be 20 initially and the price will be £10 each, plus p&p which should be minimal. Considering the amount of work the engineer has put into this I consider that very reasonable indeed. I am making no profit from this project so you will be getting them at cost + postage. I'm assuming that the moderators would prefer not to have the forum cluttered up with ordering details so I would suggest that if you are in the market for one of these you send me a PM and I'll get back to you with details. For now though, here is the most up to date compatibility list: The new cam will fit the following: 4000D. 4000DS Mk 1. SOME GX210D's............... (similar problem as with the 4000DS Mk1 & 2) - thanks Colin. 1721. (Thanks to 'askhim8' for confirmation). The new cam may fit the 1720L with some minor adjustment, and according to Akai's part list it may suit the X201D, but this can't be guaranteed. The new cam WILL NOT suit: 4000DS Mk2. 4000DB. GX4000DS. X-1800D. As already stated, in view of the confusion regarding compatibility, if you are unsure whether it'll fit I will supply on a trial basis - you buy it and if it's not right I will refund less postage. I think that's fair? Cheers, Roger.

30th Jun 2010, 4:47 pm	#60
Station X Moderator Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ipswich, Suffolk, IP4, UK. Posts: 21,289	Re: Akai Cams. As suggested by Roger please conduct all negotiations by PM. __________________ Graham. Forum Moderator Reach for your meter before you reach for your soldering iron.