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Old 10th Dec 2019, 2:00 pm   #1
Spencervs
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Default Rothermel bed heater

Hey guys! I have this Bakelite bed heater and opened it up to find.... a ton of damaged asbestos acting as a form for the element!

I chucked this away very carefully and washed everything. How can I remake the element? Does anyone know a good replacement or alternative? I still have the asbestos in a tied bag on the balcony until I know how to dispose of it, so I could salvage the wire too? Or is there a unit that could just fit inside? I like the idea of using this.
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 2:58 pm   #2
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Ooh! That looks nice - like an electric hot-water bottle.

No idea how to restore it, but I hope you get lots of responses and manage to get it working again!
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 3:13 pm   #3
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

3mm? thick Cement Fibre Board as used in the building trade may be suitable.
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 3:24 pm   #4
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Another thought. You might be able to use the Mica? material material from say a Dualit toaster element.
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 3:29 pm   #5
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

I don't think I would try to use it - not worth the risk of burning your house down. There are plenty of electric blankets with modern safety features if you like that sort of thing.
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 4:06 pm   #6
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Quote:
I still have the asbestos in a tied bag on the balcony until I know how to dispose of it
Do you want to think about that statement for just a minute?

If the material that you have removed from that heater is indeed Asbestos (very likely) then the action of removing it, and unwinding the wire will have exposed you to the dust.

Just leaving it in a tied bag on a balcony is hardly the right thing to do.

might I suggest that you get it disposed of in a professional manner now, so as not to expose anyone else to the risk of this material.

I would also echo Paul's advice - I rather think that your house insurance would suffer in the event of a fire caused by this device.....
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 4:51 pm   #7
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Well, I don't know. I am not a purist, and it's risky now to say the wrong thing, but my mum's garage roof is asbestos cement and it doesn't keep me awake at night. I am sure there is a risk and it must be treated with respect, particularly, with that stuff, when disturbing it. My local tip used to have a skip for the roofing sheet. I would ask at your's if they have a system for it. As to using the heater .. I use a Belling electric bed warmer with a 40W bulb in, and it is excellent. I don't see why this couldn't be made usable safely. So far as risk is concerned we are rather inconsistent - we live in a society which almost totally lacks the precautionary principle, and whole nations deny global warming.
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 7:44 pm   #8
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

A length of tracer heating tape?
 
Old 10th Dec 2019, 8:28 pm   #9
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Lots of alternative heaters here if your purse will stretch to it. Here for example.

https://www.omega.co.uk/guides/heaters.html
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 8:48 pm   #10
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Williams View Post
Quote:
I still have the asbestos in a tied bag on the balcony until I know how to dispose of it
Do you want to think about that statement for just a minute?

If the material that you have removed from that heater is indeed Asbestos (very likely) then the action of removing it, and unwinding the wire will have exposed you to the dust.

Just leaving it in a tied bag on a balcony is hardly the right thing to do.

might I suggest that you get it disposed of in a professional manner now, so as not to expose anyone else to the risk of this material.

I would also echo Paul's advice - I rather think that your house insurance would suffer in the event of a fire caused by this device.....

I know this may be seen as "elf 'n' safety gone mad" by some but I'm afraid I agree with it 100%, both on the electrical safety side, but especially on the asbestos side. People don full body suits (that are subsequently decontaminated or disposed of) these days to avoid the risks of this stuff. There is documented evidence of people suffering serious and life ending disease from just being around people who were exposed to this stuff in the building trade (dust brought home on clothing and shoes).

The water is under the bridge with respect to what you have already exposed yourself to but please don't increase your risk further, or expose others to risk. Please seek expert advice on how to move forward. Aside from the material in the bag, there may also be dust in the vicinity of where you unwound the element.
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 9:40 pm   #11
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

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Originally Posted by evingar View Post
Please seek expert advice on how to move forward. Aside from the material in the bag, there may also be dust in the vicinity of where you unwound the element.
Don't do that. You might find your house or flat taped off prior to decontamination, which could cost a fortune and you'd probably lose the bed warmer as well.

Check your local council's website and see what asbestos disposal services they offer.

Last time I had some asbestos to dispose of the local council wanted to charge me £28.00. I found a contractor with all the correct paper work who did the job for £20.00.

The council's fee at present is £85.00.
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 10:08 pm   #12
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

My council will now take away small quantities of asbestos for free.
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Old 10th Dec 2019, 10:14 pm   #13
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

How about the glass element in a food warmer tray that keeps the dishes warm during dinner?

All else fails I may have some resistance wire that would do if purely for cosmetic purposes and not being used in a bed.
PM me when you know what you need.

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Old 10th Dec 2019, 11:03 pm   #14
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Smile Re: Rothermel bed heater

How about a sheet of aluminium with metal clad resistors screwed on with some thermal grease underneath them. As the wattage required is not that high you could then get away by operating it on say 24V DC from a power supply which would be safer.

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Old 10th Dec 2019, 11:38 pm   #15
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Doesn't need to be a DC power supply- a simple isolating stepdown transformer would be fine.
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Old 11th Dec 2019, 2:41 am   #16
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

wow thanks for all the replies! I know I shouldn't have removed the asbestos. It was a bit of a failure to recognise that there was a high potential of running into it given the period of the item and purpose. Once I opened it up it was a case of already being committed, so I was super careful, wore a mask and VERY tactfully removed it and made sure to wash everything gently and thoroughly. Of course I will get it professionally taken away asap, so thanks guys

I really like the idea of using the metal clad resistors and a small transformer to get lower voltages... would this be the safest option? Does anyone have a circuit in mind? I definitely would need a thermostat or something similar to cut off the power to avoid any accidents!
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Old 11th Dec 2019, 10:24 am   #17
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Just out of interest; did you check the element for continuity before you opened it up?
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Old 11th Dec 2019, 10:43 am   #18
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

I can hear the 'Blues and two's in the distance. Really, do you want to risk a house fire just to use a dangerous bed heater? Your house insurance policy will probably be null and void if disaster occurred. By all means keep it as a bit of history but actually use it..No! John.
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Old 11th Dec 2019, 10:58 am   #19
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Using a low voltage supply will be safer than using full mains, but you still have the problem that hotspots can develop causing smouldering and sometimes fires. That's why commercial electric blankets run much cooler than decades ago and have mandatory overtemperature protection. If lashing up some homebrew solution you will finish up with something that either runs too cool to be any use, or potentially develops hotspots.

I like using nice old artifacts too, but in this case I don't think it's worth the risk and hassle.
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Old 11th Dec 2019, 10:58 am   #20
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Default Re: Rothermel bed heater

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancs Lad View Post
Ooh! That looks nice - like an electric hot-water bottle.

No idea how to restore it, but I hope you get lots of responses and manage to get it working again!
I think that type of heater was quite common in the late 1930's - 1940's.

When I was very young we had a pair of "Veret" bakelite bed warmers. I checked online and their pic's come up. They worked quite well as I recall
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